Sure, the little blue Linksys router claims to support up to 250 addresses, but as soon as there is bit of flux on the network, such as kids connecting to wifi and so on, the router starts getting flaky, even for wired traffic. It’s the second one I have set up in the past two years.
I am looking for a solid performing wired router that I can drop in the network and maintain relatively easily.
Hopefully the cost is $500 max, and a simple web interface for management would be supreme (vs. having to learn some arcane art like iptables).
Any ideas?
(There are relatively good switches and such connecting the nodes of the network. The router is the weak link right now.)
This Buffalo or a Linksys WRT54GL flashed with dd-wrt or Tomato should be able to handle it without issue. Those firmwares are worlds better than stock.
You’re sure about that WRT54GL? I was tempted to go down this route, but when I heard that Linksys had emasculated the venerable WRT54G, I was concerned that I would run into problems.
And it is going to provide the same dependable service as a small office router, so I don’t have to worry about their network issues while I’m at my day job?
The GL is the “old” version of the WRT54. It has the full 4MB of memory that the original had. If I remember correclty it can only be bought online. None of the box stores carry the GL model. Once you load it with third party firmware it should be pretty reliable. DD-WRT is pretty good. I was running it for two years with only an occasional reboot because the wireless bridge had an issue. I was only running about 15 - 20 devices on my network not 30.
Can you pinpoint exactly where the problem lies? Is it simply the maximum number of concurrent connections? Internal bandwidth? Speed of external access?
If the wireless side is the issue, have you considered simply having more than one router? Say one in each classroom or office?
Another possible suggestion would be to use a decent firewall/gateway server to handle the internal stuff, so that the actual router does not need to provide all that functionality. I’d use an old PC (512Mb RAM, 1-2GHz processor) with two ethernet cards running SME Server between the network and the ADSL router. You will need an internal network WiFi access point, but the SME Server handles all the NAT/DHCP/web proxy, and is reliable as anything - I get uptimes of months if the system does not need an update. You can set up a VPN, manage the thing via a web interface, and takes about 15 minutes to set up.
I’m pretty confident that the problem is about the connections.
There are about 30 desktop machines scattered about, which is a fairly predictable load, but kids are bringing in their laptops and connecting to the network all day, burning through DHCP-assigned addresses and apparently causing some indigestion.
I have read in a few places (not sure where) that the out-of-the-box firmware on consumer-grade routers just isn’t designed to handle more than a dozen or so devices.
The wireless part is handled by different wireless routers through the building, each configured as a WAP, with their internal DHCP and NAT features disabled. Note that two of those are the lame version of the WRT54G, so I might try dd-wrt on one of them if it is supported (some of the lame ones still can load dd-wrt) and use it as the router.
si_blakely, I like the idea of something like SME Serve, and I have definitely used Linux-based devices there for such things as NAS and running a Squid cache.
However, I also like the idea of a standalone hardware device that I don’t need to mess with ever, that handles security correctly out of the box.
In many cases SME Server is basically used as a standalone hardware device - albeit with a hard drive. I have considered replacing the system volume with a flash based drive for no-spin startup. And if you used a Via EPIA system with no fan…
And it really is no touch. I left a SME server running on site (a small school) for 3-4 years with no intervention. Eventually I got someone to install updates, but the thing just ran and ran. The head teacher went round talking to other schools about her open source network solution. And that 15 minute setup - that really is all you need to do, SME is secure out of the box.
From that list, Smoothwall and ClarkConnect are good options with less features than SME Server (which you could use as NAS/Print Server as well). I’ve not used any of the Linksys replacement firmware, but I have to look at setting up a WiFi hotspot at our local pub, so I suspect I will get to play with this shortly.
Wouldn’t something like a Cisco Pix fit the bill? They were made for larger Workgroup and Enterprise installations and you can get them for a song ($100-$300) on eBay now as they have been discontinued. Because of their popularity, there is a wealth of information on the web about configuring and troubleshooting these devices.
Problem is, there are dozens and dozens of different devices in this arena (I think) and I know little about the good ones vs. the clunkers.
I was kind of hoping that someone would say “Get router A or B, but don’t get C because it’s crap”
It’s kind of like looking at that Linux distro page I linked to a few posts back, with thirty or so different router distros—which one should I go for? Happily, a few folks gave me strong leads (SME server and Smoothwall) which I plan on investigating.
Cool, I didn’t know Buffalo was selling wireless routers again. They got sued by a patent troll and had to take them off the market in the U.S. for a while.
I have a Buffalo router flashed with DD-WRT and it’s been rock-solid for years. It would probably be a good choice for the OP.
I can understand your frustration, but you may be missing the point of my post. You stated in your OP that “The consumer-grade stuff just isn’t cutting it.” Given that, and your stated budget of up to $500, it would make sense to avoid the consumer based crap.
When buying brands such as Linksys, D-Link, Netgear, Buffalo, Trendnet, etc. your experience will be hit or miss. If you want reliable networking gear that can handle anything you throw at it, look at brands such as Cisco, Juniper, or Foundry. Unlike consumer gear, these devices are made to run in 24/7 data centers and are generally free of the quirks of lower-end products. While you would be hard-pressed to find new Firewall/NAT units in the $500 range, they are certainly available for the price in the used market.
I brought up the Cisco PIX as that line of firewalls has been around for about 15 years and was/is ubiquitous in datacenters. Like much Cisco gear, the various models share the same OS, so there is a common configuration method. The longevity of series works to your advantage as they have had years to work out the bugs.
An example unit would the the PIX 515E. This is a lower middle-range unit meant for small enterprise networks. It can handle up to 125,000 concurrent connections and has an aggregate throughput of 188Mbs. This should be more than you need. The 515E originally sold for around $6K, but now can found for $300 or so on eBay.
I do not mean to disparage the well known consumer routers. The Linksys WRT54 series has been a stout and reliable workhouse of home networks. I would highly recommend it for that purpose; however, even that wonderful unit can only handle less than a tenth of the users of a PIX 515E. They were made for different purposes.
You made your point well and this additional information has clarified things even better in the small-office area.
Thanks for the information!
You do seem to indicate that the good stuff is somewhat more than $500. Could you link to a good entry level “prosumer” device above $500? I can get budget for this, and I believe I can defend spending enough for a proper one.
One thing that has clouded the issue is that names such as “Cisco” appear on hardware in the $200-300 range that looks suspiciously like consumer stuff that has been tarted up with the pro-line name. I’m looking to avoid that.
Anyway, I’m going to also pursue the Linux approach on a spare PC with two network cards, even if it’s only for the learning experience.
A quick correction on my previous post: most typical consumer firewall routers can only handle around 1000 concurrent connections, but they often balk before reaching that limit. The PIX 515E handles 100 times that capacity.
I am unable provide guidance based on personal experience for specific current models as I have been out of the game for a couple years. I will however repeat the old IT adage, “No one has ever got fired for buying Cisco.” They do have an entry level mode your price range the ASA 5505. It is a little $500 for the basic model with a 50 user license. It is not quite at the same level as the 515, but much better than the consumer devices.