Although I’m not religious, the studies clearly show that religious people are happier, healthier, they live longer, they are less likely to become addicted to alcohol and drugs, they have better marriages, they are more charitable (even for non-religious charities like blood donation), they recover better from hardships, they commit less crime, they are more sociable, they are less likely to cheat on their spouse, and they have better self-control.
What I picked up from a college sociology/anthropology course years ago is this: Religions evolve to help keep a particular group or society functioning in a productive and orderly manner in its particular time and place. This may benefit the society as a whole or the governing class of the society or both.
Great, except that you don’t look for evidence. You dismiss it all out of hand and call it bullshit.
I’m not quite sure what supernatural claims it makes. But how about the daily, down to earth practices that it espouses. You do know that it has a bunch of them, right?
So? It’s a good rule.
Really? The only way to be happy is through drugs? Good luck with that.
You’re not sure what supernatural claims religion makes? Really?
Most of them claim that there is a deity, or multiple deities. Many claim that prayer has the power to effect real and measurable change in the world. The one I was personally raised in claims that miracles are real.
I don’t think this should be surprising or revelatory to anyone posting here.
And it isn’t what I said. Again; religions contradict each other, and there’s nothing but their unsupported word as to which if any is true. You conveniently left out the second part. Nor did I say that none can be true because of that, just that it’s strong evidence that none of them is true.
Because in all of history, there’s never been any such evidence. Which is why you are condemning me for “dismissing it out of hand” and not simply whipping that evidence out and winning the argument, not just with me but with all other rival religions.
Oh, on-topic. OK, one of the local churches sponsors a Christmas bazaar every year and it’s a great place to get inexpensive handmade crafts and tree ornaments and whatnot.
As to which one is true, that’s up to individuals to decide. As for evidence, you’ll have to take peoples’ word for it. I know that’s not enough for you, but that’s not my problem.
Instead of looking at how religions all contradict each other, how about looking at what they have in common? They all say that stealing is bad. They all say that murder is bad. Are they wrong? According to you, they are. Oh, but those are just common sense rules of society. Sure, but they are also the major cornerstones of every major religion.
Except most of that isn’t true. On the contrary, religion is correlated with all sorts of social dysfunction, and religious people tend to be less ethical than unbelievers.
No it isn’t. Reality is what it is; a religions that is wrong is wrong regardless of whether or not someone insists that it is right.
It’s your problem because it means your particular religion has no more basis than the rantings of some random homeless guy on a street corner. His word has just as much evidence going for it as that of any believer. And since religions contradict each other, the overwhelming majority of religions must be false, which means the overwhelming majority of those people’s “word” is worthless.
That’s just a matter of stealing common secular principles and pretending they are religious. Nor do all religions say that stealing is wrong or that murder is wrong.
The local Episcopal church uses a large portion of offerings/contributions to run the only food pantry in the area, serving hundreds of families each month. They also run a 2nd hand store and give the profits from that to the food pantry. Both the pantry and the store are run entirely by volunteers.
Cite? And no, your cite does not prove this. What you would need to show (if this allegation were true) is a cite that compensates for cultural differences by showing that religious people within a given culture are less ethical than non-religious.
I’m not really sure what purpose it serves to do a study showing that believers or nonbelievers are more ethical or charitable or happy than the other group, honestly. Does anyone see a study like that and think, “Oh wow, the atheists are happier! I’m going to do that now instead.” Or vice versa?
I mean, I guess it’s a defense against “Atheists/religious people are dicks,” but personally I don’t need a study to tell me that some atheists and religious people are dicks, and some aren’t.
But those claims are not, as you say yourself, universal. And if we are going to have a thread in general about the good religion does, we have to consider that religions vary a lot from the Westboro Baptist Church.
This is not a conversation about what this religion espouses, or what that one believes, or which one is right…this is a conversation about the benefits given to society or individuals by religion in general. Which one is right, if any, is irrelevant to the conversation, just like which sport is more fun to play is irrelevant in a conversation on what benefits participating in sports provides.
Correlation is not causation…but it does imply causation in one direction or the other. The question then becomes, are you more likely to be charitable if you are religious or more likely to be religious if you are charitable. If its the second, then religion isnt doing any good…if its the first, and say you decide that one of the values you want to pass along to your children is charity, belonging to a church may help cement that value.
I see this a lot because I’m a Unitarian Sunday school teacher. And that is a huge driver for our growing church membership, people who are unchurched, and who aren’t really looking for dogma (or they’d join a more mainstream religion) wanting to cement a set of values for their children. As adults, our values are fairly set, and when UUs get adult converts without families it’s often for community, not for values..they find us because their values already agree with ours. Few join a UU church for the dogma.
