Don’t get me wrong. I am glad he won.
But Obama is a disgusting bigot who opposes same sex marriage.
I’m unaware of what Obama may have said or done on the subject. Can you provide a cite?
cite? on his opposition to same sex marriage?
Obama has said that he believes marriage is between a man and a woman. In that sense, his position is not quite ideal, IMO.
But…
And it’s a pretty big but…
He is, among all of those who had a shot at the Presidency, about the best possible choice on the issue.
While he believes that marriage is between a man and a woman, he has also made clear that he doesn’t like the idea of amending constitutions in order to enforce that belief. He explicitly opposed Proposition 8, the Califonia measure that will change the state constitution to define marriage as between a man and a woman.
He voted against the Federal Marriage Amendment, and has said he would like to see the Defense of Marriage Act repealed.
From here
From here:
From here:
From here:
Is it hard being so god damned stupid?
Nah, for some people it just comes naturally.
You don’t find believing that homosexuals should be denied the same rights disgusting bigotry?
If I believed inter-racial couples should be denied the right marry and should only be allowed civil unions, would I be a disgustung bigot?
Yes, I would.
He may be refering to the vitriol and hate that are being dumped on someone in the BBQ pit who has stated that he wants gays to have every right and freedom as a married couple, but that he doens’t want them to be called “married”. As noted above, that seems to be hte same tact that Obama is taking.
I want to pile on the OP too (who probably will not be returning to this thread, it being far from his bridge), but he may be onto something.
Why do we heap scorn on someone with that viewpoint in the Pit, but when it is a national figure, they seem to get a pass? Or should that be a whole other thread?
Hey, personally, I think all government-allowed unions of couples should be civil unions, and this whole “marriage” thing should be done by whatever religion or other group you want to do the ceremony. Of course, the legal, financial, etc. rights should only relate to the civil union, with no fewer or extra rights based on the gender(s) involved.
That said, I am sad at President-Elect Obama’s attitude, but it is head and shoulders above the assholes who claim that constitutional bans are the way to go, and who sometimes go a step further and ban civil unions as well. He does not believe in restricting liberties, and has shown willingness to see outside of his personal beliefs.
There is a difference between what presidents hold in their heart and what they consider politically possible. Lincoln wanted freedom for slaves long before the Lincoln-Douglas debates but waited until 2 years into the Civil War to bust out the Emancipation Proclamation. FDR felt in his bones that the Nazi’s must be stopped and the sooner the better, but wasn’t able to give more than token support to those fighting until Pearl Harbor.
So you’re going to argue Lincoln started his presidency as a racist, and FDR a coward?
I don’t think he could have gotten elected if he’d said anything else, honestly. I like him, I voted for him, but he is still a politician, and any politician is going to have to say certain things to get elected.
Not that it doesn’t suck that you can’t get elected without coming off sounding at least a little bigoted. That’s a thread in itself.
Writing as someone who definitely was not in the ‘pro’ or ‘anti’ Obama camp before the election (I just hope for the best, and feel, as a foreigner, that a strong America is a good thing for the world), how many Presidents-elect in US history do you think would have explicitly mentioned ‘gay and straight’ as part of the list of ‘included’ groups in their acceptance speech?
JHC:
Take a lesson from the many, many mistakes of the progressive movement, lo, these many years.
To manifest change, you need allies. Screaming in their faces and kicking them in the shins tries their patience. In political science terms, this is known as “being stupid”. When that ally already favors your cause and has recently come upon considerable power, well, do the math.
Obama is the best single friend you got, but not the only one, The entire progressive movement is aligned with your goals, as they are aligned for any and all who seek justice and equality. And you are winning. Anti-gay bigotry is passed the “jumping the shark” stage and entering the “socially unacceptable” phase.
When you attack your allies, you weaken yourself. Duh. But its a lesson the progressive movement has been trying to absorb for more than a hundred years, and still hasn’t quite got nailed down. Taking a bit longer than we thought.
The question boils down to: do you want to fight? or do you want to win?
Lincoln started and ended his presidency as a racist–a somewhat progressive racist, but still a racist.
Do we have any reason to believe Obama is lying about his views?
And you wouldn’t be invited to my house for dinner either. My wife and I are an interracial couple.
Not that it has anything to do with this thread, but I just want to say that her family is a large midwestern farm family and they are the nicest folks I’ve ever met. Not one of them took exception to me being black and as a matter of fact they have always treated me as one of their family.
Yes, because disgusting bigots always write anti-discrimination policies for their administration like this.
I am willing to support Obama, and I do.
But nobody should ever forget he is a disgusting bigot.
Because they don’t take the same position.
Obama takes the position that marriage is between a man and a woman, but has made explicit, on numerous occasions, that he actively opposes measures like California’s Prop 8, and would not vote for such measures. As the quotes in my previous post demonstrate.
The person you refer to in the Pit not only believes that marriage is between a man and a woman, but actually supports measures like Prop 8, which would (actually, will) amend the California constitution specifically in order to deny same-sex couples the right to marry.
So, in terms of the practical, tangible effects of their beliefs, these two people are a long way apart.
Must be nice to stand in judgement with no historical perspective. It must also be nice to have a simple world of black and white. I wish you the best of luck, clown.