[QUOTE=threemae]
tagos, you’re a real douchbag. The pit is the least regulated forum on the boards and if people want to fucking hijack a thread with a touch of reality, you’re in no position to get your panties in a bunch over it.
[/QUOTE]
Hear hear. Beautifully put.
[QUOTE=threemae]
tagos, you’re a real douchbag. The pit is the least regulated forum on the boards and if people want to fucking hijack a thread with a touch of reality, you’re in no position to get your panties in a bunch over it.
[/QUOTE]
I’d just like to add that I am also not in a position to get his panties into a bunch.
[QUOTE=Little Plastic Ninja]
Only slightly on the subject – Der Trihs, you might enjoy reading Small Gods if you haven’t already.
[/QUOTE]
By Terry Pratchett?
[QUOTE=Mellivora capensis]
By Terry Pratchett?
[/QUOTE]
Yup. Good stuff.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
Yup. Good stuff.
[/QUOTE]
Thanks.
[QUOTE=Excalibre]
Honestly, asking this question about Islam and not about, say, Catholicism (though they’ve admittedly toned that down in the last couple decades), Judaism, or Hinduism reflects an awful degree of ignorance.
[/quote]
Given that the OP was about a tradition in Islam, how does my question about Ramadan and its tenets of fasting etc., reflect “an awful degree of ignorance”?
[QUOTE=Excalibre]
If you want to know why fasting is such an integral part of many human traditions, you’re going to have to broaden your perspective; it stands to reason that probably all these different religions find the same value in it.
[/quote]
Religious people fast for no other reason than to appease their deity of choice. It is done either as a form of penance to atone for sins they believe they committed knowingly or otherwise, or esle to ask for favours.
[QUOTE=Excalibre]
Well, the fast is broken at night. My suspicion is that this tradition arose to prevent people from dying of starvation or thirst.
[/quote]
You seem to have missed my question. To ask again, my query was
Of course I understand that the fast is broken to avoid death from starvation. My question though is why is the recommendation to keep the pleasures at a minimum missing. I can understand permitting food to be eaten after sunset. Why allow sex after sunset and prohibit it during the day? How does not having sex for 12 hours a day help in spiritual enlightenment of any kind?
[QUOTE=Excalibre]
I recommend you take it up with Muhammad.
[/quote]
Perhaps you are not aware, but the observance of one month of fasting predates Islam and Muhammed, in which case it is unlikely that Mihammed would have the answer either.
[QUOTE=Anaamika]
And see what happens to you…your mind sometimes does focus a little more clearly and you think a little different. I’m not saying you come to any sort of higher purpose but it is an interesting experiment.
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I don’t see the purpose in conducting sucn an experiment. I don’t think medical science recommends fasting as a solution to anything. And since I am atheist, I do not think avoiding food is going to do me any good, either in terms of focussing or helping me think any different.
[QUOTE=Angua]
When you start the fast, you recite what’s known as a “niyat” or intention that you will keep the fast, both physically and spiritually. If you do something unintentionally, such as have a wet dream at night, or say, if you have a medical emergency and need medication,
[/QUOTE]
I misread this the first time as “if you have a medical emergency and need masturbation”. It caused an interesting double take, to be sure. In my brain a little ER doc was yelling “I need 10 ccs of KY, stat!”
[QUOTE=Miller]
I think metabolism might have a heck of a lot to do with that, too. You might not need more than one meal a day to function normally. Other people might need more, and have different experiences than you do when they lower their calorie intake to match yours.
[/QUOTE]
I guess what I’m saying and the purpose of posting is not to refute others or to talk about my dietary habits, but to say that the fasting of Ramadan to me seems to represent a test of willpower, rather than a way to have a different enlightenment. Because most people do eat almost continuously through the day (some of my co-workers complain of feeling faint and being “close to passing out” in the afternoon because of that “interminable” 5 hours between lunch and dinner…good grief) then one purpose of the fasting must be to show that when you choose to, you have the willpower to resist temptation.
Since I have that willpower with respect to food, the fasting of Ramadan would mean little to me. I would have to have some other trial during that time period to appreciate and show respect, yes? Otherwise, you might say that every day is Ramadan for me…I know of no “alternate trials”, but then I’m no religious scholar either. Plus being a diabetic, I would be exempt (from what I understand) anyhow.
[QUOTE=wisernow]
Religious people fast for no other reason than to appease their deity of choice. It is done either as a form of penance to atone for sins they believe they committed knowingly or otherwise, or esle to ask for favours.
[/QUOTE]
What makes you such an authority on it? How is it you’re qualified to tell me why I do what I do? Does your ability to read my thoughts end there or can you tell what I’m thinking right now?
Little Plastic Ninja, thanks for the book suggestion. Bought it last night, brilliant, I haven’t snerked so much for a long time.
[QUOTE=Angua]
Actually, the notion of fasting extends to more than just not eating or drinking during the hours of daylight. You’re also supposed to remain “pure of spirit” during the whole month, which includes stuff like not picking fights, going out partying, and yes, masturbating. Additionally, having sex during the hours of daylight would also render your fast invalid. Basically, the entire point of Ramadan isn’t deprivation, its a time for reflection and meditation; the fast just serves to remind you of the fact that there is more to the world than the material aspect.
[/QUOTE]
Believe it if you will. But if this is true, why is it that someone has to even ask whether they are allowed to use their asthma inhaler?
It’s religious tradition ie claptrap. Sure, there’ll be some people who take it deeper, but for the average Joe it’s just following a whole raft of nitpicky rules in order to show one’s belonging to the group that has those rules.
I used to play the same games as a kid, involving rules about bicycles and skateboards and white lines and cracks in the footpath. The most charismatic kid gets to say what the rules are. He usually wasn’t so good at surrounding his arbitrary rules with woo woo as adult charismatic kids are.
[QUOTE=Dead Badger]
Awwww, someone ruined your hilarious joke by injecting a hint of realism.
[/QUOTE]
Religious ritual is “realism” now?
Just out of curiosity, how do you masturbate like a motherfucker?
[QUOTE=Princhester]
Religious ritual is “realism” now?
[/QUOTE]
Yes, that’s exactly what I meant, and how awfully perspicacious of you to point it out. It’s a filthy religionist construct, this “context” thing, and you’re right to ignore it.
[QUOTE=rayh]
Just out of curiosity, how do you masturbate like a motherfucker?
[/QUOTE]
Ask Oedipus what he does when he’s alone and lonely.
[QUOTE=DocCathode]
What makes you such an authority on it? How is it you’re qualified to tell me why I do what I do? Does your ability to read my thoughts end there or can you tell what I’m thinking right now?
[/QUOTE]
No I do not claim to know your thoughts. There are always exceptions that prove the rule.
However, if you are indeed religious and observe fast as a part of following the diktat of your relgion, I see no reason other than the ones I stated.
If you have any other, please enlighten me.
[QUOTE=Dead Badger]
Yes, that’s exactly what I meant, and how awfully perspicacious of you to point it out. It’s a filthy religionist construct, this “context” thing, and you’re right to ignore it.
[/QUOTE]
I see your context and raise you one.
I know what you meant. I saw the context that you saw. I also saw the greater context, which in my view created a degree of irony.
[QUOTE=Princhester]
I see your context and raise you one.
I know what you meant. I saw the context that you saw. I also saw the greater context, which in my view created a degree of irony.
[/QUOTE]
And I’m, like, totally scoured by your searing insight.
Say … I don’t s’pose you’ve got any commandments? It’s just I’m between religions at the moment and you seem awfully clever.
You’re being, like, sarcastic, right?
I see your sarcasm and raise you one