Of course because he had a deep voice, accent, and a manner of speech not vaguely similar, but practically identical to the Kingfish. What part of that statement was unclear to you? I was not commenting on the content of Boss Nass’ dialogue or his actions. Your assessment of my sanity may well be unerring, but not for the reason you stated.
Well, you have me there, my friend. I don’t have a soundtrack handy, nor did I take notes and compare them to my Stepin Fetchit dictionary. I do, however, have cognitive capabilities and a reasonable ear for accents and phraseology. If you disagree with my overall impression, why not just say so?
[BLOCKQUOTE]Have any of you people ever actually heard an actual Jamaican person speak, or instead heard only comedic sterotypes of such?
[/quote]
A. Yes. B. JJ Binks is a very good example of the latter, imho, thank you.
I’ll say it again. I was not offended, but I certainly see why some people are. Is that really so difficult to understand? It’s the very reason you can’t pick up Little Black Sambo at the library anymore, and TVland did not immediately make a bid for those Amos and Andy episodes. Get with the program, folks.
[Note: This message has been edited by Nickrz]
[Note: This message has been edited by Nickrz]
If I see a character in a movie that is clearly not Jewish, and this character is shown to be cheap, and I say “Hey! That character is cheap like a Jew!”, who is associating cheapness with Jews, me or the film?
Jar-Jar is not a black human. If a person sees negative behaviour in a non black character, and accuses the character of being a black stereotype, then THAT PERSON is the one associating that negative behaviour with blacks, not the film.
I’m not trying to call these people racist, I think they are the opposite; they are protesting racism, or think they are. But they are going too far on this. By complaining about Jar-Jar, they are actually the ones implying blacks have this stereotypical behaviour, not the film. With good intentions, they are actually perpetuating the racism.
I’ve already fought this battle in another thread, so I’ll only add this one thought:
What kind of filmmaker (especially one caterring to a mass audience) releases a movie without first considering how it might be interpreted (or misinterpreted) by its viewers?
These perceived steretypes (more than one, remember) make George Lucas look like a very sloppy producer next to someone like Spielberg who went to extraordinary lengths with “The Prince of Eqypt” to avoid such controversy.
Film makers should not have to go to extraordinary lengths to appease political correctness.
Spielberg was dealing with actual human characters, so there are actually people of the race of his characters to offend.
I doubt Lucas could have predicted that alien creatures are subject to racism accusation, or that he’d have to somehow think up accents that don’t sound like ANY accent on Earth. I certainly never would have predicted it.
Alright, I’ve finally seen the movie and am ready to comment. All in all, The Phantom Menace was a pretty good movie, but it’s nowhere near the first three films. About the supposed stereotypes, IMO:
I don’t see Jar Jar as especially stereotypical. When describing Jar Jar, the words that come first to my mind are “cartoon-ish” and “silly”, not “evil racist stereotype”. He is obviously meant to appeal to the little kids. But apparently, the PC-police only want blacks (and alleged “symbolic” blacks) to be shown in positions of leadership, or not at all. I bet that’s real inspirational to all of those young Af/Am’s who can’t count on being the leader of an army, or becoming a Jedi Master ;).
The Trade Federation aliens are asians, Only green. They act like the steroetype of the sinister Oriental businessman and talk like characters in a Godzilla film.
Watto has no accent that I can identify. I know what Italians, Arabs, and Jews sound like (I’ve known members of all three groups), and I failed to ID Watto’s speech as any one of those. IMO, Watto is just a generic sleasy character.
“I had a feeling that in Hell there would be mushrooms.” -The Secret of Monkey Island
Dice, brace yourself, but you and I agree almost completely. I still maintain that if Jerry Lewis had voiced Jar Jar Binks, a lot of uptight people would have nothing to complain about.
I both agree and disagree about the Trade Federation. Agree, because the sound designers did say they based their speech on tapes of non-Americans learning to speak English; disagree, because they were originally going to make those characters CGI, and decided just before shooting to make them animatronic masks, so the lip-sync was way off. (As a result of the last-second decision, actor Silas Carson plays three roles in the move: the co-pilot of the ambassadors’ ship at the very beginning, the Viceroy, and the Jedi who sits on the other side of Yoda and has a speaking role.)
Nickrz, I still disagree with you about the Boss Nass/Kingfish thing. I’ve heard enough old Amos & Andy tapes to formulate an opinion. You may as well pick any other large, deep-voiced person with whom to make a comparison.
{{Watching the Star Wars, I immediatly identified Jar Jars accent as sounding kind of Jamamacan. I could easily imagine him being long dreadlocks instead of long floppy ears. His posture, lanky features and gesturing reminded me a lot of the comedian Chris Rock (who is black). I also imediately noticed that Jar Jar is NOT black he is clearly Orangish Green, and clearly alien. What I completely fail to see is why this could possibly be offensive?}}
Yes! I got jumped on in another forum for saying that I thought Jar Jar sounded Jamaican by people saying that I was just looking for something to be offended by. WHEN DID I SAY I WAS OFFENDED?? I think the accent was largely based on a Jamaican accent, but the only reason it bothered me was that it was distracting. I guess I felt that either they shouldn’t make accents an issue, or they should make NEW accents that weren’t related to earth, otherwise it was distracting, and made the back of your head go “now why would the trade federation guys sound Chinese?” and so on. I agree with whoever said it was a lack of creativity. I didn’t see anything offensive or racist in any of it.
Here’s a characterization of Jar Jar that would work against the idea that he is a Jamaican stereotype of some kind.
Okay, now Jar Jar has a Jamaican accent, but his personality seems to be ripped off from the series Gilligan’s Island. Like Gilligan, Jar Jar gets in the way and is extremely annoying. Looking at Jar Jar from this angle, one realizes that he is not a racial stereotype, just a really annoying character that no one wants to see in either Episodes II or III.
“[He] beat his fist down upon the table and hurt his hand and became so
further enraged… that he beat his fist down upon the table even harder and
hurt his hand some more.” – Joseph Heller’s Catch-22
About the Asian sounding Trade Federation: Go back and wtch the original Trilogy. Now, listen to the imperial chracters. Most of them sound British, so why isn’t(didn’t?) anyone complian then?
Chaos When you are courting a nice girl an hour seems like a second. When you sit on a red-hot cinder a second seems like an hour. That’s relativity.
Albert Einstein
Well, Obi-wan sounds British, too.
So does Qui-Gon in the new trilogy.
“[He] beat his fist down upon the table and hurt his hand and became so
further enraged… that he beat his fist down upon the table even harder and
hurt his hand some more.” – Joseph Heller’s Catch-22
I guess none of you took the time to notice that Lucas sends an Irishman (Liam Neeson) and a Scotsman (Ewan McGregor) to save teh universe. Considering the stereotypes for these, I think Lucas did a pretty good job of overlooking stereotypes!
I didn’t see the flick, and may never see it, but a good friend of mine, an extremely intelligent person who is no uber-sensitive alarmist, told me he was a bit uncomfortable with the JarJar bit as having connotations of a black slave. Of course, there was no shame, per se, in being a black slave (dem foakes habbin no choss in de matta).
Just thought about something, you guys said that all the bad guys in the first movies were British. I hate to break it to you, but almost everyone was British except Hamill, Fisher, and Ford. The movies were made in England.
“So, he wears makeup and has a girl’s name; isn’t that original!” - Alice Cooper, about Marilyn Manson
That includes 3PO, a character considered to be a stereotypical homosexual.
“[He] beat his fist down upon the table and hurt his hand and became so
further enraged… that he beat his fist down upon the table even harder and
hurt his hand some more.” – Joseph Heller’s Catch-22
What?!
Excuse me for a moment while I try to imagine C-3PO having sexual relations of any kind…
…
…Sorry, the image is just not forming. Have I missed a moment where he glares lustfully at R2? Who, exacxtly, is doing the considering here? Elton John? Ellen DeGeneris (sp)?
“I had a feeling that in Hell there would be mushrooms.” -The Secret of Monkey Island
Lord help us. It really wouldn’t matter one way or the other in what perceived accent any of the characters spoke, someone would undoubtedly cry foul. They are aliens, for crying out loud. Jar Jar is Jamaican? I’ve been to Jamaica. He’s no Jamaican. Watto is Jewish or Italian? He’s fucking blue and he has wings. What was E.T., Irish? He was short and drank beer, right? Perhaps Mr. Lucas should simply have aliens intonate blaring trumpets and provide subtitles. Oh, wait. Then the blind would be upset.
–Absolutley
It is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt. --Mark Twain