Well, that settles it.*
(*This is a practice session on detecting sarcasm.)
Uh, that shows that I do pay attention to the meanings; of course if you are using words in a slightly different way, then is not really my problem, No? (Of course that part quoted makes one wonder… “If we can’t parse when our opponents are make a serious claim”?!? 
)
In any case, thanks for the clarification. But we still do need more than just a hunch to declare what Gohmert was really doing there, we do need a cite with him declaring that he understands at least what nature could be doing, to show that Gohmert is just a bit better than what is assumed, and not just a guy that demands that one gives him a bigger shovel to continue digging his own hole.
Yep, if Gohmert is “sarcastically joking” the issue here is that, as I noted, there is then a big side order of bad faith added to his “rhetoric”.
You disagree because I say so?
(Ah, ambiguity!)
Again, if you’re of the opinion that Gohmert said what he did because he’s just that kind of an idiot, that’s fine. I can’t disprove that.
My post was to point out that you cannot go from what he said to “he thinks it is possible” unless you exclude the use of sarcasm or rhetorical questioning; which is to say, you are assuming as given what is not established by the evidence before us.
Agreed. He’s basically wasting the committee’s time with his little performance.
But I don’t think we should underestimate Louie Gohmert. I think he knows exactly what he’s doing with this question.
Yes, from upthread:
From the perspective of his audience, this is a biting sarcastic attack on the liberal position. His point is that we obviously cannot move the moon - he’s asserting that it’s foolish to think that we can do anything about climate change, because it’s a result of [~natural celestial cycles whatever~].
If there’s then a chorus of liberals who make a lot of noise making fun of him because they don’t get this, and point and laugh because they think he’s seriously suggesting we could move the moon, so much the better in terms of what his audience hears. From the perspective of those who have already been drowned in his side’s propaganda, it makes it look as though the liberals are the dumb ones who just don’t understand the ideas.
If his rhetoric whooshes us so that we are not even acknowledging what he’s really saying, we are obviously not challenging his actual claims effectively. You have to know your enemy.
I think you may be onto something here, besides what I pointed about his assumed fallback position as being not a serious one also.
Still, to be fair , I still expect quotes showing that he does understand what he was doing. So far I think one should not ignore what the recording showed. Until Gohmert or his aids clarify **, it is just Gohmert being a bigger fool that does not understand how the forces he talked about really work.
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Until clarifications from them come, I see a lot of parallels with Trump in relation to “the Corona virus is a hoax” rhetoric. It is true that he clarified and the recordings showed that he was actually calling what the Democrats were declaring about Trump (his ineffectiveness against the pandemic) to be the hoax.
Problem was what Trump did afterwards, he did a very piss poor job of reminding his followers that the virus was not the hoax, and he also did not counter much the disinformation that then did go to cause most of Trump’s followers to conclude that the virus was the hoax anyway.
Gohmert, so far as I know, has not even done the clarification part of his asinine “sarcasm” as Trump and his aids did in the virus case. Seems that the Republicans are starting to not even throw a bone to the smarter ones.
Why would he want to correct your misunderstanding of his rhetoric? He is not talking to you, and the fact that you misunderstand (if it matters at all) only draws favorable attention to him.
Here’s Don Lemon with an accurate take, acknowledging that it’s a stupid joke and moving immediately to challenge the underlying fallacy that natural orbital changes explain climate change; and reinforcing with other evidence that Gohmert is as dumb as a box of rocks.
Still looks like that you are assuming that I did not take what you did say into account, the point is that it does not contradict what I said, this is because I already did what you report Don Lemon did, “challenge the underlying fallacy that natural orbital changes explain climate change”
BTW CNN did report that Gohmert refused to clarify what he said before filing the report. What you missed here is that the point I was making was about what is happening in general, most Republicans in power (or the right wing media) do not bother to clarify anything to the Republicans that already swallowed big lies.
Because they want that public to continue to swallow the Big Lies. Explaining and clarifying would work against that.
Meanwhile Loony Louie is unlikely to ever going to go on the record explaining “this was my rhetorical strategy” because what does it profit him?
Literally no one in this thread is claiming Gohmert is smart, or that he had any kind of a valid or reasonable point. Saying “He doesn’t actually believe we can move the moon,” is not the same as defending the nonsense he’s actually saying.
Did not really say that Gohmert was smart either, just saying that even his assumed fallback, that he does know that nature is controlling the current warming was stupid too (debunked to death decades ago). We are just discussing if he is a general idiot or a very special one, in relative terms.
Why can’t he be both?
Well, I’m getting a lot of flack for looking at both possibilities here. In any case, I do take Ultravires past posts in favor of conservatives and their causes into account to note that he is grasping at straws when trying to make Gohmert sound just like a general idiot and not a special one.
Point here is to let the few conservative Doper guys that they need to face it, voting for guys like Gohmert (that are supported by most Republicans in power now) is not really allowing us to keep our nation a wealthy one. Ignorance really does cost a lot.
Transcript over here:
https://billmoyers.com/api/ajax/?template=ajax-transcript&post=57534
Which makes me question, has he shown any sophistication in his humor, or much of any sense of humor, in his other public ramblings?
The man is a dunce.
This was exemplified by the 2016 campaign where the former shitgibbon-in-chief tried to use parallelism, used to powerful effect in the best speeches of the 20th Century by MLK and Churchill. Had they given such a speech, people would have known that they (inexplicably) thought that Mexico was sending their criminals and their rapists to America.
However, not being one of those two icons, it sounded to many like his usual fumbling incoherence and partial sentences. “They’re sending their criminals. They’re rapists” totally sounds like something he’d actually say even though he didn’t.
That’s because it’s not in any doubt. It’s unambiguously sarcasm, and your refusal to accept that isn’t very convincing when you just completely misunderstood my straightforward use of the word “serious”, and you’ve been attacking straw men throughout your participation in this thread.
This is not worthy of you or the stated mission of the SDMB. I don’t see eye to eye with @Ultravires on many issues either, but that doesn’t mean his straightforward factual claim should not be assessed on its merits. And @UltraVires is clearly not defending Gohmert’s beliefs, he said that he doesn’t agree with him, and he did not describe Gohmert’s rhetoric in a favorable light:
Stop tilting at windmills and read the thread more carefully. Nobody in this thread, including @Ultravires, has suggested that Gohmert’s beliefs have any merit, or that he’s anything other than an idiot. The point is simply that it’s important to understand what bad ideas Gohmert and his audience actually believe.
username/post combination for the win.
I see what you did there.
Gohmert: “I can’t believe that people thought I was serious when I said the Forest Service should change the orbit of the moon. I mean, c’mon, everyone knows that’s a task for … (drum roll) Space Force.”