Mark 16:9

A poster on another board, the topic of which was questioning the authenticity of the last 12 verses in the book of Mark, wrote that it doesn’t really matter because there is no doctrinal teaching in Mark 16:9-20 that cannot be proved elsewhere in agreed Scripture.
I made the mistake of sticking my nose into the discussion by pointing out that actually there is a statement in verse 9, as the KJV and similar versions have it, that is to be found nowhere else in Scripture that is used to support a doctrinal teaching. As the KJV translates it, it is the only place that puts the resurrection on the first day of the week. I then suggested that whenever the discussion of seventh day observance versus first day observance comes up, it has generally been my experience that first day proponents many times use the idea of a first day resurrection to justify the change of observance from the seventh day to the first day, and when questioned about the day of resurrection, frequently quote Mark 16:9. The poster came back with: “Quote a published author who has done that.” - I have not yet been able to come up with one. Does anyone here know of one?

Quote a published author who has done what, exactly?

I say what in the OP.

“Mark” is a published author.

I’m afraid I don’t see where Mark argues for a change of observance from the seventh day to the first day because of the idea of a first day resurrection.

I would suggest to you this is a fight that is just not worth fighting.

It seems to me that it has been going on forever and will most likely continue to be going on until the end of time.

If your opponent were ever to agree with you as the the meaning of you point, they would then turn around and argue about which day is the first day and which day is the seventh day.

I’m guessing you likely thought that point was well established and would never need to be argued again. Well, on the religious battlefield, nothing is ever well established and nothing is ever finally agreed.

Now, it is almost certainly a mistake for me to stick my nose into this religous battle, but I have nothing really better to do for the rest of my life and that is probably what it would take to help you argue your point.

But, I am fully willing to support your initial contention that it was a mistake for you to enter that fight and if I may make a further suggestion, run away while you still have time!

References to the resurection on the first day of the week are numerous in the NT

Acts 20: 7 and I Corinthians 16: 2 make reference to observance by the early Christians on the first day of the week.

http://www.biblegateway.com/keyword/?search=first%20day%20of%20the%20week&version1=31&searchtype=all&wholewordsonly=yes

I am not sure what you think you are claiming.

Judaism worships on the Sabbath (seventh) day–Saturday in current English usage.
Christianity worships on the first day–Sunday in current English usage–and has done so from the earliest days. The whole point of worshipping on Sunday, the first day of the week, is to celebrate the Resurrection and, as The Flying Dutchman has pointed out, that connection is mentioned several times in Scripture–including in the undisputed passage of Mark that precedes the contested passage and in Paul’s letter to the Corinthians that predates all of the Gospels.

I’m not sure how many on this board are aware of the sometimes ferocious arguments around which day is the “correct” day to celebrate the “Christian Sabbath.”

Anyway, I’d say if you’re just looking for a “published author” to chat up the discussion (I think that’s what you want based on your OP), just dip into the really conservative circles.

Off the top of my head, Harold Camping is one of the most dogmatic about this–and everything else, in the Gospel According to Camping.

Of course, after he crapped out with 1994 and 2011, he may have lost what tiny credibility he had. But if you just need to defend your honor with any published author who wants to quote Mark 16:9 in defense of a first day Christian Sabbath, here’s Mr Camping’s treatise on it. P 12 or so…

Actually, all four gospels agree that the resurrection took place on the first day of the week. I don’t know what you are talking about when you say about Mark 16:9 “it is the only place that puts the resurrection on the first day of the week.”

Just look at how all the resurrection narratives begin (including Mark 16:2, which is undisputed, and is NOT part of the disputed longer ending of Mark that was added after Mark 16:8):

“Now after the Sabbath, at dawn on the first day of the week, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to look at the tomb. . . .”
(Matthew 28:1ff)

“Now very early on the first day of the week, while it was still dark, Mary Magdalene came to the tomb and saw that the stone had been moved away from the entrance. . . .”
(John 20:1ff)

“And very early on the first day of the week, when the sun had risen, they went to the tomb. . . .”
(Mark 16:2ff)

“But on the first day of the week, at early dawn, they came to the tomb, taking the spices that they had prepared. . . ”
(Luke 24:1ff)

The Flying Dutchman,

re: “References to the resurection on the first day of the week are numerous in the NT”

I’m not aware of any scripture other that Mark 16:9 that states that the resurrection took place on the first day of the week. What do you have in mind?

ragerdude,

re: "Actually, all four gospels agree that the resurrection took place on the first day of the week. "

None of your references say that the resurrection took place on the first day of the week. They only say that the women came to the tomb on the first day.

tomndebb,

re: “I am not sure what you think you are claiming.”

I’m claiming exactly what I stated in the OP.

Okay, I get what you are saying.

Sometimes you’ve got to read with context.

If you go to Mathew 27 you’ll note that a guard was specifically posted at the entrance to the tomb at the request of Jewish leaders based on a reported prediction by Jesus that he would arise in three days. Keep in mind that according to Jewish tradition a day begins at sundown. The first day of the week begins Saturday evening at sundown. So if Jesus arose any earlier than Saturday evening, I’m sure the posted guard would have noticed and all hell would have broken loose.

The Flying Dutchman,

re: “…if Jesus arose any earlier than Saturday evening, I’m sure the posted guard would have noticed…”

If the stone hadn’t been removed at the time of the resurrection, how would the guards have known when it occurred?

BTW, “Saturday evening” would be the start of the seventh day and not the end of it.

Where does any of this show that Jesus was resurrected on the first day of the week? These passages just show that people came looking for him early “Sunday” morning and he had already been resurrected (presumably in the middle of the night- Saturday). We still may not be able to assume a Saturday resurrection, but the above verses do not prove a Sunday one.

Middle of the night would already be Sunday by Jewish reckoning - their day ends at sunset.

I see the problem, now.

The seventh day is the day that we call Saturday. If you think that the seventh day starts on Saturday evening, (against all Jewish tradition), then you are simply misinformed about the numbering of the days of the week.

Note the allusion to the days in Genesis 1 (using the KJV): “And the evening and the morning were the [xth] day”.
Note that God rests on the seventh day: “And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.”
Note the day of the week that Judaism celebrates as the Sabbath and the day of rest: Saturday.
Jewish Shabbat (Shabbath, Shabbos, Shabbes, Shobos, etc.) is a weekly day of rest, observed from sundown on Friday until the appearance of three stars in the sky on Saturday night, . . .

I have no idea where the idea that the seventh day starts on Saturday evening came from, but it is out of step with a couple of thousand years of Jewish practice. Given that misunderstanding, I can sort of see the question in the OP, but clearing up the error resolves the question.

(Whether Christians should have moved the day of worship from the seventh day to the first day is a separate argument that can be hammered out at unending length, but the numbering of the days is not really open to question.)

True. But if you believe every thing that has been written you’d bet that God wouldn’t keep Jesus cooling his heels in the tomb on the Jewish sabbath, especially after he’s just come back from hell.

Are you Jewish ? Is their “Saturday evening” the night before our Saturday evening?

PS I see that Tomndebb addressed this.

“Saturday eve” is the night before, on Friday. “Saturday evening” is on Saturday.