Katrina ultimately good for the U.S.?

[Johnny_L.A]

After so many years of Social Darwinism, Hurricane Katrina could reawaken the American people’s appetite for compassion in government.

Hurricane Katrina is one of those rare interludes which has upset the national equilibrium. While 9/11 made Americans angry, the fate of New Orleans has gone beyond that. In varying degrees the whole population is angry, ashamed, and fearful.

Angry at the incompetence and buck-passing between inept local, state and federal authorities; ashamed at those relentlessly recycled pictures of the abandoned black underclass; and fearful to see that the country is still unprepared to cope with a major terrorist attack.

There will be hell to pay for Katrina.

Scanning the replies letters in reply to the BBC article, I see that many Americans disagree with the author. The author makes comparisons between Hoover and Duhbya. ‘He expected voluntary acts of compassion by business and good neighbours would be enough…’ Reading that out of context in this thread, which one does he mean? But as readers pointed out, the Katrina is no Great Depression.

On the other hand, there was no Internet in the 1930s. Today we have instant exchange of information and opinions via millions and millions of personal computers. We have 24-hour news coverage. It takes fewer people to raise a stink nowadays than it did decades ago, simply because people are able to communicate to a wider audience more effectively now.

I’ve ranted in favour of Universal Health Care. I’ve supported the abolition of Capital Punishment. I’ve called the President a criminal for his pre-meditated (Downing St. Memos) invasion of a sovereign nation. There are people here who disagree with me on every one of those views and more. But maybe… just maybe… Katrina will open America’s eyes to the fact that there are a lot of underprivileged people here. Reporters I’ve seen are growing teeth, and they’re on the attack over the slow response to the hurricane. Maybe they’ll keep their teeth and start asking the hard questions about our domestic policy toward much-needed social programmes. And our foreign policy to boot.

[xbuckeye]

I think it already has. We have learned that there are some parts of our legal structure that are making rescue and recovery more difficult, we have learned that when the authorities say to leave, we should consider leaving, we have learned that warehousing people in sports arenas is not a good idea, we have learned that not every police force responds to tragedy as well as the NYPD did 9/11/01. We have learned that FEMA directors should have some experience.

I was appalled that there were no provisions made for the poorer classes in NO to get out and no way for the ill to get help. I am even more appalled that there are hundreds of busses underwater in NO. Not only city busses, but church busses and private busses. I was likewise appalled by the tourists that didn’t evacuate. Cut your frikkin’ vacation short so the maid cleaning your hotel room can get out with her family. Not that I would never have believed that any of these would be the case, but that I had never really thought about how a poor family with no extra money and no car would pack up and leave. Now we all know…and I think we will do something about it.

I think we will pay a high price for this lesson.

[Inigo_Montoya]

@xbuckeye

Now we all know…and I think we will do something about it.

I’ll need to see the action before I expect it. I think a hell of a great job has been/is being done by private citizens & organizations and foreign aid and the like. But once this crisis is 90 days old I fully anticipate we’ll hear no more of it, and no top-level politicians will suffer significantly as a result. I hope it doesn’t go away, and I hope some meaningful remedial legislation comes of this mess. But I’m not banking on it.

[World_Eater]

Bah, you smoketh from the crack pipeth my friend. The lines of this country have been divided even more, and this is one more chasm on the way to civil war. I predict civil war in 50 - 75 years.

My rusty 2 cents natch!

[Johnny_L.A]

In 50 - 75 years I’ll be dead.

[World_Eater]

@Johnny L.A.

In 50 - 75 years I’ll be dead.

Not planing on having any children eh?

[Johnny_L.A]

@World Eater

Not planing on having any children eh?

Never gonna happen. (I haven’t a womb.)

[World_Eater]

@Johnny L.A.

Never gonna happen. (I haven’t a womb.)

Eh, stranger things have happened.

I personally don’t think Katrina was a good event in the long run. I’ve also given up on this country uniting on anything to rally together. I think those days are long gone.

[BoringDad]

@xbuckeye

I think it already has. We have learned that there are some parts of our legal structure that are making rescue and recovery more difficult, we have learned that when the authorities say to leave, we should consider leaving, we have learned that warehousing people in sports arenas is not a good idea, we have learned that not every police force responds to tragedy as well as the NYPD did 9/11/01. We have learned that FEMA directors should have some experience.

None of those are lessons America learned last week.

The part about our legal structure making rescue more difficult is BS.
The authorities can tell me to leave, but this is America, and I can choose not to. It should always be that way.
Warehousing people in sports arenas is better than leaving them to face a hurricane in substandard housing and would have been fine had security been adequate and provisions been in place to move them out after a day. Or two. Or even three!
Tragedy and citywide disaster are two vastly different things. Turn NYC into a flooded wasteland where no-one knows if their own family is alive or sinking and see how NYPD stands up. Then you can compare.
As to the last one? Most of the country would have already assumed that it would help if our employees are qualified for their jobs.

[Grits_and_Hard_Toast]

@Johnny L.A.

But maybe… just maybe… Katrina will open America’s eyes to the fact that there are a lot of underprivileged people here. Reporters I’ve seen are growing teeth, and they’re on the attack over the slow response to the hurricane. Maybe they’ll keep their teeth and start asking the hard questions about our domestic policy toward much-needed social programmes. And our foreign policy to boot.

The problem with this is that America already knew there were a lot of underpriviledged people here. It has been that way from the beginning. We wanted to change that, and after throwing trillions of dollars at the problem, it is still there. The result of Katrina won’t be to give more money to government funded social programs. We tried that it doesn’t work.

I think most people see that it is the individuals and corporations of America that will now make life livable for those affected by the flood, not the government with all its red tape, bureaucracy, and peter principle people who work for it.

The changes I see, from my little corner of the world, are these:

My liberal soccer mom friends, who before Katrina would never have a gun in their home, and were big time gun control advocates, are now asking me, if they bought a handgun, would I take them to the range and teach them to use it? Before they could never imagine being in a situation where they would ever shoot to kill someone, now they can.

My conservative friends, who always believed local gov should have the most power, then state, then federal, are now thinking the fed gov should have more control, and be able to step in a situation like NO if the stated emergency plans are not being followed at the local level. They don’t like being in this position, but are now thinking that would have saved many lives.
My disinterested in politics friends are now wishing they had voted and gotten more involved, and will be closely scrutinizing the next local and federal elections realizing now that it really does matter who is in charge.

My libertarian friends are saying “I told you so”… the people in NO that planned on fending for themselves, or planned ahead enough to have the means to get out of town, came out of this the best. Lesson learned, don’t count on anyone but yourself to save you.

And I keep reading the phrase “America is ashamed” in these articles. I really don’t get that at all. We obviously feel empathy, because of the huge outpouring of help, so if anything, I think we are now more proud at the people stepping up to help out. For me to feel shame, I would have to feel I was somehow responsible for the problems. I don’t feel I am responsible for the problems. But I do feel a responsibility to help those in need, and I have. And reading that I should feel ashamed, does nothing to bring me to the side of those who say I should feel that way.

[Johnny_L.A]

What I was getting at is this: The BBC article mentions how there were more social programmes after Hoover. When Americans were hit hard by the Depression, government eventually stepped in with a social safety net. After seeing the ‘charlie foxtrot’ after Katrina, I wonder if Katrina will turn out to be beneficial by turning the spot light on the naked Emperor (the lot of them) and resutling in a newer, better social safety net – one that seems to be enjoyed by citizens of every other developed nation.

[astorian]

I think the Democrats are hoping… no, for the moment, they’re deluding themselves that Katrina is turning things their way. and they’re going to try to fight Bush tooth and nail between now and 2006.

When this effort fails too, they’ll whimper quietly and go back to the corner where they belong.

[Milkit]

@astorian

I think the Democrats are hoping… no, for the moment, they’re deluding themselves that Katrina is turning things their way. and they’re going to try to fight Bush tooth and nail between now and 2006.

When this effort fails too, they’ll whimper quietly and go back to the corner where they belong.

I hate to state the obvious however, as much as I despise the man; Bush is just one asshole in a sea of Politicians (Democrats and Republicans). The Federal government was an embarrassment as to how “fast” they responded to Katrina. We need to blame our congressmen as well. If we continue to point the finger at one man, he will continue to be the scapegoat and nothing will get done. We have left our fellow Americans stranded because they are poor and they don’t have a voice.

[Grits_and_Hard_Toast]

@Johnny L.A.

What I was getting at is this: The BBC article mentions how there were more social programmes after Hoover. When Americans were hit hard by the Depression, government eventually stepped in with a social safety net. After seeing the ‘charlie foxtrot’ after Katrina, I wonder if Katrina will turn out to be beneficial by turning the spot light on the naked Emperor (the lot of them) and resutling in a newer, better social safety net – one that seems to be enjoyed by citizens of every other developed nation.

I would say that the difference now is that after FDR and all the social programs we have instituted since then, the government, (the lot of them) has shown to be incapable of spending money and getting good results.

I think the tide will turn away from a government social safety net ( have we not heard that FDR’s Soc security will be bankrupted in a few years because of bad planning and mismanagement?) and will turn towards individuals wanting to spend their money not in taxes to the gov, but to proven charities and programs that have shown they can get the job done.

I agree Katrina might makes us want to help the poor more, but it won’t be through government programs.

[Little_Nemo]

Hopefully some people have had the eyes opened to the fact that talk is cheap. This administration has made a huge issue out of how their most important priority was protecting America in a crisis. Now it appears that their priority was talking about the issue rather than actually doing anything about it. Hopefully this will show people the importance of judging their elected officials not just by their words but by their deeds.

[BoringDad]

@Grits and Hard Toast

I think the tide will turn away from a government social safety net ( have we not heard that FDR’s Soc security will be bankrupted in a few years because of bad planning and mismanagement?)

You may have heard this, but it is complete republican spin, and no mismanagement was involved, only demographics. SS was designed to run "pay as you go"over the long haul, and when it goes “Bankrupt” that just means that it is back to running “pay as you go” again. Even if no changes are made, once it goes “bankrupt” in 40 years, it will still be paying more on an inflation adjusted basis than retirees are getting now.

[Fridgemagnet]

There are parallels between Katrina and the Great Mississippi Flood Of 1927. Social Darwinism was the order of the day back then, and the US government didn’t take responsibility for individual citizens. No government aid was forthcoming (it was left to the Red Cross to provide flood relief), and the president (Coolidge?) refused even to sign an autographed photo to be auctioned for flood charities. Not only that, but levees were dynamited to save the rich areas of real estate at the expense of the poorer districts downtown.

There was an eventual reaction to this cold official indifference, and social reforms to aid the poorer US citizens did ultimately follow. I’m hoping something similar will happen this time around, but I’m not waiting up.

[Inigo_Montoya]

@Johnny L.A.

Never gonna happen. (I haven’t a womb.)

That’s as may be, but you should at least fight for your right to have babies! If for no other reason than to symbolize your struggle against oppression!

[Neurotik]

@Grits and Hard Toast

I would say that the difference now is that after FDR and all the social programs we have instituted since then, the government, (the lot of them) has shown to be incapable of spending money and getting good results.

Uh huh. Other than the fact that the poor are a million times better off now than they were then, with better job safety, higher wages, a better environment, better housing, and better transit.

[Inigo_Montoya]

But apart form job safety, living wages, cleaner environment, adequate housing and mass tranisit…what has the government ever done for us?