Where’s the profit in that?
-FrL-
To my recollection (admittedly it was early in my childhood that I ever saw the show) George Jefferson himself was consistently portreyed as a dufus. And I don’t remember any particularly dufus-y characters, black or white, on the Cosby Show, but I do remember black characters being portreyed as consistently goofy. (Cockroach was the name of one of these characters.)
In Good Times it was one of the main black characters who played the role of clown. Same with What’s Happening.
Come to think of it, I have even less of an idea what you’re talking about than I thought when I started writing this post.
-FrL-
Dude, did you ever watch the Jeffersons? George is a total idiot, and is constantly getting put in his place by “Weezie” and Florence. He’s an idiot with a successful business, yes, but that’s the only aspect of his life that he doesn’t screw up.
Confirmation bias
I offer ‘Patsy the Drug Hunting Mother’ (whose husband, quite rightly, looks at her as if she is insane)
I offer every woman in every commercial ever made for a cleaning material.*
I offer the two men in the commercial for a Financial Advisor company.
I offer the H&R Block commercials (men and women are cast both as savvy and as dazed -and-confused tax-filers.)
- The commercial with the guys watching the game asking how the host got his toilet bowl so clean was a cute spoof, but I have been informed, quite seriously, that “guys don’t sit around talking about stuff like that”. Apparently, some people think that women do.
[But I did hate those ‘Without us, some men would starve’ commercials, and refused to patronize Hardee’s]
Another stupid thing about home security commercials is when the kid answers the phone, and Brinks (or ADT) tells her they’re calling her parents. Her PARENTS?? The door is smashed and the kid’s home alone and he’s calling her PARENTS?
Re: the racial bias thing…I tend to think the company doesn’t consider crime stats in their commercial production details. It’s strictly a PC decision.
I don’t recall it being that one-sided, but anyway, I think you would have a point if it was a white man who was constantly putting George in his place. As opposed to his black housekeeper.
Again, I think you would have a point if the goofy teenager were black and the smart, ambitious teenager (who wanted to become a federal judge) were white.
Oh, and…
… that’s what’s known as prejudice.
No, that’s what’s known as deductive reasoning.
brazil, is it really your argument that portraying black people in a less-than-perfect-and-saintly light only counts if there are saintly white people on that show?
Well, on All in the Family, George was just as racist as Archie, except biased in favor of blacks. And on the Jeffersons, he was pretty much the only racist character–he referred to white neighbor (Tom?) as honky and to the mixed race daughter, Jenny (who ends up marrying Lionel) as a zebra. White people don’t put him in his place, but pretty much everyone is more open minded than George.
Where’s the profit in mitigating a perceived threat to the target audience?
There is one exception that I know…the Bill Engval show. He has a friend who is black and a complete dufus. It amazed me. 
Then explain Urkel.
“A statement of political correctness” is ridiculously vague. What, specifically, is Brinks Home Security stating in their commercials? And why do you conclude that they’re stating this, as opposed to merely trying to sell their product?
I find it equally interesting that innocuous commercials and announcements generate a degree of anger merely because they contain white guys, but that’s just me.
Pretty much. My original claim was that blacks tend to be portrayed in a very positive light. For example George Jefferson who runs a succesful business; who is loyal to his wife; etc.
Others have pointed out (correctly) that these sorts of people (who are sometimes referred to derisively as “magic n****s”) are not necessarily perfect. I concede this point, but I still think my basic point stands, which is that there is a bias at work. You can see this by comparing the portrayal of blacks and whites in shows which are multi-racial.
Here’s my challenge:
Name a few mainstream TV shows from the past 20 or 30 years which have a prominent regular black cast member who is portrayed as being unintelligent, irresponsible, or criminal compared to a prominent regular white cast member of the same gender and similar situation.
If you do that, I will try to name a few shows which go the other way. I think I will have an easier time of things, but let’s see.
My (admittedly imperfect, what with being a little kid) recollection of the Jeffersons is that George was a tool, and that his white neighbor, while kind of a doofus, was all-around a much more standup guy.
Can’t help you with your last question, I simply don’t watch enough television. But does your “it doesn’t count unless” rule also apply to white guys who are presented as doofuses *without *a woman or a minority in play?
DianaG, if you have followed any of brazil84’s posts on this board you will find that he believes (and strongly advocates) that blacks are genetically disposed to be dangerously unintelligent, violent, promiscuous, etc… His current objection is that they are not rigorously portrayed as such on “white oriented” TV sitcoms.
Hope this helps.
I don’t recall that.
Absolutely. For example, if there is a commercial where the smart person is a white guy and the dumbo is also a white guy, I would not count that as evidence of the sort of bias I have been describing. (Of course, my impression in situations like that is that the dumbo tends to be bald, which I think is a bit mean.)
Here’s another example: The TV show Friends, in which all the main characters are white. In that case, the fact that Joey and Phoebe are stupid doesn’t “count,” i.e. it’s not evidence of the bias I have been discussing.
Yeah, I pretty much agree. George was lovable, but in the same way that Archie Bunker was. We weren’t supposed to think he was all that smart or open minded, and more often than that we’re laughing at him, not with him. We like him because we get that, like Archie, he just doesn’t know better. I don’t think he’s portrayed as a dumb man, or dumb black man. Basically every other main character on the show is portrayed as more enlightened–male, female, white, black, and so on.
Oh yeah, and Urkel was the devil, though he did turn into Stefan. I’m not sure what any of that means.
George Jefferson is as far removed from the “magical negro” theme as you can get, so I’m really puzzled why you keep bringing him up. He’s misogynistic, racist, mean to everyone, and he’s short and homely. Furthermore, he’s the classic buffoon character in the minstral style. As bad as Archie Bunker was, he was never a dancing buffoon.
The Huxatables are no more magical than most of the families portrayed on 80s television, and it’s actually kind of insulting for you to imply this. What, is it unrealistic for a black family to be headed by professionals? Would you like it better if Cliff wasn’t there, Clair was overweight and underemployed, and the kids not as well-mannered and cute? Then you’re in luck! Most black families in TV history have fit this mold.
If you’re going to go back to the 80s for examples of “magical negroes”, why don’t you also cite such wonderful shows “Diff’rent Strokes” and “Webster”. Those negroes are so magical that they have to be raised by white people. Because apparently black people aren’t capable of taking care of their own.
Cite? Can you name a single show featuring a multi-racial cast where all the black characters are saintly and all the white characters are villians or incompetents?
ER. I stopped watching ER about five years ago, but I remember Eric LaSalle’s character being pretty irritating. Arrogant and surly, definitely not “magical”. But none of the characters in that show are always good and always bad. Marc Greene comes close though.
Boston Public. The black principal was okay, but the mentally unstable history teacher was played by a black woman. Most of the “problem” students were black. But like ER, no one was a saint in that show.
The Wire. Probably the best testing ground for your theory as you can get. Let’s see…all the criminals are black. The crooked politicians are both black and white (though the white Mayor wasn’t crooked, just overly ambitious). The lazy cops are both black and white. The good cops are both white and black. The annoying characters are both black and white. The first season, probably to lure an audience, DID have a saintly “save the day” character. And guess what? He was white! Imagine that. A show with a predominately black cast having a white heroic character.
Besides George Jefferson and Cliff Huxatable, both crappy examples, you haven’t named any examples of black main characters who are saintly compared to their white counterparts. Could it be that this is a difficult thing to do not just because such a thing doesn’t exist, but because there are very few shows where blacks and whites share equal screen time and thus have equally important characters? Most TV shows with multiracial casts, like ER, still have a bias towards one race in casting. So of course your villain-of-the-week will tend to be white.
I’m embarrassed to admit this, but I used to watch “The Parkers”, which is about a middle-aged single mother (played by Monique) attending community college with her daughter. This show only had one regular white character–played by the actress who was “Six” in the show “Blossom”. Based on your hypothesis, we would expect this character to be the butt of all the jokes. But she was actually the sanest, most intelligent character.
To be fair to you, I can think of one example where the black character was perfect. Denzel Washington’s character in “St. Elsewhere”. I don’t remember him ever having any problems or flaws (though I haven’t seen all the episodes). But as a main character, Washington’s was pretty much background filler. The black janitor had more screen time. As the only black doctor shown at St. Elegius, if Denzel had been portrayed as incompetent, it would be pretty hard for us not to infer something bad about the writer’s intentions. But if we can blame PCness for this, then political incorrectness should get blamed for him being a token. Perhaps it’s not unrealistic that he would be the only black doctor on staff, but it’s not any less realistic than him being 100% competent and likeable either.
Wait. I do remember an episode where he chewed out a black nurse for making a mistake that almost killed a patient, and the nurse retorted that he was selling out his race (or something like that). Yeah, he came out looking good but the black nurse looked bad.
Your turn.
As noted before, he is a succesful businesman and he is loyal to his wife. He was also competent enough to succesfully perform CPR on a white supremacist who had a heart attack.
I don’t debate with people who strawman me, i.e. who misrepresent my position. So please either show me where I claimed that such shows exist or apologize and admit that I made no such claim. Your choice.