Joe Biden's in

Let’s keep the personal stuff out of the debate, please.

all of a sudden Biden says he no longer supports the federal ban on paying for abortions.

It’s a reasonable reaction "Biden told the crowd Thursday night he had changed his mind because Republican state lawmakers have enacted “extreme laws in clear violation of constitutional rights” protected by the Supreme Court’s Roe v. Wade decision, making access to abortions more difficult for women who cannot afford the procedure or travel to obtain it."

In other words, Bien was willing to compromise a little, but since they arent willing to compromise at all, then screw them.

And as far as “all of a sudden”, the CNN article says he was on video tape as saying “the Hyde amendment can’t stay”.

So I guess it’s a bit of a messaging fuckup.

I am ambivalent about this Hyde flip-flop for Biden. At first I though that staking out a more moderate position on abortion would distinguish him from the rest of the field and also help in the general election since the Hyde Amendment is pretty popular. However the Dems have definitely shifted on this and it looks like currently it’s impossible for anyone who is not maximally committed to abortion access to become a candidate. The “safe,legal and rare” position of Bill Clinton and Obama’s willingness to triangulate are a thing of the past. Biden probably didn’t have much of a choice but flip-flopping certainly doesn’t make him look good.

In general on the issues of immigration, abortion and guns the Democrats have moved sharply to the left from where they were not so long back in 2006-2008 and I think it’s a mistake. Voters may have moved a bit to the left on these issues but not nearly as much as the Dems, particularly among swing voters in the crucial purple states.

I think that’s the best description of it, but I think the implications are significant. Biden has already had several messaging fuck-ups. He can get away with it for a while, but once the debates start, it’s on for real. I’m seeing very clear signs that Joe Biden is not ready for this race. He can hire all the whiz-bang data scientists and campaign strategists he wants to: in the end, the people are going to judge Joe Biden’s candidacy based on their perceptions of Biden, the individual.

He ain’t gonna make it.

He slurs his speech too much already. It’ll only get worse as the grind gets worse.

I’m just not sure how into this campaign he really is. I sometimes get the feeling like he was told to run - so, he’s running.

He has a excellent reason for the flip flop- that fact that the GOP is going super radical on abortion, thus there is no longer and need or use for a compromise. Biden has always been a compromise sort of guy.

I personally don’t give a toss if he flip flops - that’s what good politicians do. I worry that he’s not prepared to run and that he might get banged up during the debates. Every candidate’s strategy will be to take shots at Biden, and some are going to come bare knuckled. I hope he’s ready for it.

The odd thing is that I think his missteps actually increase his popularity a bit. Voters seem most put off by a candidate who seems too polished and “prepared” … it comes off as less “authentic”. Even a few flips and flops come off as more speaking off the cuff with some reconsideration in response to feedback … and less of a product of focus group research.

He’s going to eventually have to actually have a message other than “I am the surest thing to beat Trump.” though.

I think Biden can survive the occasional off-color remark, televised gaffe, and even an occasionally wrong take on a political issue. Biden is a known quantity in the minds of many people.

When the candidates started announcing and the field came into focus, I initially thought Biden was going to get slammed by the hard left. But the more I analyze the situation, I have to confess I may have misjudged the Democratic party. If you read 538, Silver talks about how Democratic voters are generally moderate, and right now they’re alarmed at the radicalization of the Republican party. In the past, in a normal election cycle, voters wanted something that looked and felt different, but I think what a majority of Democrats want is a return to decency and normalcy. Biden represents that better than anyone.

Perhaps the one danger Biden faces is appearing too old and frail for the job. Fortunately for him, two of the other top five contenders (Warren and Sanders) will be 70 or older by inauguration day. If Biden collapses, if he looks old, confused, or lethargic, then that maybe opens things up for, say, Harris, Warren, Sanders, or dare I say it, Buttigieg (though he’s a long shot).

Right now decency and normalcy is different and is the change we are looking for. :grinning:

:D:D:D

He is already doing far fewer events than others.

I think in a way, he is not really running as 76 year old Joe Biden of today, but as an avatar of an Obama-Biden administration restoration. As such, voters don’t really need–or maybe even want–to hear much from him.

Voters don’t feel any need to hear much from him. He is perceived as a known pair of worn in shoes.

Diving into the scrum at this point has no upside for him.

Maybe he should skip the debates and such? Go back to the “front porch” campaigns of a century ago.

In case you are not being sarcastic (and both around here as on social media I’ve given up trying to tell), skipping debates would have a big downside. And being there has little chance for that downside. Ten on stage each night and set up for the bigger polling candidates to be split between the nights (to avoid having kiddie table effect) means little chance for any major damage unless he’s already dropped and someone else come up by then. Others will be swinging for the fences to have the big line that gets played and replayed on the news and shared. His existing favorability ratings means he just needs to not go down in three swings.

I wasn’t being sarcastic. What is the downside? You stated there would be one, but not what or why.

Not showing for the party sanctioned debates would look cowardly.