After figuring out that theatre doesn’t really lead anywhere (:() I decided I needed some more uni. I’ve been accepted onto several courses that are pretty good, but now I’m having trouble with how to decide between them.
Specifically, I’d like to know people here feel about the difference between an MA and an MSc. If the course title and reputation of the university are pretty much the same, do you care?
Case in point:
University of Amsterdam MSc
Conflict Studies and Governance
Utrecht University MA
Conflict Resolution and Human Rights
I realise you probably don’t know Dutch unis, but they’re both very decent and also affordable. (I was offered a place at the Clingendael Institute, but it costs 10x as much and they can’t seem to explain to me why they are worth 10x as much.)
So… if you were hiring, would it make a difference? The courses are really similar in content and reputation. I think.
For me, ‘MSc’ suggests orientation with natural and applied sciences (physics, engineering, etc…), while ‘MA’ is anything more in the realm of social science and humanities. That said, though, there is often a fairly large grey area between the two…
For a degree title along the lines of ‘Conflict Studies and Governance’, I would instinctively assume an MA would be more appropriate, as surely that kind of thing refers to *people *and society (and how they work).
So, to see “MSc Conflict Studies and Governance” might surprise me as potential employer, but I doubt it would put me off necessarily; to be honest, I think I might just be vaguely intrigued.
I think the MSc implies a little more familiarity with statistics, SPSS, research, that sort of thing. They want me to do a sort of SPSS/statistics pre-master. I don’t think the actual difference in the course is that much, and it’s a somewhat unclear how much I’d actually use SPSS on the course.
Or how much I’d use SPSS on a job after uni, for that matter. I suppose if I end up doing research in that direction? I really have no idea.
I’m doing the pre-master anyway. It’s not expensive, and it seems like a skill to put on my CV… And I was always good at maths and statistics. Well… ahem… at school anyway. And compared to other actors. So probably not then. We’ll see!
I don’t think anyone has ever noticed that I have a BA (in math). My only other degree is PhD and that doesn’t specify faculty since it is a degree awarded by the university, not a school or faculty. Frankly, I don’t think it makes a particle of difference.
I have an MPhil and a Drs. from Leiden University. As for the MSc and MA thing, AFAIK it is up to the university to decide what they call their programs (I think the equivalent of my MPhil is now an MSc, only a few years later). Having one or the other suggests literally nothing.
As for Clingendael, I’m familiar with the program and it’s not that exciting, certainly not 10 times more than the other programs. The reason it is so much more expensive is that they don’t have government accreditation or funding so they have to ask for a ton of money to make up the difference.
Thanks a thousand-billion for saying that, I feel so much better for deciding against it. The Clingendael is a big deal to the family, and they were rather excited I was admitted.
What I can’t work out is, and you might be able to help here:
Looking at the QS scores for “International Relations/studies etc”, Leiden scores quite a bit higher than both Amsterdam and Utrecht. I’m guessing that is the Clingendael, and not the regular programme? Both are literally called “International Relations” (though Clingendael adds “and Diplomacy”). Do you know if International Relations at Leiden is any good? (I don’t put that much stock in those rankings, but at least it’s some kind of indication.) I’ve been at Leiden for the last year, and it is friendly and small, but the quality varies enormously. African Studies may as well be booted out, while other courses were very good.
I will echo what Svejk said about the MIRD program in Leiden. I happen to be fairly familiar with the Leiden Polisci programs, and this program isn’t any better than the others. Truth be told, the profs that are connected to this program, fall a bit ‘outside’ the department and they rely on many temporary teachers (thing may have changed the last couple of years though).
The research master and standard master programs are ok though, but many students from the MIRD (in combination with Clingendael) will tell you it’s not what they expected (especially with the higher fee).
I happen to know someone who did the Utrecht course as wel. I got mixed reviews. It is interesteing, but since Utrecht university doesn’t have undergrad Polisci or IR, it seems a bit like they lump students together with different backgrounds. This could be considered a pro or a con. But you probably have a bit of a lack of academic infrastructure (number of teachers that are fulltime at Utrecht University). It is a pretty strict procedure to get one of the spots though, so they don’t just allow anyone to start.
Thanks polar bear, this is really helpful! You wouldn’t also happen to know about the Amsterdam course? One thing I am also considering is that for Amsterdam, you do the dissertation as a sort of joint research project, whereas in Utrecht it’s individual (I think). I have a friend whose experience was not great with the joint approach. Any thoughts?
Started the pre-master today in Amsterdam, and that was good. I’m not sure how much it says about what the course will be like. I suppose some research methodology is always good though.
If anyone has some further thoughts on hiring someone with an MA vs hiring someone with an MSc, I’d love to hear them!
I have an international relations type MA, and could have received an Msc instead with the exact same coursework. It’s really very arbitrary.
Employers are aware of this, and at that level they will be more interested in your research and focus topics than the name of your degree. There are some cultural considerations in some areas- my understanding is India prefers MAs, seeing Msc’s as somewhat vocational, but for the most part it doesn’t matter.
In Leiden it used to depend on the program, but a couple years ago ‘they’ decided that all Master Programs at the faculty of Social Sciences would become MSc (for Poli Sci it used to be MA or MPhil). In Amsterdam they have been awarding MSc’s since they switched to the BaMa system. In Holland a Master is a Master and I doubt employers know the difference…
The letters mean absolutely nothing, as the curriculum didn’t change at all (at Leiden PoliSci). I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the faculty didn’t notice untill they were signing diplomas.
