Now, if the foreman actually said this, it would be glorious!
Well, they’re fine with American institutions and the rule of law, as long as they get their way. When they don’t, it’s because of corruption, cheating, something, something.
In fairness, there are some intelligent people over there on that board, but they tend to be of the STEM sort—engineers, physicians, people to whom things are only ever black or white. That’s how they interpret the world: everything is binary, with no room in the middle. There are no shades of grey. You either love Trump and all he stands for with all your heart, as a patriotic American should, or you’re a communist marxist socialist working to destroy the United States. You cannot possibly support abortion rights for women while at the same time supporting deporting illegal immigrants, for example. It’s all or nothing to them.
The fact that the law is kind of “mushy” bothers them. Why is it not clearer; why is it not clear-cut black or white? Why does it all depend on who can make a better argument? Why can it not be as simple as solving a problem by designing a bridge or writing a prescription? It either is or it isn’t, and that’s all there should be to it. There’s no in-between with those folks.
My big concern about an apparently too-fast guilty verdict is that MAGATs will be convinced that the outcome was predetermined. Though at the end of the day their opinions shouldn’t matter a damn bit.
Okay, my heart leapt when I misread that as: “just in case we get a quick vote.”
MAGAts will be convinced of a conspiracy no matter what.
Incidentally, the jury in the OJ Simpson trial reached their (wrong) verdict in less than four hours. We can only hope that this jury possesses more brain power and is more cognizant of the facts.
This is true, of course, and the only outcome that they will accept is an acquittal.
The MAGATs are going to say that no matter how long the jury takes. It’s an immutable fact.
With an apology from the judge, and a ritual beheading of the prosecutor.
hmm…I wonder if we can analyze the jury’s lunch menus to get an idea of what’s going on in the jury room. ? 
(Like the possibly urban legend about how, in the first Gulf war (1991), reporters noticed that there was a huge increase in orders of pizza being delivered to the Pentagon late at night, and realized that the war would start within hours.)
That’s the part I’m having trouble with. I think most people have secrets they don’t want divulged. It’s not illegal to have sex outside of marriage. It’s not illegal to pay the person to keep her mouth shut. Is it really election interference if you do these not-illegal things? If all of this money-shuffling ended up in a campaign contribution, then is that, while illegal, election interference?
I got this from a different site. Almost enough to make me want to do jury duty in Manhattan.
"Jurors at the Manhattan Criminal Court, located at 100 Centre Street, have a variety of nearby dining options. Popular choices include:
- Gotan: Known for its salads, sandwiches, and all-day breakfast options.
- Xi’an Famous Foods: Famous for its spicy cumin lamb noodles and burger sandwiches.
- Tasty Hand-Pulled Noodles: Offers hand-pulled and knife-cut noodles in Chinatown.
- Nha Trang One: A favorite for pho and other Vietnamese dishes.
In previous trials, jurors have typically had catered meals or vouchers for local restaurants, although specific details are not usually disclosed for privacy reasons [❞] [[❞]]"
True. And I really don’t want to hijack this thread so please folks don’t go off on a tangent but lately when I listen to the right wing radio (which I rarely do for short periods of time when the legit stations are running commercials) they are going off about how the FBI tried to assassinate Trump because they had guns when raiding his home for classified documents.
Somehow the idea that law enforcement carries guns is evidence of an evil conspiracy. This is coming from the gun-loving blue lives matter Republican side. No conspiracy is too crazy for them.
Don’t worry about anything here spurring a conspiracy among Trump supporters because it will no matter what. They could take an hour or days to deliberate and either way they will find a way to make it nefarious, especially if there is a single guilty finding.
“Eleven sandwiches and one wrap…eleven Cokes and one Pepsi…”
Damn. I was on a ~seven week federal jury with 2+ days of deliberations and all we got were some adequate deli sandwiches, no choice of restaurant. Stupid, pampered New Yorkers 
.
By the way, this really could go on for days. The more impatient among us might want to preemptively work on their Zen states.
“Election interference” is not a crime, per se. The thing that Comey did with the announcement about investigating Ms Clinton was election interference, but it was apparently all on the up and up. The actual crime here was defrauding the FEC with a false campaign contribution report (omission).
The fraudlent business accounting is a misdemeanor which is past its statute of limitations, in and of itself. The DA asserts that the fraudlent accounting was undertaken as a means to hide the FEC fraud, which elevates the misdemeanor to a felony (trying to cover up a crime may be worse than the crime itself).
Hence, in order to return a guilty verdict, the jury must agree that the underlying offense (FEC fraud) did occur and therefore the crime in question (accounting fraud) constitutes felonious obfuscation of the underlying offense.
It’s illegal to do so if you’re doing it to protect your campaign and don’t report it. It’s illegal to misreport it to evade taxes. Those are illegal things.
It’s just like when Martha Stewart lied to investigators because she was afraid to go to prison for insider trading. Ironically, she wouldn’t have if she had just been honest but ended up in jail for the cover-up. Or if Trump had given back the documents he took when asked to and didn’t try to hide that he had them, like Biden and Pence did, he wouldn’t have been charged.
Sometimes when you hide what you’re doing from the authorities that in itself is a crime.
There are many things that are legal by themselves but not legal as part of an election campaign. It’s legal for me to give you ten bucks, but not for me to say, “I’ll give you ten bucks if you promise to vote for me.” It’s legal for me to buy you an airline ticket, but if I do it in an effort to help your political campaign, I have to treat it as a campaign contribution, and if I don’t, it’s an illegal contribution.
As I understand it, that’s where this is, and that’s why his intent is so important. It’s legal for him to pay off Daniels. But if he’s doing it to increase his electoral chances, it’s a campaign expense, and needs to be reported as such.
If he’s failing to report it as such because he wants to influence the campaign, then the action of mislabeling the expense is an illegal action taken in order to influence the campaign, which moves it into felony illegality.
Thank you for the responses to my question about jury deliberations. So, what is the process for sentencing? If Trump is found guilty, will the judge sentence him immediately, or will that be delayed to a future session? If delayed, what will happen to Trump in the meantime? Will he be held in custody or released? Maybe it depends on the charges…
Typically the sentencing will be scheduled at a later date. Lawyers for both sides will make recommendations.
If he’s found guilty, sentencing would come later. Unlike TV and movies, lawyers need time to create and craft their sentencing arguments. That can take time, especially with such a celebrity defendant.
Trump would likely be free in the interim, on his own recognizance. He could campaign, play golf, attend debates, play golf, hold a rally, play golf … You get the idea.
It depends.
If found guilty, sentencing may take place immediately or the case may be adjourned and a sentencing date set.
I’m pretty confident for a case like this that it’ll be scheduled for later. This isn’t a random guy with parking violations.