Jefferson and Sally Hemings

Slight mix-up: Thomas Woodson was another man who claimed to be a son of Thomas Jefferson and Sally Hemings. Madison Hemings made no mention of him, nor is there any mention of him in the accounts at Monticello, but his descendants had the oral tradition they were descendants of Jefferson and Hemings. DNA of a male line demonstrated they are not. Sally probably never had a son named Thomas Woodson.

It has not been conclusively proven- nor can it be- that TJ was the father of any of Sally Hemings’ children; all that has been proven is, as mentioned above, a male line Jefferson was the father of her youngest son, Eston. HOWEVER, the combination of

1- Oral histories
2- Circumstantial evidence
3- DNA testing

combines to make it far more likely than not.

A major significance of the DNA finding of Eston Hemings’ descendant is that it disproved the official story of Jefferson’s legitimate descendants. Two of his grandchildren, addressing the rumors of Sally, ‘confided’ (probably with every intention of it getting out) that the fathers of her children were Peter and Samuel Carr, Thomas Jefferson’s nephews by his sister. By testing the Jefferson male lineage (the Y chromosome line) this proved that neither Carr brother could possibly have been the father, because they did not have the Jefferson Y-chromosome (not unless TJ’s sister was committing adulterous incest with one of her brothers or male cousins anyway, which has never been even a rumor [though their cousin Nancy Randolph… well, that’s another story]). This, as you can imagine, was a major validation for the Hemings’ descendants and major egg in the face of many of the staunch deniers of Sally’s significance.

The most significant oral history is of course Madison Hemings, who went on record beginning in the late 1860s and then in the 1870s gave several interviews. However, before that, his brother Eston had moved from Ohio (where he lived on property adjoining Madison’s after they left Virginia) and actually took the surname of Jefferson (he’d always used Hemings before). His grave reads E.H. Jefferson. He also began living as a white man in Wisconsin; his own son, John Wayles Jefferson, named for TJ’s father-in-law who was the grandfather of Sally Hemings’ children [that Sally was Martha Jefferson’s half-sister was never disputed]) served in the Union army as a white man. (Picture of him.)

Madison Hemings has descendants but they could not be tested for the Y-line as his male line died out with his grandsons. Interestingly, while Madison identified as mulatto in the Census and legal records and in his official accounts stated he had “more of the African” about him (i.e. more black features) than his siblings, his sons also served as white men in the Union army. One died at and is buried at Andersonville. One of his grandsons, who imo bears a resemblance to TJ, was Frederick Madison Roberts, a successful mortician who was the first black man elected to public office in California.

What became of Eston and Madison’s older brother, Beverly, and their older sister, Harriet, is unknown. Madison said that they officially “ran away”, but in a nudge nudge wink wink sort of way; TJ allowed them to ‘run away’ and gave them a small amount of money and never actually looked for them. This syncs with the records of Monticello; at the same time TJ records them as runaways there are disbursements of $100 in cash (a lot of money at the time of course, but certainly no fortune- TJ was notoriously cash poor however) and it’s unrecorded what it’s for, which is something that almost never happened. Jefferson recorded every penny in his ledgers, even money that he lost or misplaced (literally- there are entries for “misplaced $2”, often followed by “found it” later on).

This account was echoed by Edmund Bacon, a former overseer at Monticello, who stated that he personally drove Harriet to Charlottesville to catch a stage to Philadelphia. Madison said she ended up in D.C., married a white man, and had a family who, to his knowledge, did not know of her parentage. He knew her married name and corresponded with her sporadically but chose to protect her privacy. He said his brother Beverly also lived in the metro D.C. area but they had long lost contact.

The biggest discrepancy in Madison’s account is that he stated his mother became pregnant by Jefferson in Paris when she was a teenager and he was in his 40s. There is no evidence of this; if she did become pregnant then she must have either miscarried or had a stillbirth, because her first recorded child was not born until five years after her return to Virginia. (The contract Jefferson gave Sally’s brother promising him his freedom if he would return to Virginia [which he did not have to do- he could have stayed in France, and he knew it] survivesand is at the L.O.C..)

Among the strongest circumstantial evidence is that Sally Hemings never conceived when Jefferson was away from Monticello, and he was a way for months at a time. Also, none of the male Jeffersons are known to have been at Monticello nine months before the births of Madison and Eston. It is unknown whether Sally accompanied Jefferson when he traveled to his summer home at Poplar Forest, but he definitely took her sons with him, which is significant because unlike Monticello he did not entertain at Poplar Forest and was extremely particular who accompanied him; it was a refuge and a sanctuary for him. (This is not to imply he had a father-child relationship with any of Sally’s children; per Madison he did not- he was kind to them, but they didn’t call him ‘Papa’ and he didn’t acknowledge them even within his family, but it was a very open secret.)

At least one other former slave from Monticello, Isaac Jefferson, recalled Sally in detail, and said it was an open secret that she was Jefferson’s concubine. Most plantations had a pretty good gossip-intelligence line, and it’s doubtful Sally would have tried to hide it.

Sally’s brothers (particularly James) and sisters were also interesting. One oddity is that some of her nieces and nephews were literally “white slaves”. Under Virginia law, if you could prove 7/8 Euro ancestry, you were legally white; it did NOT make you free, but you COULD legally marry a white person, and at least two of Sally’s nieces did. One married a Jewish businessman in Charlottesville, and another married a fairly well to do attorney who purchased her so that he could marry her. All of the slaves freed in Jefferson’s will were members of Sally’s family (including two of her sons).

Another piece of circumstantial evidence is the freeing of Sally herself. Per Madison, he gave her freedom in Paris- basically a verbal agreement her children would be freed when they became adults (and he kept his word- he did not free all of her nieces and nephews, but he did free all of her children, by manumission or by looking the other way when they ‘ran’) and that she would be free upon his death. He in fact did not mention her in his will, and she was not formally freed by his daughter or any other member of his family or anybody else. HOWEVER, she was living free in Charlottesville a few months after his death.

This is remarkable considering that slaves less valuable than she was- including several members of her own family- were auctioned off. (Sally herself was appraised at $50 in an estate inventory, but never sold.) Sally’s siblings and nieces and nephews and grandnieces/grandnephews were sold to the winds with the rest of Jefferson’s slaves who weren’t freed, but Sally basically went to Charlottesville and lived with her sons. (TJ’s creditors would also have been within their legal rights to dispute the manumission of Madison and Eston, both of whom would have been many times more valuable than their mother, but did not, nor did they challenge the 4 other slaves he freed in his will.)

Interesting thing about the Hemings family is some were almost completely black as well. Sally’s grandmother was black- Madison said her name was Susanna and he believed she was from Africa- and her daughter, Betty, was the daughter of a British sailor who tried to buy her and, when the owner wouldn’t sale (or Hemings didn’t have the money) he tried to steal her, but ultimately she remained the property of her owner. Betty had several children by a black slave before becoming the concubine of her master (actually her mistress’s husband, because she was dower property), John Wayles, the man mentioned above. (Wayles had terrible luck with his white wives; he outlived three by the time he was in his 40s.) She and Wayles had 6 children together, and when he died she had another child by another white man and another child by another black man- 13 or 14 in all. Thus she had grandchildren who were so black you couldn’t tell they had any European ancestry and grandchildren who were so white you couldn’t tell they had any African ancestry.

Anyway, Annette Gordon Reed’s books on Sally and her family are extremely thorough and will answer any questions you have on this fascinating family. And if really interested there are several great websites; you can also tell a definite resemblance between some of Hemings’ descendants and TJ, including
I’m not familiar with any written stories of Sally H. before Callendar’s, but that’s not surprising. It could well have been word of mouth. It may bear mentioning that Jefferson was the subject of numerous rumors that weren’t true; he and John Adams were damned near whoremasters when in Europe by some accounts that Jefferson laughed at and Adams was appalled by but few people then or now take seriously. The great love of his life after his wife seems to have been Maria Cosway, an Anglo-Italian artist he met in Paris. She was married (her husband was probably gay going by descriptions of him) and it’s unknown if they physically consummated the relationship, but they corresponded for the rest of TJ’s life.

See post #4. Almost every white-male landowner/slaveowner in the South (and, we may presume, all the way up to New England, in the early days when slavery was legal there) used slave women as concubines and everybody knew it.* Do the historians you speak of also dismiss that?

  • Everybody knew it but nobody was supposed to talk about it – antebellum Southerners raged against Uncle Tom’s Cabin on the grounds that it touched on matters, true or false, of which ladies should never read.

That was brought up on the CSPAN program. Apparently the scientific journal Nature was about to rpeort on the DNA testing when they found that they were going to be scooped. They rushed out their article “Jefferson Fathered Slave’s Last Child”. The presenter was particularly critical of such a definitive title in a “scientific” journal.

This isn’t a link to the original research, but it’s a report about it:

Thank you. This was very interesting.

That particular test probably underestimates the number since, I think, they are only looking at the Y chromosome. But other studies have shown a similar pattern-- most blacks who think they have Native American ancestry don’t. But almost all blacks (in this case, African Americans, descendants of African slaves in the US) have some European ancestry.

No, they don’t. Your point being? I’m not in the camp that claims Jefferson didn’t father children with Hemings. You asked why it’s debatable and I’m telling you why. i.e. It was debatable because people didn’t want to face the truth.

Here’s the big liberal conspiracy clip.

Picture of anotherof Sally’s grandsons in which you can see a strong Jefferson resemblance.

My parents, both of them history teachers, told me as soon as I was able to understand what an illegitimate child was that Thomas Jefferson had illegitimate children with a slave. It was totally accepted by them, though you were not allowed to mention Sally at Monticello at the time. Today Monticello has gone full circle and will address her in depth, though you’re asked not to ask the tour guides in the house about her (this being because in the house tours are done in groups and there are children and easily offended adults present, whereas outside they can walk away). I actually wrote a thread about itwhen I went to Monticello for the first time since the 1980s.

The deniers basically point out several things, only the first of which has any merit:

-That her children could have been fathered by any male Jefferson
Technically this is true, but in more than 200 years since Callendar’s piece went public it’s odd that none of Jefferson’s brothers or male cousins were ever mentioned as alternative fathers, only his nephews

-That Jefferson was 65 years old when Eston Hemings was born
*True, but that wouldn’t make him the oldest man, or even the oldest president, or even the oldest Virginian president to father a child [Tyler’s youngest was born when he was 70]
*
-In addition to being old Jefferson was in ill health when Madison and Eston were conceived
He had health problems, like most men in their 60s, but that didn’t mean he was an invalid, besides which he had always been prone to hypochondria. His [white] grandchildren remembered him chasing them, climbing trees with them, and playing ball with them in his 70s; his health didn’t really collapse until he was in his late 70s/early 80s. There’s no reason to think he was impotent. (Again, just limiting it to presidents: Grover Cleveland was obese, diabetic, a cancer survivor, AND older than Jefferson when his last children were born and their paternity has never been disputed.

By far the weakest arguments are that he wrote about how he thought blacks were inferior (in the first place Sally was barely black and in the second Jefferson was a hypocrite) or that he would have considered it immoral (unlike owning hundreds of slaves- oh wait, he wrote several times he considered that immoral). To me it would seem far more ridiculous that a healthy virile middle aged man- one who wrote passionate love letters and even confided an indiscretion with a friend’s wife- decided to become celibate for the last 35-40 years of his life, which if you discount Sally would seem the alternative after Maria Cosway. However, with a young concubine to take the edge off, being a widower wouldn’t have been so bad, especially since by tradition his wife- who had a terrible relationship with her own stepmother- begged him not to remarry on her deathbed as she didn’t want her daughters raised by another. (Particularly selfish request considering she was a widow with small children when she married T.J…)

It may be complete coincidence, but one thing Fawn Brodie pointed out was that when Jefferson took a trip to Amsterdam around the time his affair with Hemings traditionally started he complimented the art work of Adriaen van der Werff, somewhat to the dismay of his Dutch host who consider van der Werff a hack. This is the painting that Jefferson would have most likely seen: Sarah presenting Hagar to Abraham (i.e. an aging man’s beloved wife gives him her slave as concubine). Remember that Sally was Jeffersons’ wife’s slave [part of her dowry] and half-sister and much younger; no idea if there’s any significance and no way to prove it one way or the other, but it is a fun Freudian theory to play with.

It can be safely said that many did, but almost every is impossible to prove or disprove. I don’t dispute it was an extremely common practice, but wouldn’t attempt to postulate whether it was the norm or just a very large exception.

Mary Chesnut’s famous comment

is a very powerful statement, but not the result of a study. (She herself was childless; I’m guessing her husband wasn’t.)

Let’s not forget that not only was Sally, herself, the daughter of a slave/master sexual union, she was actually the half-sister of Jefferson’s first wife (her father was Jefferson’s father-in-law). And her mother was the daughter of a slave/ship captain’s sexual union.

So, Sally was 3/4 white and the half-sister of Jefferson’s first wife (aunt to their children). The story of her children and their paternity/racial status is very interesting, but it starts 2 generations earlier!

There are two movies about Sally Hemings-

Merchant-Ivory’s Jefferson in Paris, which like their other offerings is visually stunning, occasionally boring, and very art house in feel. Nolte’s Jefferson is a standout performance though, and it’s likely the only movie you’ll ever see in which Nolte plays James Earl Jones’ father.
Sally Hemings: An American Scandal- a two part TV miniseries. This one is highly fictionalized including a couple of particularly “oh I ain’t believin’ this” parts involving Sally sneaking off to D.C. and helping a runaway slave, BUT the surprising thing is how good most of it actually is. Sam O’Neill’s great as Jefferson, Diahann Carroll is a standout as Sally’s mother as is Mare Winningham as Jefferson’s daughter (who knows but will not admit she knows about the relationship) and they did an incredible job of reconstructing the constantly in flux Monticello and Jefferson’s legitimate family’s problems and decline into bankruptcy. One historical blooper is they do count Thomas Woodson as Sally’s son (he’s played by Jesse Tyler Ferguson, who currently plays Mitch on Modern Family), and I seriously doubt TJ and SH’s relationship was a romance like it was in the miniseries. (I’m sure they had feelings for each other since it’s near impossible not to be that intimate with somebody for 30+ years and not, but I would guess it was mostly a matter of mutual convenience: she got special privileges and freedom for her children, he got a pretty girl to keep his bed warm.)

Saw both of those, and pretty much agree with your analysis, Sampiro. But come on, there are dozens of movies where Nick Nolte plays James Earl Jones’ father! :slight_smile:

I do like the opening of Jefferson in Paris as it gives a great piece-by-piece demonstration of Jefferson’s brilliant copying machine.

She’s also character in at least two operas. One is called Sally Hemings, the other, Jefferson and Poe, a fictional romance between her daughter and Edgar Allan Poe.

Am I correct that there is no scientific evidence at all with regard to some of her six children?

re The Thomas Jefferson Foundation … one might assume there is a direct lineage to TJ and his estate. I don’t think that is the case at all. As such, the foundation likely has a mission that is free to evolve over the years.

Correct. Of her six known children, two died in childhood and their burial places are unknown and if her oldest son and oldest daughter had descendants then they are unknown. Madison had no male line descendants living in the late 20th century, so only Eston’s male line descent could be tested.

If any of Thomas Jefferson’s legitimate sons had lived and had male issue, it would possibly be easier to get a more TJ specific match. I don’t know this, but the question’s moot anyway as they didn’t, and I can’t imagine TJ’s remains being exhumed to get specific DNA samples.

Perhaps advances in genetic genealogy will allow a more thorough testing of Madison’s descendants in the future. As I understand modern DNA testing, suppose your four grandparents are the following:
paternal grandfather: J. J. Jingleheimer Schmidt

paternal grandmother: a member of the Thai royal family

maternal grandfather: one of FDR’s sons

maternal grandmother: Indonesian
If you are male then it would be possible to conduct a test for the Schmidt DNA; if you are not, then testing your closest male relative in the the male lineage would test for it.

Testing of your mitochondrial DNA would test positive for Indonesian ancestry, could be similar enough to prove you’re probably a member of your maternal grandmother’s kin group, but wouldn’t be a lot more specific than that since mitochondrial DNA changes very slowly (i.e. takes many generations to change significantly).

Even if you had 100% documentation of your ancestry and in fact you look just like your Roosevelt maternal-grandfather and your twin sister looks just like your Thai princess paternal-grandmother, there’s no current way to conclusively test for DNA in those particular lines. The most expensive DNA might say “you have certain sequences most common in people of Thai/Dutch ancestry”, but it’s not going to be enough to link you to the Thai royal family or the Roosevelt family beyond a vague possibility (i.e. you couldn’t get an inheritance based on that alone).

The male lineage is the most precise, especially for descent after several generations.

Probably not. The only reason they were able to do this in the first place was the extremely rare Y-chromosome in the Jefferson line. Any living descendants would just have that same chromosome as the living descendants of his male relatives that were used in the study. We don’t have the technology to do DNA paternity tests that many generations back. No Monel Williams show titled: Are you my baby’s great-great-great-great-great-great-grandfather?

You can also do similar tests in the all-maternal line (except that the bottom link in the chain can be male) using mitochondrial DNA. Though of course that’s not as interesting in this case, since maternal lines tend to be undisputed (or at least, considerably less disputed).

Genetic genealogy test results can gain you admission to certain Native American tribes if they test positive for ancestry in that tribe, though it’s a tribe by tribe basis and some tribes do not accept it and require alternative documentation. However, as with the Hemings descendants, it would have to mean that your mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s-mother’s line is of that tribe or your father’s- father’s-father’s-father’s-father’s-father’s-father’s-father’s-father’s-father’s-etc. line is. It’s impossible to test for any kind of cross-over line; if your father’s mother’s father’s mother’s father was Geronimo then genetic genealogy testing isn’t going to conclusively confirm or deny your Apache ancestry.

I saw a National Geographic special a few years ago about genetic genealogy testing being done on people at a street fair in the extremely diverse Astoria section of Queens. A testing of Y-line DNA of randomly chosen black American men did show that a fairly large percentage had European ancestry. This is not surprising since the vast majority of biracial children born in slavery had white father’s/black [or biracial] mother’s. However, while children born in slavery times to white mother’s and black (or biracial) fathers was probably less than 1% as frequent, it did happen more often than you might think, so there are probably more than a few black people in America who might be surprised if their maternal DNA placed their ancestry in Europe. (As I’ve said many times before, genealogy is a lot like gynecology in that you never know what you’re gonna find when you look up great-grandma.)

I’m frankly surprised that this many generations gone from Eston Hemings Jefferson and Fields Jefferson the DNA still matched. All it takes is one great-great-great-grandmother who was a swinger to totally screw up the descent, in addition to which adoption used to be a really informal affair before the 20th century and records weren’t always kept (especially when the orphaned child didn’t inherit property from their biological parents). Apparently though Fields and Eston had sons/grandsons/great-grandsons/etc. who married faithful women.

Thanks!! I do get the feeling that some pro-Hemings historians (who should know better and should be careful of their claims) make that relatively unsupported allegation

In the CSPAN program there was mention of add’l evidence being available. It would involve exhuming the body of a Hemings descendant but his descendants wouldn’t allow it unless TJ’s body was also. Would the TJF make the call (subject to legal rangling by other parties of interest)?

re masters procreating with their slaves … are there many provable examples of other prominent slaveholders with black descendants?

[QUOTE=What the … !!!]

re masters procreating with their slaves … are there many provable examples of other prominent slaveholders with black descendants?
[/QUOTE]

bolding mine

Not provable that I’m aware of; it’s expensive and time consuming to prove and it takes willing descendants from both sides of the family.

Alex Haley’s white ancestors weren’t that prominent (on his Y-chromosome sign), weren’t that prominent but that ancestry was confirmed by testing Haley’s nephew and one of his grandsons against members of his father’s father’s father’s [etc.] family from Alabama and from Ireland. Haley died long before this testing was possible but wrote in an essay how his white Alabama cousins gave a friendly “Well, you know how gossip is, great-grandpa wouldn’t do that” denial while in Ireland where the relationships were much more different people in that kingroup were overjoyed and inviting everybody to “come and meet my cousin the famous writer from America!”

Prominent men who were rumored to have children with their slaves include Francis Marion, James Madison (there was genetic testing here by a member of the black family who claimed descent and a descendant of one of Madison’s male relatives [he had no legitimate children] and there was no match), and George Washington (no proof and nowhere near as much oral history or written accusations or other documentation as Sally Hemings; I think most biographers believe he was sterile due to mumps [based in part on the fact Martha had 4 children with her first husband but never a pregnancy while married to George]). I would guess that “father of mulattoes” in the antebellum south was something like gay rumors of today. (Jefferson Davis was rumored to have children with a slave woman, but he was also rumored to have children with various American Indian women- did or didn’t, the allegation was probably a rumor; his older brother, who raised him and was basically a father to him, almost certainly had children with his slaves- he raised several illegitimate children whose mothers are erased from the record and I’m guessing they were born of light skinned slave women.)

George Washington’s father-in-law was said to have children with his slaves, some of whom were given to Martha as dowry and lived at Mt. Vernon. Robert E. Lee’s father-in-law, G.W. Parke Custis (Martha Washington’s grandson, raised by her and George) was rumored to have many children by his slaves [fifteen or more by one count] but to my knowledge there’s never been genetic testing and it would be difficult as, again, no male line descendants. (Like Washington, Custis freed his many slaves in his will.)