I’m looking for a new job, and will be required to provide references of past jobs. In one particular case, I did not leave in the most amicable of circumstances - I left 5 months after joining, for a variety of reasons all centered around job dissatisfaction.
While I have listed this job in my CV, I do not want to provide a reference from it, because I know it will be an unfavourable one. Is it OK to not provide such a reference, and what reason should one give for not providing it?
If I can decline to give a reference, would it be prudent to state the real reason why?
It’s my belief and understanding that you can put down the number and all the person checking your references can legally ask is “Did gouda work there during such-and-such a time?”
I think they can ask anything. Many companies will not answer with anything but the person worked there during the given time for fear of being sued by the new employer if an employee with a good reference turns out to be a dud or by the employee if a bad reference causes him or her to lose a job.
I don’t think it is required to give a reference from every employer. People you worked with might no longer be there, for example. If you describe the job on your CV, I think you are fine.
Does the application ask for a reference from each former employer?
You can provide any references you like. It is up to the employer what to make pf that. I have had 8 IT jobs in 8 years partly because I do some contract work but also because of layoffs.
Employers typicallly only want 2 - 3 references in my experience. I don’t even have references for half of my jobs either because the companies don’t exist anymore or I have lost touch with the people that know my work.
References are often a formality. I just started a new contract job and they were in a big rush to get somebody in the job. They could only locate one of my references before I started. They just told me last week (after three weeks on the job) that they need another reference and they didn’t really care who or what it came from. It was simply an HR requirement.
Employers typically don’t check references until they have some intentions of hiring you. I refuse to give mine out at all until it gets to that stage.
I agree with this, I’ve never heard of requiring a reference from every employer. I suppose if you were applying for a job involving law enforcement or national security the rules might be different though.
It’s pretty much understood you are only going to give as references people who will speak well of you. If a resume came across my desk where a job applicant had a five month tenure at a job I would try to get more details from the applicant but I couldn’t very well force him to give me the name of someone who worked there.
ISTR one career advisor telling people that if you stayed at a non-contract job less than six months not to even bother putting it on your resume because it would raise more questions than it was worth. That would be up to the individual of course.
Usually the request is for “a cover letter, resume and three references”. In that case, you can choose whatever references you would like and chances are that’s as far as they’ll go. They are a formality in the sense that you would almost always give references who are going to say something positive.
If you haven’t supplied the reference you haven’t given them permission to contact that reference and ethically they shouldn’t, and the old employer shouldn’t talk to them about specifics other than confirming that you work there during that time. Not to say that everyone sticks to that.
If they press you to explain why you left, describe the circumstances as neutrally as possible without reflecting badly on yourself or the employer.
Well, they’ve asked for references from my last three jobs, which incidentally is all I have anyway. I suppose I will simply decline to offer a reference from that one company. If they push for a reason, I’ll do what gigi suggests.
I am an HR person w/ 7 years’ experience and have been in your situation w/ regard to a short-term 3 month employment experience that wasn’t the greatest. There are 2 main practices related to resumes.
If this is a job application and they are asking for supervisors at your previous employers that they can contact for a reference, you should put it. Otherwise, a common HR practice is to assume the worst. Yeah, you didn’t like them and they didn’t like you, but did you steal, get fired for sexual harassment or set the building on fire? I assume the answer is no, but with my HR hat on screening resumes for an employer, I would assume maybe and keep on looking.
For academic and non-profit jobs, especially, they often ask for you to provide references. In this case provide the 3 people who will speak best of you, and there is obviously no need to provide anyone from this employer.
But on a job application, or a specific request for last 3 supervisors, those who don’t provide are often assumed to be hiding something big. Also, your former company may well have a policy of only providing verification of your dates of employment or similar information. It’s not that common for an employer to give a reference that goes into the exact personality conflicts you had with them.
A previous boss I had told me that there were only two or three things an employer can say about a previous employee.
Whether or not that person ever worked there.
Whether the person voluntarily quit or was terminated.
Whether or not that person is rehireable. And if not rehireable, they can’t give specific reasons why. For instance, if a person was fired for theft, they can’t tell a perspective employer why that person was fired. All they can say is that the person was terminated and is not rehireable.
If they give out any other information than that, they are getting dangerously close to crossing the lines of privacy issues.
In 40+ years I have had to list references on every application I ever filled out and not one of those references I listed were ever called.
When people who have worked for me put me as a reference, I got a couple of calls from their prospective employers.
I would confirm that yes, they worked for me at such&such place between date X and date Y.
If they were a good person/good worker, I would tell the prospective employer so, and talk them up a bit.
If they were not such a great employee/person, if the employer asked more about them I would say that because of potential liability, I cannot disclose any information about the quality of work they perform or their work ethic. My tone of voice usually got the message across. The employer would know exactly what I was implying and I’d get a “Ahh. Thank you for the information.”
When asked that question, I once replied, “Only if somebody were holding a gun to my childs head. And even then it wouldn’t be easy.”. I know what HR types say, but in the real world it is often different.
This is based on individual company policy, but there is no law that prevents them from saying more. There is some legal risk created by the potential for what they say to be construed as illegally discriminatory or for them to say something false that is construed as slander. Examples are: “well, she missed a lot of work for unusual religious holidays” or “He stole from us” (IF the company can’t back up the accusation of theft. Most companies wouldn’t want to waste the time hiring a lawyer to defend the statement, thus the policy not to give references). So many big companies create a policy limiting what can be said as a reference. Smaller employers may either feel more free to say what they think and take the legal risk, or follow the example of the big companies.
Regarding a 5 month hole in a resume… Many HR folks accept that a resume is a sales piece, especially for a more experienced applicant with a lot of qualifications to highlight. Therefore, it is pretty acceptable not to list every little job on a resume. List the ones that show how you are marketable for that type of position. An *application * is a different ball of wax. You are typically signing a statement at the bottom of the application that the information you provide is correct and complete. If they find out it’s not, that is grounds for dismissal even after you’re hired. For those relatively new to the workforce, their ability to demonstrate consistent employment with no gaps may be one of their more important selling points, so glossing over a 5 month gap on a one page resume for a 20 year old may be a bigger issue than for someone w/ 10 years’ experience.
I have been advised to say nothing if I can’t say anything nice. The reason is we don’t want to get sued.
So, unfortunately, I think the understanding these days is if you hear nothing from a previous employer, it’s probably a bad sign. But having good references should be a sufficiently mitigating factor in your favor.
Actually, it is not an issue of privacy, but instead slander/libel. If a former employer says “that employee was fired for theft”, this is what is known as slander/libel **per se ** if they can’t prove it. What this means is if ex-employee sues the ex-employer, the burden of proof is on the ex-employer to that s/he was a crook. Which unless the ex-employee was arrested and convicted, likely they can’t prove. Thus FAR safer to just say they were terminated and not rehireable, with no explanation as to why.
Small employers in India don’t bother about being sued for giving a biased reference - the average court case lasts about 15 years here.
The HR manager at the company I’m worried about could simply confirm the period of employment and leave it at that, had I not left under acrimonious circumstances. He was a total jerk, and towards the end, I made my dislike for him pretty clear - obviously a bad move, but after a month of deliberate asshattery, I lost my cool.
In a nutshell, there’s no way I can give a reference for that company. I have good references from the others, which I hope will make up for the lack of this one.
