Louisiana Governor Advises Women Scared of Serial Killer to Get a Gun

Great Debates
41

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I find this attitude to be completely abhorrent and incompatible with someone who values their own life. I can undestand not liking violence and I can even understand not wanting to own a firearm. I can’t understand having so little value for your life or your well being that you’d rather be tortured and murdered then kill the person who is doing it.

I’m not sure why you put bad in parenthesis. Don’t you think that people who torture and murder others are bad or is there some doubt?

I suppose. I have pretty good faith in the ability of others not to hit my automobile but I still wear a seatbelt.

Marc

42

I always find it amusingly ironic, hearing the old saw about “training” to use a firearm being used to dismiss or discourage the ownership thereof.

Yes, I freely admit that training in the weapon’s use is a very good thing, and highly recommended.

But to say, essentially, “I wouldn’t get one because I don’t have the training” or perhaps “he/she shouldn’t get one/own one because he/she probably doesn’t have the training”, and so on.

The typical semiautomatic handgun has possibly as many as four controls, typically half of them are “passive”, meaning they’re engaged/disenaged simply by properly holding the thing with just one hand. For example, the 1911A1 grip safety.

The typical automobile has upwards of twenty controls, and often require the operator to use both hands and both feet simultaneously- such as with a manual transmission- and we hand out licenses to do so to partially-trained teenagers like candy.

And before you say “Yes, but guns are designed to kill”, I suggest you compare automobile-related fatalities vs. firearms-related fatalities.

All of you know how to use that desktop computer you’re staring at right this second, correct? You can hold the frying pan and stir the eggs with a spatula, right?

Then you can use any firearm out there. There’s no mystical aspect to them, they’re inert machines.

And, getting back to the OP, there’s an aspect most have missed, to the Governor’s public statement. And that is, basically, indirectly telling the killer “Hey, she might have a gun next time”. Which may, by itself, just possibly keep the creep from killing again.

43

sigh

I had a feeling someone would come along and equate my “killing machine” comment with every household item that could possibly be used for violence.

The difference, of course, is that you have to actually plunge a knife into a person’s chest (difficult to do on an emotional level), or hold them down while they fight for their life in the bathtub(even tougher). With a gun, you’re essentially pushing a button and making the bad guy go away.

Plus, guns are designed to kill. That’s their sole purpose. As far as I’m concerned, the sole purpose of my steak knife is to cut steak (and it’s not very good at that, either).

Furthurmore, getting a bad or queasy feeling with a gun around the house doesn’t mean I need therapy; it means I know how easy it is to use that instrument to kill someone, and I respect and fear the power of that item. What if someone were to break into my house while I was asleep (not waking me up) and use my own gun to shoot me?

44

And yet, amazingly, they give out medals in the Olympics for using them, and the competition doesn’t involve killing anyone. Imagine that!

45

Why? Why sell women short like this?

What if you had children - would you rather let them die, and be victims as well, all so you don’t have to take the responsibility for defending them - because there is the risk you might kill someone?

The first step is realizing the following things:

  1. Nature wants you to survive.
  2. Nature wants your children to survive.
  3. In fact, you have both a natural right and a responsibility to protect both yourself and those who are under your care.
  4. Not everyone is a beautiful, unique snowflake that deserves life. Some people are pretty fucking evil.
  5. And, to quote something Lynn Bodoni said to me recently:

"Some people just need killin’ "

46

While I will agree with you that it is physically easier to use a gun to kill someone (this is obvious by inspection), I am somewhat bothered by the often-posted argument that the emotional investment is different. This may be, but if it is, I hardly see how it becomes the fault, so to speak, of the weapon. It’s actually a problem - sickness - with the person using it.

Personally, I think having an emotional investment in killing someone that varies depending on the method is a somewhat frightening concept. Attaching a different gravity to killing someone with a knife versus a gun or a cricket bat really seems wrong.

How did you determine that the sole purpose of my guns was to kill? A purpose, yes. A primary purpose - for most guns, yes. The sole purpose? This is a lie straight from the mouth of Eleanor Clift and her ilk.

So knives aren’t designed to kill? Or with a primary purpose in mind of killing? I know it’s nice and comfy in your house in the 21st Century looking idly at your steak knife, but reflect back on the last 8000 years of history for a moment…

Someone breaks into your house, with the intention to kill you, yet brings no weapon themselves? And in the dark, without waking you, searches through your house, finds your gun, and…oh hell, why bother? Don’t you think that that is kinda another strawman argument? :confused:

I think the problem that people have with the ‘queasy’ comment is that it implies two things:

  1. That you fear inanimate objects and attach a sort of evil significance to them. As one anti-gun person here on the SDMB put it long ago: “If crosses can be holy, why can’t guns be evil?”

  2. You don’t trust yourself around dangerous items, and may be at risk of harming yourself at a moment’s notice.

Your comment on respect is very positive. But your fear is unwarranted.

47

I AM scared of guns! Like I said, I’ve never handled one and I wouldnt’ know how to use them. Anthracite, I want to assure you that I in no way mean to shortchange women. If women want to go into combat, we should let em - but I’m not that type of woman. I was talking about me, not all women. Don’t overgeneralize, please.

Secondly, I live all by myself. No hubby and no kids. I have no one to protect. I mean, I WANT to live, I just don’t feel that I have the right to kill anyone under any circumstances - so I won’t. As stated earlier, I wouldn’t know what to do with a gun anyway. It would only scare me.

I generally think of myself as a very open-minded person; however, from this thread I’ve learned otherwise. In most things, other peoples’ ideas, opinions, and experiences (along with, of course, the facts) can sway me. I’ll try anything really. However, this is probably the only thing I don’t see myself changing my mind on - unless, of course, I DO get a family that I need to protect. I still don’t see anything changing, but I’ll admit it’s possible. I mean, I’ll obviously put better locks on the doors and windows and all, but no gun still.

48

Just as you are not required to give up your gun, people who feel uncomfortable around them are not required to carry them. It should never be a requirement of feeling secure to have to carry a gun.

Now, speaking as a good Southern girl whose grandfather taught her how to shoot when she was eight, I still don’t feel 100% comfortable around guns. I can fire one, I can (usually; I’m out of practice) load one. I could probably hit a person if I aimed at them.

At the moment, I also live in a house with a very overinquisitive two-year-old who has an impressive proclivity for opening doors and drawers and such. She’s clever enough to turn computers on and off, change channels, and take DVDs out of the player and put music CDs in. I have no doubt that she could do some real damage with a loaded gun. So we keep the only one we have (small, black, menacing-looking) locked in the handy-dandy gun cabinet next to the back door. Even if she managed to clamber onto the cabinet (and while she is very agile, that would take more strength than even she has), she is not strong enough to open the latch (tricky for we adult types) and continue standing on the shelfy bit. So we’re fairly confident that she’ll be out of the gun cabinet for at least another two or three feet of growth.

Now, the only gun we have is a pellet gun (looks like a pistol, it’s a glorified BB gun, good only for scaring the squirrels and neighborhood dogs away, but in the dark it’s surprisingly gun-shaped) and the selfsame gun cabinet is filled with knives and Renfair swords and such. We have an impressive show of cutlery in there, and some of it could actually conceivably hold up if you were trying to defend yourself with it. Personally, I’d love to be a fly on the wall if a burglar came in at 2 am, thinking no one would be awake, and being greeted by a large, 6-foot plus menacing-looking bald man with a sword. :stuck_out_tongue:

As for women and self-defense: if you feel uncomfortable with a gun, I understand. Take self-defense classes instead. You won’t be caught without your arms and legs, and there’s a lot you can do in order to disable your attacker and get away. Now, the women who were attacked in their own homes were caught at a real disadvantage…this is why, if I feel particularly unsafe, I sleep with a steak knife at close hand.

And as for guns not being made for killing: Guns can be used for sharpshooting and target practice. I did not buy a bow and arrow for use in killing people or animals; I use it for target practice, for building strength and hand-eye coordination. But a bow’s purpose, that for which it was created, is for hunting and for killing. There would be no need for the item without those purposes. The same goes for a gun – it can be used for hunting, for defense, or for sharpshooting practice, but its primary purpose is for one of the first two. And since we are not talking about buying guns for target practice, how can you say these guns are not meant for killing? I guess you can say they’re meant for intimidation, but someone here’s already said that they should be used to kill a potential assailant, not merely to scare him off.

49

Then learn! A gun is tool. A firearm. That’s all.

When my father taught hunter safety education in Indiana, we banned the use of the word “weapon” from the classroom. Because we didn’t teach people how to wield weapons, we taught them how to safely use firearms. To you the difference is trivial, now. But Take a closer look and you’ll see its all the difference in the world. Its the difference between joyriding at 100+ mph down a busy town road and safely driving along.

True, but sometimes life isn’t fair. The police cannot get criminals before they strike. And serial killers are the single hardest type to catch, since all they have is a pattern.

50

Um, the right to own a gun includes the right to NOT own one.

Personally, no one in my family owns a gun-well, except for hunting rifles. And no one has ever needed one. I don’t feel I need one, nor do I want one.

However, I DO think it would have been cool to learn to shoot in GS. However, the reality is that liability would be way too much. At least, that’s why I would think many would object. I remember all the goofing off and silliness that went on when I was a GS. We would be the LAST group you’d want to have guns. :wink:

Hehehe…but seriously, I think training is important.

However, to tell people who don’t feel right owning a gun, or just really don’t want one that they MUST-well, if I respect your right to own a gun, please respect my right to not own one.

(BTW, if anyone cares, I’m really neutral on the subject of guns and all. It’s not an issue that really interests me, to put it bluntly).

51

Ah heck yeah, I would’ve LOVED doing sharpshooting in GS. And I probably would have had the willpower not to peg any of my fellow Brownies…:wink:

52

Okay, a weak strawman was indeed put forth by me (gotta stop doing that) regarding a criminal breaking into my house and using my own gun on me. Very unlikely? Of course.

But you know what? It’s also incredibly unlikely that someone is going to break into your house and try to kill you at all. In fact, there are a plethora of different things that have a higher chance of killing you than an intruder. (On the same token, I concede that it’s also very unlikely that your gun will accidently kill someone, so don’t think I’m trying to be unfair here.)
Everyone is afraid of the bogeyman and preparing themselves for the worst, then half of them will go drive to work without their seatbelts on and think nothing of it. Or maybe they’ll eat three Big Macs a day and kill themselves the slow way. But the governor doesn’t tell us not to eat at McDonald’s and he doesn’t tell us to go take driving classes. He tells us to go get guns.
I’m looking at this issue from more of a risk management standpoint than anything else. If you think you bought your gun for protection, yet you don’t have a security system, bars over the windows, and a very strong door, then you’re either kidding yourself about the purpose of your purchase, or you get a real kick out of vigilante justice.

There’s nothing wrong with a healthy (not paranoid delusional) fear of guns. It’s pretty damn hard to accidently kill yourself or someone else with a knife (especially the crappy, dull ones in my kitchen), but a gun makes it terrifyingly easy. If I had one in my house, the gun would always be in the back of my mind.

It’s not something I want to have to worry about. I’d feel even more strongly this way if I had kids. Despite the best intentions of adults (i.e. locking guns up), kids are clever. What if Junior stubles upon the key to your safe or you don’t notice him looking over your shoulder as you’re entering the combination? Kids are curious and a bit more clever than you think. I’m not saying that this is a likely scenario, but it’s not something I want to have to worry about - at all, so I don’t get a gun.

Now, regarding the target shooting comments: A gun’s primary purpose is to kill. A target’s purpose is to practice your skill at aiming and firing your killing machine. The fact that an internationally respected sport grew out of that activity is neither here nor there.

53

Amen neutron star!!! I second everything you said!

54

Avoiding a big mac and taking a driving class won’t protect you from a serial killer, will it? Maybe if the question at hand was, “Governor, how do I avoid getting fat?” or “Sir, how do I improve my driving skills?” then one of those pieces of advice would be relevant.

Do you own your home? Not everybody does, you know, and putting bars on the windows, etc is not an option that everybody has.

Do you worry about junior getting your car keys and driving into oncoming traffic? Your kids can find a thousand different ways to kill themselves. The solution is not locking them in a box to protect them from life. You teach them how to behave. The same goes for guns. I have been around guns and have been shooting since I was a small child. I knew where the guns were kept, including the one he kept in the headboard in case there was an intruder. And I never messed with any of them without his guidance.

Again, so what? Self-defense is a basic human right. Do you expect people to use sharp sticks?

55

This is neither here nor there, neutron star, but for your own safety you should know that a sharp household knife is much safer than a dull one.

56

I think the efficacy of a gun could be reduced by the modus operandi of the killer. There were no signs of forced entry at two of the women’s homes where they were killed. It’s possible they had no reason to fear the killer until it was too late.

Even if they’d had a gun under their pillow, it might not do them any good once they’re caught in a stranglehold in another room. The killer either stangled or knifed the women. The killer attacked at close range. I think self defense could have done a lot for these women.

Of course, regardless of the governor’s urgings, women were buying guns anyway. It is Louisiana after all. If I were in their shoes, I would buy the gun, then take the self defense course.

57

And here we have what appears to be the perfect solution!

Learn to defend yourself unarmed, then arm yourself.

58

And with any luck the “target” will be one serial killer who seems to hang out in Lousiana.

59

Once I could defend myself I would get rid of the gun though. The gun is just a short term solution in my mind. Gun or no gun, women have to try to equalize the size and strength advantage that men have.

More women have died from domestic violence in Louisiana than serial killers. If there’s a gun in the house, they probably won’t be the ones who get to use it.

I think the governor should have been advising women to be more wary of strangers rather simply tell them to get a gun. The killer apparently gained the trust of these women before he entered their homes. Better that he (I bet the killer’s male) never enters the house to begin with.

60

A safe assumption - there are very few known female serial killers, and fewer still that kill other women. In fact, in looking through my database of serial killers ( a real “killer app”), I can find no females who only killed other females in serial fashion. I think there was a lesbian “spree killer” once…or am I thinking ahead again?