In order to more directly compete with the Big Three US automakers’ Pickups, Nissan and Toyota developed and marketed the Titan and Tundra, respectfully.
However, the Chevy/GMC 3500, Ford F-350, and Dodge 3500 pickups have an optional turbodiesel for heavy-duty applications.
Elsewhere in the world, diesel applications are fare more prevalent than in the US.
Does Nissan and Toyota have an optional turbodiesel in the works for their full size pickups?
Well as seems to be the case with most automakers, the vehicles they sell in Europe and outside North America have diesel engines available as as common option.
Toyota for example offers a 2.5 liter common rail turbodiesel engine for their compact pickup trucks:
And has diesel options for most other vehicles as well. It’s just one of those quirks that North American consumers keep getting the short end of the stick when it comes to having choices.
“Full size pickups”, like “Full size Sedans”, is really a category that only exists in North America and Australia. There is no market anywhere else in the world for the kind of behemoths that roam the streets of the US - who would buy it? What on earth would they use it for? They wouldn’t fit down the streets of most European and Asian cities, and even out in the country, the largest utility vehicles anyone could possibly want would be considered “compact” by North American standards. As of now, both Toyota and Nissan make their full sized trucks in the US, and AFAIK sell them in substantial numbers only in North America.
Another thing to consider is diesel fuel. Even small diesel sedans are pretty rare in the U.S. Why? I don’t know, but having to drive my ex-girlfriend’s mom’s mercedes diesel around a few times made me realize that not every gas station sells diesel. Again, I don’t know why, but the inconvenience of having to look for a place that sells diesel probably impacts the market for diesel engine vehicles. It’s a chicken or the egg thing.
Another thing to consider is diesel fuel. Even small diesel sedans are pretty rare in the U.S. Why? I don’t know, but having to drive my ex-girlfriend’s mom’s mercedes diesel around a few times made me realize that not every gas station sells diesel. Again, I don’t know why, but the inconvenience of having to look for a place that sells diesel probably impacts the market for diesel engine vehicles. It’s a chicken or the egg thing. i.e. Is diesel fuel not sold because there’s no cars to burn it, or are there no diesel cars on the road because the fuel isn’t everywhere?
A 2.5L diesel isn’t a heavy duty pulling engine though. I’m sure it’s a fine engine, but it’s just not going to be comparable to the 6.7L Cummins option in the Dodge, the 6.4L Powerstroke option in the Ford, or the 6.6L Duramax option on the GM. You drop these engines into pickups for pulling of large stock trailers, etc.
Diesel availability is a red herring. It may not be sold at every gas station (particularly in urban areas), but it’s not hard to find.
Well, they exist in Australia, but they are fairly rare and tend to be driven by enthusiasts. A really large US-style one will still turn heads here. Most “pickups” (we don’t use the term here) are still car-sized “utes”, usually 2WD. The larger 4WD vehicles tend to be passenger-only and fully enclosed, and used by suburban families. They do sometimes come in truck style, but they’re not as big as the American ones, generally.
Indeed. And during the times I’ve been to Europe I have seen full size American style pickups (Fords and Chevy’s) on the streets. Most recently during a road trip from Hamburg to Amsterdam via the Afsluitdijk, where I saw a couple. However, unlike their American counterparts the ones I saw were being driven for a specific purpose, i.e. they were either full of cargo or towing something rather large and heavy behind them. They’re not something the locals would take I imagine to the local AH or to the mall to buy a litre or two of milk
Most gas stations in Chicagoland have them (except the ones directly in the downtown loop area), and ditto for the entire state of Iowa. It may be an inconvenience to some, but it’s not impossible to those determined to get some.
Now this UTE I remember. I’ve seen what it and its competitor from Ford can do (others can too, just watch a few clips on Youtibe). \ I can’t possibly imagine why GM and Ford are so stupid to not consider selling them here. What American hot rodder wouldn’t want one of these babies, RWD, and powered by a 5.7L V8 engine? Popular Mechanics ran an article not too long ago about Holden vehicles and implored GM to bring them here, but I guess GM wasn’t listening.
And BTW, regarding trucks in Europe being smaller (i.e. the full-sized models not being mainstream): Most Europeans don’t perform the same type of duty as people do here. They generally don’t have to rip out tree stumps or tow Montana from point A to point B, or haul back a pallet full of groceries from the local Sam’s Club
The Japanese certainly know how. Izuzu designed the Duramax diesel used in Chevy pickup trucks.
They will probably get with the program in a few years. It has only been a few years now that the japanese have even offered gasoline powered full sized pickups The T-100 was no great shakes, but Toyota did much better with the Tundra.
Transmissions are an issue. Diesels put out loads of torque, and few have heavy enough flywheels to smooth out the torque pulses. This puts extreme loads on the transmission gears and bearings. After 20 years or so, the american mfrs. seem to be getting a handle on this and supplying transmissions beefy enough to stand up to the engines they are mated to.
While not every station sells fuel oil, finding it has never been a real problem. One reason they don’t is that cleaning up spills is a never endingd battle. Spilled gasoline cleans itself up.
The Japanese mfrs have astutely, IMHO chosen to focus on a specific segment of the U.S. fullsize pickup market and don’t try to offer basic work trucks, heavy duty models, or nearly as many combinations of body styles, engines, etc. as the Big Three (I have no idea what their product lineups are like outside the US, so some of the following may be completely wrong).
For example, there is a lot of profitability in the well-equipped to loaded 4x4 extended cab 3/4-ton market, and that is how most Tundras and Titans are optioned. There is no equivalent heavy duty or “3500” big brother to get a hand-me-down diesel engine from. Furthermore, very few of these trucks are ever used for heavy towing or other applications where a diesel engine has a clear advantage. The majority are essentially used as very nice manly looking big cars. If Toyota can put the same engine in this truck as well as a Lexus LS sedan and big SUV, they save an enormous amount of development costs.
The Big Three, on the other hand, sell everything from stripper 2WD regular cab work trucks through heavy duty models in tens of thousands of combinations. The gas and diesel engine choices are numerous and developed over glacial time scales. It’s relatively easy to drop the diesel engine which is needed for the heavy duty work models into the bread-and-butter 3/4 ton model.
This scenario is unlikely to change in the near future as Toyota and Nissan already have a desirable position of making one product very well and selling it at a high price. Developing a more heavy duty version would probably be inadvisable as there would be enormous up-front costs to develop these trucks. they’d probably only be viable in the U.S. market, many customers purchasing heavy duty and/or stripped work trucks shop on price or via bids, and let’s face it, though they may be built in the US with UAW labor, xenophobia and pro-USA/union attitudes are still very strong among the target market.
In Australia, Toyota, Nissan, and Mitsubishi offer a wide range of models with an even wider range of body, engine, and other specifications for the light commercial market. I assume they wouldn’t bother doing it here either if we weren’t right-hand drive.
It’s interesting you mentioned xenophobia too (in the bit I didn’t quote). The situation here is that outback Australia is generally where you’ll find the racist redneck types, but on the other hand the people that live there need very reliable vehicles, and the Japanese manufacturers (esp. Toyota) have that reputation. So, our rednecks have opted to be practical, and they tend to drive Toyotas.
I just had a quick look to confirm. The largest vehicles Toyota and Nissan (and Holden and Ford, for that matter) sell in Australia, e.g. The largest Toyota Landcruiser and Nissan Patrol, both have towing capacities of 3,500kg. The kind of trucks that the OP is talking about, e.g. Chevy Silverado 3500HD, has a towing capacity around 7,200kg -7,500kg, depending on model. Where I live, people who wear ties and work in cubicles commonly drive these things downtown to their workplaces.
We like to pack big lunches around here, you understand.
Of course, according to the UAW, the reason why Ford/GM is failing is because they’re not allowed to sell these things in Japan.
The light commercial market is global while the fullsize market is pretty much U.S. only.
BTW as a long time Toyota PU owner, I practically drool when I have the opportunity to visit a country where the more exotic Hilux models roam about.
Perhaps my statement was a bit too broad. I was merely trying to support my opinion that a new U.S. fullsize pickup diesel engine offering by a Japanese mfr is very unlikely by offering examples of the reasons why Japanese mfrs might not wish to develop lines of heavy duty and work trucks to compete in the U.S. market.
I did not intend to imply that the American mfrs offer a substandard product or poor value. Quite the opposite, I think that the Americans have been doing it so long and are now doing it so well that there is little to be gained for the Japanese to try and compete in these markets. However, I don’t think anyone would argue that they have exercised a smart business strategy and identified a comfortable niche of people who are willing to buy a “foreign” make of fullsize pickup and pay a good price for it, whether that be for lots of options or perception of better Japanese reliability.