Personal attacks again?
and Czarcasm is a moderator, shame, hey I paid my money.
When the facts run out the PA’s begin?
Love to you all.
Of course not. I said nothing about you personally. Just your worldview. If you’re going to peddle bullpuckey, you better be able to deal.
I bet George Roden would be surprised to hear that.
If I meet any self-styled critics, I’ll let them know. Good day.
“Thank you. Up is down, left is right, fact is fiction, and dreams are reality in lekattLand…”
Maybe you forgot you put my name in your criticism, so I posted it here for you.
And I had hoped this board would outgrow the need for the Pit. Well I guess I was wrong again, heh.
Love
Cite!
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/r00.html
Scroll down to Roden, George.
or just go to google and give the name in. It gives plenty of results, including a place to sign up with the Branch Davidians.
Why don’t you read it and find out for yourself. What a surprise that you would refer to a different conspiracy theory to support your convictions of conspiracy in this case.
I lived in Waco during the seige, watched an hour long news special every single night of the seige, read hundreds of reports during and after the seige and watched the inferno live on TV. I have also toured the former Davidian compound (not the one in the seige but rather the compound in Waco that the Davidians moved out of in the 1960’s which is now the Vanguard College Prep School), and I have visited the site of the seige on more than one occasion. Intersestingly enough I have personally spoken with Michael McNulty, the leading personality in the conspiracy theories surrounding this event. He stayed for over two weeks at a hotel at which I worked when he came to film segments of his “documentary”.
Everything on my (Stonebow’s) list has been proven with mountains of physical evidence, hundreds of eyewitness accounts, investigations by top forensic scientists, and confessions by the participants themselves.
We aren’t. We are hasing over the knowable (actually the known).
I know. I was one of them. This has nothing to do with the validity of Stonebow’s list.
Wrong. There were numerous events. In 1987 Koresh himself and seven of his followers were arrested and tried for a shootout involving automatic weapons. At the time of the seige three Davidians were serving prison sentances all for violent acts (one for threats of violence). There were dozens of complaints a month to the local sheriff from Koresh’s neighbors. Also I hope that you really don’t think that child rape is not harmful. Gril, 14, Tells Of Rape at Davidian Compound
Our country never allowed for the freedom to rape and molest children or possess illegal firearms and explosives; it never allowed for the freedom to plan terrorist plots. Thank God.
This has nothing to do with opinion – this is to do with fact. You are allowed to have the opinion that certain undeniable facts aren’t true – but no one will take you seriously.
And on a personal note. If you have a penchant for conspiracy theories then this is not the issue for you to glom onto. There is way too much irrefutable evidence in this case, and in the end the person whom you end up defending was a sick, evil man, an abomination to all that is good in the world of men. Thanks.
Heh. I missed this. This is irony of the first order, given the source.
You seem to be defeating yourself here. If you want to accuse Reno of doing something wrong, as you do in your first post here, then you are going to have to venture into some aspect of the known.
Not mention it seems a little silly to come in, make accusations that require at least some “knowns” to be proven: and then when people present evidence that not only refutes your needed “knowns” but actually support a different case, you start complaining that we are “hashing over the unknowable.” You seem to want to have things both ways.
I said many Americans blamed Reno. I did not say I blamed Reno.
Posting here is a waste of time.
Love
The main theme here is that many Americans watched on television while helpless, innocent children were being burned alive. Now if any of you thinks that was ok, given any set of circumstances then I feel sorry for you. I would tell you how that feels, to watch, but I doubt any would understand. The whole incident didn’t have to happen and the people watching knew that. Enough said.
Love
Yes, by coming into a thread specifically concerning the culpability of Reno for the events in Waco, and posting ambiguous, irrelevant assertions you won’t even defend or seem to understand the meaning of yourself, you have wasted our time.
Of course, you’ve said things like this before. MANY times before. And yet you keep posting. Another contradiction?
My answer was clear and precise, but I will summerize it for you.
Because millions of people watched the live television feed of this event, and saw children being burned alive in the senseless attack on the Davidians, they blamed Janet Reno for the unnecessary loss of life. She bungled the whole thing in their opinion. There you have it.
Did I mention the ATF “hit” squad was forever banned from attacking anyone again. Now they have to call on the FBI or some other org. to do it for them.
If you want to defend the killing of innocent children over a “supposed” cache of weapons (never found) please feel free to do so. I prefer not to.
Love
Are you deliberately ignoring the fact that the innocent children were also being raped and/or abused by the Branch Davidians?
And, lekatt, if you want to accuse the government of killing innocent children over a proven cache of of weapons(would it hurt you to actually look at the links provided, or do facts disturb your worldview :rolleyes: ) without providing any evidence whatsoever, feel free to do so. Those who understand the purpose of this board* would probably prefer not to.
*Fighting ignorance since 1973-(It’s taking longer than we thought)
You seem overly concerned with my world view, why?
The NRA experts search the ruins and could find no evidence of illegal guns. I did not accuse anyone of killing children, you see the act of children dying was enough to upset millions of people. The congress was swamped with letters and calls denouncing the deaths. That was why they did an investigation of the facts.
I don’t think you misread my posts on purpose, although it is common on this board. Most just try to prove what they already believe instead of seeking truth.
As for fighting ignorance, my opinion is your looking in all the wrong places.
But I will bow to your superior intelligence, and quit the thread. It is not necessary for me to place blame on anyone. When they cross over all blame will be sorted out in truth.
Love
It’s so much easier to imply blame, then move on when called to produce evidence, isn’t it?
BTW, I’m not overly concerned with your worldview, except when it conflicts with reality.
Lekatt, you yourself said “If you want to defend the killing of innocent children…”
The other posters here have been defending the government’s actions. Do you admit to implying that government actions amounted to “the killing of innocent children”? How did we “misread” your post?
Ah, yes…I’m sure they let these ‘NRA experts’ onto the crime scene while the bodies were still smoking. Did it ever occur to you that relevant evidence would have bagged up and kept by the legal authorities involved? Denying that Koresh had a cache of weapons is absurd, especially considering that his ascension to the leadership of the Waco group was marked by an armed takeover, the wounding of his predecessor, and his trial for attempted murder (he walked due to a mistrial.
And I do understand your point about why people might be mad, because of the footage of the fires and the fact that children died because of the siege. However, I am of the opinion that it’s a miracle that we were able to save as many as we did. Koresh is the clear villain here. If the ATF can be faulted for anything, it’s for playing into his hands and allowing him to martyr himself.