Of note, Sam is the only person, in all of the stories, who voluntarily parts with the Ring just because he was asked to. Granted, he hadn’t had it very long at that point, but still.
I’ve been saying for years that he was the real hero.
Didn’t Bilbo give the Ring to Frodo?
Yeah, but it took some major intimidation from Gandalf. With Sam, it was just “Give it back to me” “OK, Frodo, here it is”.
I think Bilbo and Frodo had already shown the had more control over themselves with the ring than anyone else who’d had it (by voluntarily handing it over to Frodo, for example). IIRC Gandalf says this
So I think he thought this meant there was a chance they’d be able to destroy it.
At least in my head, (at least part of) the answer to this is the same as the answer to “Why didn’t Elrond push Isildur in?” or “Could Sam have pushed Frodo in?”: It is essentially impossible for anyone to willingly throw the Ring into the fire—and throwing/dropping/pushing in someone who is holding the Ring counts.
Not to jump too far into the whole Frodo v. Sam as the hero, but I think we’re talking about two different sorts of heroes, and very different circumstances regarding the danger of the ring.
So, first, a tiny bit of the sidetrack, before coming back to the OP’s discussion. IMHO, Frodo is more a Byronic, upper class hero, one doomed to introspection and long suffering, while Sam is a working class hero, embodying the merits of endurance, loyalty, and strength. So they’re both heroes, albeit in different modes. And because of that, they’re vulnerable to the ring in different ways.
Equally IMHO, the danger of the ring is in part directly related to the ambition, desires, and abilities of those exposed to it. Gandalf’s comments, from the same section of the book quoted in the OP:
‘I do really wish to destroy it!’ cried Frodo. ‘Or, well, to have it destroyed. I am not made for perilous quests. I wish I had never seen the Ring! Why did it come to me? Why was I chosen?’
‘Such questions cannot be answered,’ said Gandalf. ‘You may be sure that it was not for any merit that others do not possess: not for power or wisdom, at any rate. But you have been chosen, and you must therefore use such strength and heart and wits as you have.’
‘But I have so little of any of these things! You are wise and powerful. Will you not take the Ring?’
‘No!’ cried Gandalf, springing to his feet. ‘With that power I should have power too great and terrible. And over me the Ring would gain a power still greater and more deadly.’ His eyes flashed and his face was lit as by a fire within. ‘Do not tempt me! For I do not wish to become like the Dark Lord himself. Yet the way of the Ring to my heart is by pity, pity for weakness and the desire of strength to do good. Do not tempt me! I dare not take it, not even to keep it safe, unused. The wish to wield it would be too great, for my strength. I shall have such need of it. Great perils lie before me.’
Frodo is a country gentleman and scholar, utterly lacking in any crass or overt ambition, but those are the very reasons that he is among the safest of those who could be trusted with the Ring. Others, Gandalf, Galadriel, Aragon and (very pointedly) Boromir all have great ambitions that the Ring can prey upon in their search for a greater good.
So Frodo gets to be the suffering hero, bearing the ring, and taking many an additional hurt on each step of the journey until his strength fails him at the last moment, because, that’s the tragedy of his reluctant heroism and struggles. Perhaps, barely, at the point where the quest begins he might have managed (although, like our OP, I have my doubts) - but after the morgul-blade, the tribulations of the trip, Shelob’s venom, and everything else? No, and the foreshadowing with regard to Gollum seems to indicate JRRT didn’t intend it as well.
Sam’s is the role of the loyal (to the death of the master, but still carrying forth said master’s desires) retainer. His virtues and ambitions are thus a bit harder for the Ring to manage, although I absolutely believe that given anything similar to the timeframe (more on this in a second) the other ringbearers were influenced over, would equally have been corrupted. Still, those ambitions to serve, to show loyalty, were key to his easy handing over the ring when he and Frodo were reunited. Some of Sam’s trials were over how his loyalty was challenged and questioned, both in Gollum’s framing of his actions, and how he attempted to carry on the wishes of his master, even as said master was gone during Frodo’s presumed death.
As for the comparative strength of Frodo v. Sam in terms of the Ring’s influence, I know most of the board fans know this, but just in case, didn’t Frodo have the Ring in his possession for nearly two decades from the time Bilbo left to when the section quoted above occurs? Sam bore the ring for a period measured in days, Frodo in decades plus the tribulations of the quest, of course it was easier for him to surrender it. Above and beyond my assumptions of the comparative virtues that he embodies as opposed to Frodo.
So, TL;DR: Frodo was born to suffer and fail tragically but to be saved by the virtues he and the others embody, despite not being of the highest birth and power. He should be respected for doing what he could, and not judged for failing. Sam also spoke to the greatest virtues of his class (from the POV of the era and author) - his role is different, neither better no worse, and both his trials and results reflected that role instead.
“Show me the precious Ring!” he said suddenly in the midst of the story: and Frodo, to his own astonishment, drew out the chain from his pocket, and unfastening the Ring handed it at once to Tom.
Let’s not forget the Ring has its own will.
It allowed Frodo to pass it to more powerful people like Tom Bombadil or Galadriel because it wanted them to take it. The Ring wanted to be worn by a person with more power than Frodo had so it could take them over and wield their power.
Fair comment but, to be fair, Tom kinda breaks all the rules the rest of the world follows.
I know it has been explicitly stated by Tolkien he is not Eru but I still can’t help but think he is.
I’ll offer this theory: Gandalf’s Plan A was to sacrifice Frodo.
Gandalf knew the Ring would be dangerous if it was worn by a powerful person like himself. So he wanted a relatively safe person, who had minimal power, to carry it. This would weaken the Ring and make it safe for a group, including Gandalf, to transport it to Mount Doom. Frodo was essentially a pair of safety gloves.
Gandalf didn’t intend for Frodo to personally throw the Ring into the fire. He didn’t think Frodo would be able to do it. But he figured that the other more powerful people in the group, including himself, would be able to overpower Frodo and throw the Ring in. In the worst case scenario, they would have to kill Frodo in order to do this.
The Ring understood this. So it manipulated events to isolate Frodo from the rest of the group. Its mistake was to underestimate Sam and not see him as a threat.
If that had ever been his plan, he would have murdered Frodo at the outset. Because the kind of person who would make that plan wouldn’t have been able to resist doing so.
Personally, I think that the simplest answer for “Who is Tom Bombadil?” is the one Goldberry gives: “He is.”. He’s a member (the member) of the category of beings who are Tom Bombadil. Nobody else is like him.
Is the Ring sentient?
Yes, absolutely!
(Frodo always had help, but at one point Sam was on his own with the Ring
…)
I am not sure of the timeline but I do not think Frodo was wearing the Ring. He left it in a chest. I do not think the Ring could exert power if not worn or held (except maybe in very subtle ways). Otherwise, it would exert power in some radius…then the whole Fellowship would be under its influence.
Not using it certainly limited the Ring’s power, but he did still claim ownership of it, which gave the Ring some limited amount of influence.
Indeed. JRRT coined the word ‘eucatastrophe’ by which he meant: “a massive turn in fortune from a seemingly unconquerable situation to an unforeseen victory, usually brought by grace rather than heroic effort.” Victory required divine intervention after noble yet ultimately doomed striving.
In terms of LOTR is divine intervention the Maiar, Valar or Eru?
Definitely Eru Iluvatar.
JRRT stated this in a letter, #192. https://bibliothecaveneficae.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/the_letters_of_j.rrtolkien.pdf
“Frodo deserved all honour because he spent every drop of his power of will and body, and that was just sufficient to bring him to the destined point, and no further. Few others, possibly no others of his time, would have got so far. The Other Power then took over: the Writer of the Story (by which I do not mean myself), ‘that one ever-present Person who is never absent and never named’”
I think there is a large excluded middle ground here. I can see somebody being willing to sacrifice a member of the group is it’s necessary to achieve a greater good. Which is not the same as somebody who kills people for shits and giggles.
Which is why I said, in the section you quoted, “in his possession” - or as @Chronos put it, he claimed ownership of it, and likely had it upon his body at all times:
“You do not know the real peril yet; but you shall. I was not sure of it myself when I was last here; but the time has come to speak. Give me the ring for a moment.”
Frodo took it from his breeches-pocket, where it was clasped to a chain that hung from his belt. He unfastened it and handed it slowly to the wizard. It felt suddenly very heavy, as if either it or Frodo himself was in some way reluctant for Gandalf to touch it.
Now I can’t say for sure he spent the whole 17 years (looked it up) with it on his person, or just some portion of it, but that’s (worn or not) a lot of close contact with such a powerful artifact.