James Randi calls time on the $1 million dollar prize ...

Can I start by saying, Great Og On a Bicycle, it gets tiresome having to read through page after page of total dreck to be able to discuss this topic. I think that those who respond bear about 48% of the blame, and they are people who should know better.

No one has produced convincing proof in any range and not for lack of trying. There have been studies looking for small effects. The results of some studies have shown very slightly positive results, but they have tended not be replicated and are more likely to be anomalies or evidence of testing artifact than anything. At this point in time, there is simply no need to throw money away on this. We need a cure for cancer. Why the hell would we bother investing time and money in research looking for something there is no reason to think exists, and which past research shows does not?

The only thing worth testing or debunking at this stage of the game is the **claims ** made by paranormalists. That subset of paranormalists who make claims to have micro powers is so small and so irrelevant as to be safely ignored. In reality, paranormalists make claims of highly significant powers.

Indeed, paranormalists do not (in the overwhelming majority) test themselves under controlled conditions in multiple iteration tests, so even if they had an ability in the micro range they’d never know it.

I have seen criticism of Randi’s tests (on these boards and elsewhere) along the lines that they only look for gross powers that the paranormalists in question have claimed to have, and it could be that there are some small effects but his tests are too crude to detect them. While this could in theory be true, as a criticism it simply makes no sense to me.

Paranormal effects are not predicted by any scientific theory. There is no reason to postulate them based on known science. The only reason to test for them at all is because claims are made. There is no need to test for anything other than what is claimed.

I’m from Queensland. What Southerners do is none of my concern.

The whole point is we don’t know what Randi is/has been doing. I have never seen any information on a single test and the outcome. Perhaps you could find some.

I have posted links in this thread of research on psychic ability that have definitely shown there is psychic ability. As I have said only a small minority think there isn’t.

Tell me where I can look at these tests. I want to see them instead of just hear about them. Cite:

And what conclusion should we draw from this? Certainly not that spiritualism has any basis in fact! A large percentage of the public believes that UFO’s are piloted by extraterrestrials; is that any reason for me to believe it as well?

Boy, was that the wrong question to ask!

I can’t believe I read this whole thing. It saddens me to think that Lekatt is probably going back to his favorite “X-treme supernatural” message board and claiming that he is kicking some major skeptic ass. As for a look at an MDC test all the way through, it took one minute to find this on YouTube. I’ve seen several MDC challenges on PBS as well. They were all “either you can predict the correct answers or you can’t”, type challenges. There was no wiggle room in the challenge for ambiguity.

Now, can you imagine having to go through all those applications for ten years, listening to some of those most nonsensical claims you could possibly imagine? I don’t blame Mr. Randi for wanting to hang it up. I’m surprised he kept the test going for as long as he did.

Alright, lekatt, you’ve made a claim I can actually address:

How about we take a quick look at every link you’ve posted in this thread? Here is a comprehensive list:

MDC app. Not evidence.

http://www.noreenrenier.com/ (referenced twice)
An extremely biased source. If I tried to prove Randi was not a fraud by referencing his own site, I’m guessing you wouldn’t accept that as proof, so why should I do the same for you? And even so, the only “evidence” is a dozen vague testimonials. Okay, there are also a few personal interest stories referenced, but I’m not going to unearth them and slog through them for some worthless anecdotes. Not evidence.

I got 27% for 40 guesses. Woo! I must be psychic. Not evidence.

http://aleroy.com/albums/thumbnails.php?album=9
Some pictures of your yard after an ice storm. Some of them are kind of pretty, but they don’t exactly prove anything. Not evidence.

Okay, this one is actually a bit interesting. The article itself is mostly rubbish. It attempts to refute a bunch of skeptical arguments, mentioning various bit of information that would help its case. The problem is it fails to directly reference the data, forcing to reader to paw through many other sources to try and find the supposed data. Anecdotes simply don’t cut it. Some of the sources, though, are actually fairly interesting. Some of those studies actually apply the scientific method to learn more about NDEs. I’m reluctant to give you credit for this, since the article itself isn’t evidence, but it’s close enough. Evidence.

http://www.mynews.in/fullstory.aspx?storyid=1628
New Age-y philosophical ramblings. Not evidence.

A wee bit biased, hmmm? If you think we should take this as evidence, a quick link to the JREF website should be more than enough rebuttal from the skeptic side. I looked through some of the articles linked on the site, but could find nothing that wasn’t highly biased and anecdotal. Not evidence.

A video spelling out the “prove a negative” challenge? Nothing new, nothing informative. Not evidence.

This article is rather nonsensical. From what I can tell, it’s trying to predict what percentage of people will be good psychics based on some sort of star chart? Not evidence.

More of Zammit’s blathering. Not evidence.

http://kwc.org/mythbusters/2006/09/episode_61_deadly_straw_primar.html
Finally, some evidence! Unfortunately, it’s for the skeptical side of the argument. Not evidence (at least for you).

A video of a photographic anomaly. Exactly what this is, I can’t say for sure, but I bet if we got a photography expert to comment on it, he would have some interesting things to say. Admittedly, though, despite the fact that this is not good evidence, it is at least sort of on the right track, since it is actually something that can be discussed. Generously, I will call this evidence.
So, two links that could (generously) be considered evidence. By any objective measurement, you have entirely failed to provide evidence that “definitely” shows psychic ability. When Bayard actually tried to engage you on the the topic, you dismissed him out of hand rather than engage. Your personal anecdotes and things that you remember on TV are not evidence. If you cannot provide serious information, then I really don’t think there’s anything to discuss.

Garula, a simple “No you haven’t” would have just as much effect on lekatt as your post will. But I applaud the effort.

I believe Garula understands that such posts aren’t for the benefit of lekatt. They are for the benefit of those who don’t know of his history here. Otherwise, to a newbie it looks as if he is providing tons of actual evidence, and all we are doing is saying, “Nuh uh!”

A bug crawling on the front glass of the security camera, illuminated in blue by the blue sign on the front of the store.

What he posted is his opinion only, what I posted at least in part, is solid evidence researched by accredited scientists. I don’t really expect skeptics to change any of their theories and opinions. However, the average person looking at this thread would understand that I am providing tons of actual evidence and it is being labeled wrong. Good observation.

Saying this over and over will not make it true.

One of the things that was really apparent to one who loves cameras as I do is the relative size of the object. If it were a bit of fluff or a bug, it would get a lot smaller as it moved away from the camera. It doesn’t do that, in fact on the windshield it gets larger. If I were a skeptic and wanted to assign a physical source to the thing I would say it is more like a blue LED light coming from a flashlight, but even that would show relative size and be much bigger on the camera lenses than it is. Not just any explanation is good enough for thinking people.

No, it doesn’t have to, it is already true.

Skeptical opinions don’t alter truth in the least.

You are mistaken. Willfully, defiantly mistaken.

No more about the fuzz on the camera, because it has absolutely nothing to do with the MDC, and thus is off topic.

It’s not moving towards or away from the camera. It’s crawling on the camera. Probably not on the actual lens, but on a glass cover on the front of the camera housing.

Oops. This wasn’t there when I posted my reply. Sorry. OK - no more (unless lekatt fancies discussing it in another thread dedicated to the topic)

My opinion? Are you serious? You can’t even be bothered to defend your “evidence”? You can’t even be bothered to tell me why you think I’m mistaken? As everyone except you can see, you have utterly failed to provide even a shred of solid evidence. I’m sorry, askeptic is exactly right, simply saying something is true doesn’t make it so.

And perhaps more on the topic, out of the “evidence” you did provide, not a single iota backs up your claim that Randi is dishonest or that the MDC is a fraud. Not a SINGLE bit. I must also point out, if I am wrong then it should be extremely easy to prove it by providing a link or a quote or SOMETHING verifiable. If we should accept your claim that Randi is a fraud, then why shouldn’t the converse be true about your beloved psychics?

Do you actually want to persuade others to your side of the argument? Because it seems to me like you just want to sit there smugly, wallowing in self-satisfaction.

For the sake of playing devil’s advocate (and to provide an example of how to provide evidence) I found this article to be somewhat interesting: The Lancet: Near-death experience in survivors of cardiac arrest. Basically, the article looks at near death experiences in cardiac arrest patients, controlling for various physiological conditions and finds that the number of reported NDEs remains relatively constant. The conclusion being that if physiological reasons cannot explain NDEs, then spiritual reasons should be considered.