Let's hear what Amtrak is like

In My Humble Opinion
41

Heh. I was always ever by myself on Via long-distance, and the people I met in the three other seats at the table in the dining car! Great folks! I was on Via’s Canadian once, from Toronto to Vancouver, with a bunch of British tourists (I just wanted to get somewhere, and they were on a package tour); and was seated with various of them at every meal seating. Lots of questions and commentary about Canada, and I was glad to be able to help answer their questions. Good conversation, at any rate. Eating in the dining car was one of the high points of my day.

And that’s one of the treats of train travel: getting to know people whom you never would on an aircraft.

On the other hand, I had to share a table between Montreal and Halifax with a couple who looked down their nose at my lunch of a Montreal smoked meat sandwich and a beer. They were vegan or vegetarian, and they only drank water. For all they conversed between themselves about saving the environment, they sure didn’t pay much attention to it: I pointed out and identified a lot of birds passing by the window, and they didn’t care. They were too busy ignoring nature, but convincing themselves that they were saving the planet. Meh, big deal. I just enjoyed my Montreal Smoked Meat sandwich and beer that much more.

Oh, Lordy. Please don’t get me started on eggs. I cannot eat them, no matter how they are prepared. You want to force me to eat eggs, you ain’t gonna be pleased with the results. Well, I can eat them, if they’re an ingredient among other ingredients (hot and sour soup, in breads or cakes, etc., for example), but on their own, scrambled, over easy, sunny side up, poached, whatever—no. Just no. Let’s just say that a mop and broom will be necessary. You’ll have a mess, I’ll go hungry, nobody’s happy.

Let’s return to the Amtrak long-distance discussion, shall we?

42

You will be spared looking at Nebraska, my state, coming and going. It is comfortable enough during the day. I can only stand sleeping one night. I would need to stay in a hotel one night if it takes 3 nights. I did Minnesota to Seattle once. About the length of my tolerance.

43

Slow, noisy and antiquated, IMO. I’ve been across the northern tier twice, once from Seattle (in coach) and once from Portland to MSP (sleeper car). The tracks are often in terrible condition, so the train often has to creep along on temporary tracks. The tracks also aren’t dedicated, so freight trains have priority. Any time a freight is coming, Amtrak has to move onto a side line to let it go by. Unless you take sleeping pills, every time the train stops at some small town, you’re going to wake up. If you’re larger than average, the bathroom is going to be a tight fit, and climbing up and down from that top bunk is no fun if you have any problems. I did it back then, but there’s no way I could do it now.

44

I took Empire Builder from LaCrosse, Wi To Everett, WA and back as part of a bicycle camping trip. I sprung for a roomette (4 nights total). The roomette was roughly the same size as my tent (though MUCH taller). I enjoyed my train trip. It was too dark to see much of Glacier westbound, but it was right after breakfast eastbound – I spent time in the view card for that part of the trip. Mostly I spent time in my roomette - did not have have much trouble sleeping. I thought the food was in general quite good – one steak was one of the best I have had, the other was not as good but still acceptable. I really like the cheesecake which i always had until it ran out.
Th nice thing about using it for transporting my bike as I didn’t have to box it up. I had a collapsible bag for my rear panniers (my checked luggage) and the front panniers were my carry-ons

Brian

45

I’ve not been on that route in the past couple of decades but I remember the Capitol Limited as being a Superliner. Amtrak says it still is.

You must be referring to the Cardinal, which has a longer route and is not a Superliner.

46

Definitely true on about half the stretch of track I regularly ride. As explained to me by an Amtrak employee, they are given the use of the track for a defined slot of time. If they manage to hit this, all is well and they roll along as planned. But if they miss their time slot by more than a few minutes, they must defer to scheduled freight trains. On busy routes, this can lead to longish delays.

47

You’re referring to

I live near their line and see their trains at least daily. Until a couple months ago they only ran up and down the length of suburban greater Miami, some 80 miles. They now actually operate intercity to/from Orlando which was their goal all along.

IME … the equipment and stations are all brand new. It is a very nice daytrip experience. They have no expectation of, and no equipment for, overnight operations. It is NOT cheap. It is good value for somebody used to paying normal airfares, including normal first class airfares. It is NOT intended as competition for intercity busses or the ultracheap airlines.

It took a decade to build out the ~200 mile infrastructure for their one route to Orlando. It’s fast, e.g. 80mph to 100mph, but it’s all ordinary railroad tracks with ordinary grade crossings. Like Acela, it isn’t “high speed rail” in the sense any civilized country would recognize. The only reason they can run faster than 80 on the Orlando run is because it’s out in the boonies where there are no roads to cross.

Watching from the outside there is no way they will survive except with massive government subsidy. The trains are mostly empty. They’re not quite a con existing just to funnel taxpayer dollars to the insiders, but all those taxpayer dollars are going to somebody, whether the execs, the shareholders, or the passengers.

Kinda like UberLyft, where the investors are subsidizing the riders. But in this case it’s the taxpayers, not investors, doing the subsidizing.

48

I have no experience with Brightline beyond some YouTube videos but I read that they are allowing Uber/Lyft rides within 5 miles of the station as part of the ticket price (no extra fee).

Americans are SO into their cars it may take some years to get people away from their car.

I have seen some tests and the train is, weirdly, only a little faster than driving. But, you can relax on the train and it is nice.

Cost-wise it seems about the same as a cheap plane but less hassle than futzing around through an airport and a bit faster too.

While driving is probably less expensive I think the train isn’t too bad and, if you consider wear-and-tear on the car and stress of driving the train becomes a nice option (and much better than dealing with airport hassle).

That’s just my $0.02 though.

49

That’s certainly their value proposition and I agree with it as far as it goes.

Part of the reason they chose Miami-Orlando is to compete with the airlines on that run. But not so much for Orlando or greater Miami residents to visit the other, but for folks flying into one place to get to the other.

Their purpose-built Orlando train station is at the Orlando airport and connected to the new rental car center and to the nearby airplane terminals. So the connection at that end is pretty good whether you’re flying into Orlando to train to Miami or training to Orlando to then do tourist stuff there or to fly out. Orlando is quite spread out and once there any tourist is totally dependent on a rented car or hired taxi / UberLyft to get anywhere.

The situation at the Miami end is much worse. The Brightline ends in a shiny new purpose-built station downtown a block or two from the water. From which you need a shuttle bus, taxi, or UberLyft to get to the cruise port a mile+ away, and similarly to the airport 4 or 5 miles away. The airport has the additional option of taking the existing Miami city elevated rail system directly from it’s dedicated train station adjacent to the Brightline station. Which then goes to an airport-adjacent station. That same airport station also connects to the local commuter rail that runs north/south through the metroplex.

By the time one finishes futzing with all the modalities, transfers, walking, and waiting for the next arrival, that 5-mile journey can take an hour. Easy enough for someone who does it regularly, but not so easy for a newbie. And especially so for an American tourist who may have zero experience with public mass transit anywhere they’ve ever lived.

An e.g. Chicago resident used to operating the “El” and the occasional city bus can handle a strange multi-modal transit system with far more aplomb than can someone from Des Moines who’s never ridden public transit of any form anywhere in their life. Lot more Americans in that latter camp than the former.

50

I think you are right but then…I wonder why that is?

If you are from Des Moines and travel to Miami or Chicago or most any place you will have a few options to get out of the airport.

  • Rental car
  • Bus
  • Train
  • Taxi
  • Hired car (think a limousine)

Most everyone who travels almost certainly will have to learn the mass transit system fast or pay a hefty fee. With the mapping systems on most smartphones it actually is not too difficult to deal with mass transit.

51

Zephyr and Capitol Limited trains rarely arrive on time. And late trains on the latter are usually almost 2 hours late, assuming you don’t miss your connection in Chicago. It’s only a 3.5 h flight and you can get a first-class ticket for far less than a sleeper car.

My one time attempting long-distance Amtrak got me into Philly IIRC 18 hours late. The main advantage was we were moving a lot of stuff and, at the time, that was easier by train.

52

The way the schedule of the Coast Starlight works, both directions are at night when traveling through the Cascades, which is unfortunate. On the other hand, both directions are during the daytime when passing by the coast near Santa Barbara, and that section is spectacular.

53

We’ve taken several days-long trips on Amtrak. The advantages included seeing parts of the country you would never get to see from an airplane, and the generally relaxed experience of train travel.

However, depending on your tolerance for “relaxation” the slowness of train travel can become monotonous. The primary issue is sleeping (in coach cars). It wasn’t too much of an issue when I was younger, but can be difficult for an older person. Take a small pillow and earplugs.

54

I enjoy Amtrak travel, but it has its pluses and minuses. I’ve taken many Amtrak trips, including overnights, and I think the Grounded Life Travel web site and YouTube channel has a lot of good advice for Amtrak. Web site link: https://www.groundedlifetravel.com/

55

I think this may be the source of some of the polarization we’re seeing in this thread.

If you go into a long distance train trip with the attitude that “It’s about the journey, not the destination”, and take the opportunity to disconnect and embrace the relaxing nature of train travel, you’ll probably enjoy the trip. (Although I personally wouldn’t want to do a trip that long in coach. I would splurge on at least a roomette.)

If you look at the train as merely a way of getting to your destination, and actually care about little details like arriving “on time”, and getting there quickly, you might not like it.

I fall into the former category. I honestly didn’t care that we were 2 hours behind schedule. I just shrugged and said “We’ll get there when we get there”, and sat back and enjoyed the scenery. Granted, if I had to make a connection I might have felt differently, but without looking at the schedule I’m pretty sure the eastbound long distance trains depart later in the evening, so I think the OP should be able to make the connection even if they’re a few hours late.

56

Not really.

If you are a dyed in the wool suburbanite you may have never ridden a city bus in your life. If you’re under 30 you may never have ridden a school bus; Mom drove you to school. Everything you think you know about public transit is “it’s slow, uncomfortable, full of scruffy people, and if you look like a noob you’ll get robbed.” They also think “I don’t even know how to begin to learn how to operate that stuff. I’ve got two kids, I’m dragging a bunch of suitcases, I’m stressed to the max. Renting a car is totally familiar; that other stuff is as foreign to me as space travel.”

Rural folks traveling to a strange city will probably think similarly in outcome if differently in details.

So their list of ways to get around when they arrive in a strange city consists only of

  • Rental car
  • Bus
  • Train
  • Taxi / UberLyft
  • Hired car (think a limousine)

The relative price of a rental car or UberLyft vs. a family’s worth of train fares doesn’t even enter into their equation. Trains and busses are swept off the menu way upstream of mere economics.

57

And even during the “defined slot of time” there seems to be a “but what if we didn’t?” attitude on the host railroads’ part.

Amtrak’s service alert webpage used to have a tab for individual delays and outages. My WAG is that they removed it because 90% or so fell under one of three categories:

  • “Freight interference” (inference: sidetracked even though the Amtrak train was inside its window).
  • Stopped behind a disabled freight.
  • Mandatory crew* change (the Amtrak train was stalled so long the maximum crew time had elapsed, which meant getting the new crew from the station where the replacement was to have taken place to where the train was actually stopped).

* Long-distance trains have two crews: one that runs the train (engineers, conductors &c), and one that services passengers (attendants and dining staff). The former has a mandated limit as to how long they can work, while the latter stays with the train for the entire trip.

58

Can you say you have really done London without an Oyster card and navigating the Tube? :wink:

(not to mention New York)

59

As for scenery - one thing I noticed is that train tracks don’t go through the best parts of towns, or alternately, people who can afford to not live next to the tracks, don’t. You see a LOT of really crappy yards full of crappy shit. And a lot of rail yards. If you like looking at freight cars (I do) then that’s not so bad.

The western scenery is great!

60

According to federal law, the freight lines are supposed to give passenger trains priority. However, they frequently ignore this law and there are apparently no repercussions for doing so.