Well, here’s the thing. At trial, the prisoners presented multiple witnesses as to the spoiled and inedible food. This put the burden back on the sheriff to show otherwise, yet the only witness he presented was a nutritionist who planned menus, and couldn’t actually say what the prisoners were eating.
I think we’re entitled to infer that if the sheriff had contradictory evidence, he would have presented it; that’s the point of a civil trial.
Malnutrition doesn’t show up suddenly, in one day. And if food is inedible, but that’s all there is to eat, then people will eat it to stop the hunger pangs. So it’s possible to keep people alive on rotten food that is not fit for consumption for a few months.
That doesn’t make it right.
Look, I certainly don’t think that the taxpayers should have to feed prisoners (of either a jail or a prison) caviar on toast points. I think that lawsuits in which a prisoner asserts his right to have chunky peanut butter instead of creamy are absolutely ridiculous. But I think that we do have an obligation to feed those who are imprisoned a nutritious and well-balanced diet which is conducive to health. I’m not saying that it has to be the very tastiest food ever. Jail/prison isn’t supposed to be a pleasant vacation from everyday life. But we’re not supposed to inflict harm on those we imprison, either.
Not only do we have a moral obligation to look after prisoners’ health, but keeping them in moderately good health makes economic good sense, too. Healthy prisoners will put less of a drain on the health care system both in prison/jail and out. And what do you want to bet that most of these prisoners depend on public health care in the outside world?
It would probably be perfectly possible to economically feed these prisonsers oatmeal for breakfast and rice, beans, and cornbread for lunch and dinner on most days,with some fruit and dairy products added in, and to ensure that all their nutritional needs are met. This diet would get real old, real fast. But it wouldn’t enable Joe to boast about how tough on prisoners he was. I do believe that he’s a sadist, and should never be in charge of other people.
One thing that struck me was that the prisoners could win a stocking of Christmas goodies to give to their favorite charity. I couldn’t help but think that maybe the prisoners would like that stocking for themselves or their families.
THIS. Win.
/end thread.
I employed two ex-convicts to work on my farm in 2010. One is still working here.
Both had serious health issues, which I attribute, at least in part, to the meals they were fed while incarcerated. Each has stomach ulcers and suppressed anti-immune systems.
Also, both were given anti-depressants while in prison (and let’s face it, if you’re serving time it should be considered normal to be least a little depressed).
Once released, neither could afford to continue the drugs which led to some bizarre behavioral problems until the medication was out of their systems.
As they were both convicted of drug felonies, they were ineligible for food stamps.
Oddly enough paroled rapists, murderers, and pedophiles qualify for food stamps but not people convicted of marijuana felonies.
Go fucking figure.
This says that there is spoiled food. It could just mean that the food isn’t sorted properly before the prisoners get it. But does it prove that they don’t get enough food? Did the prisoner’s bring forth witnesses stating what the consequences to them were because there was spoiled food?
So, if Joe no longer gives them spoiled inedible food, is there anything left to bitch about?
What the argument should be: Is Joe and his jail required to follow a set guideline for food health and nutrition and is he? Whatever organization that enforces such rules should be ensuring he is doing so. If those guidelines can be met with bologna sandwiches and peanut butter, then as long as it is provided in sufficient quantities the prisoner’s can suck it up.
I’m with Uzi. It’s only a short step from asking for edible nutritious food to demanding bubble baths and hookers.
Are you seriously asking for cites to show that moldy bologna and peanut butter sandwiches aren’t nutritionally healthy for you in the long run?
How about nutraloaf?
“Non-dairy cheese”. Why, yes, please.
How about only prisoners being punished get his version of “nutraloaf”, and I’m asking about the nutritional value of the regular 14 cent meal. Also, we have no idea what is in Joe’s nutraloaf, either.
I don’t think I asked for a cite. I’m also pretty sure that I threw out that line to mean bologna and peanut butter and whatever else they may serve at the jail currently.
And btw, peanut butter is a calorie dense food. It is has lots of protein and other nutrients. It’s on most people’s list when it comes to a food to have on hand in a crisis or disaster for good reason. Or do you want a cite for that?
Are you feigning ignorance or is it real? Because most people would be able to figure out that it’s the mold that’s a problem not the peanut butter.
Cite that mold is a problem? They could be eating brie for all we know. Lousy ingrates.
I could ask the same question. People who don’t get enough to eat show signs that they aren’t. People who don’t like what they eat and don’t show those signs are what?
this is just what happens when you let right wing christian conservatives have any power. My personal take on Joe is that anyone that far to the right is hiding something. I bet when he dies they find the mummified remains of illegal immigrant children drying in his attic. Cut to a shot of his wife going 'I always wondered about Joe’s collection of little shoes."
Which is nothing more than spoiled milk, now, isn’t it! And bread mold frequently has antibiotic properties. So, free medical care, right there!
If she dares…
“She’s upstairs all right. That’s what you get for sparing the paddle.”
“Uncle Fester, please.”
"My father knew how to raise children: he used the paddle on me even when I was good. And if my mother interfered: he used it on her. "
The majority of prisoners while eventually be released.
If they have serious health problems as a result of poor nutrition while incarcerated, it will be more difficult for them to hold legitimate jobs.
It makes sense to ensure that they are adequately fed while in jail.
I personally know someone who spent months in Arpaio’s gulag. She was quite ill, and after a lot of pleading and phone calls by her parents, she was issued some cough syrup. A partial bottle mind you, that had four or five other prescription labels underneath hers.
No, I don’t think convicted prisoners need to be overly comfortable. At the other end, though, they are wards of the state and deserve that their basic needs, such as food, shelter, and medicines, are acceptable.
Extreme conditions on those awaiting trial also has a significant benefit for those who want to appear tough on crime - it increases the conviction rates. The nastier you make it for someone who is awaiting trial, the more likely you make it that they will take a deal offered by the state, especially if that offer is for time served or a limited extra sentence, regardless of their actual guilt or innocence.
That way we get around the expensive and time consuming need for a trial, and it reduces the risk that swaggering, tough on crime internet hardmen might have to actually consider the possibility that innocent people are being treated like animals by a self-aggrandizing jackass.