Sorry, that was meant for the election thread.
Well now they’re working to talk to Pennsylvania lawmakers too.
Michigan, Pennsylvania…I’m sensing a pattern here. These states seem to have something in common, but I can’t quite put my finger on it…
Dude, seriously, stop hoping for decency and honor – that train left the fucking station a long time ago.
There is absolutely NO honor and decency to be found.
I’ll spell it out for you: they are hoping that state executives will refuse to certify elections and that state legislatures will vote for their own slates of electors and create a “lawfully” contested election. They can’t just order the military to take over the country, but they can manufacture a political crisis. If it’s contested, it could end up in the House, where Republicans could conceivably win a vote along partisan lines because they have more state delegations.
At minimum, it would create massive confusion - the fact that there is at least a coherent constitutional argument to be woven from it (even if most constitutional scholars flatly reject it) would give the political hijackers a little more cover, as they could argue that what they’re doing isn’t popular, but it’s still constitutional.
In short, we’re very close to having a horribly divisive contested election like what we had in 1876, but unlike 1876, few people have brought forward credible allegations of voter intimidation and elections fraud such as the kind that the Southern Democrats engaged through racial terror. What we are witnessing right this minute is a direct assault on American democracy itself.
The way my husband put it, “I was wrong about Republicans. I now take back any caveat I ever used when condemning them.”
A reporter asked Senate Majority Leader Mike Shirkey, after he landed in DC, outrageous questions like “Why are you here in Washington?” and “Will you honor the will of the Michigan voters?” and he started singing “The Old Rugged Cross”, a hymn about persecution. So the answer to the above is yeah, probably not.
Video here:
Indeed - and if it gets to the point where the House has a vote, and votes for Trump (as Powerball-unlikely odds as it is right now), you could even argue that the constitutional ball would be more in Biden’s court than Trump’s by that point. It could be Biden that might have a harder constitutional time dislodging Trump from power in that scenario than vice versa.
Constitutional does not = fair.
It’s the old domino theory. Once the first one goes, others will follow, probably Pennsylvania and either Wisconsin or Arizona as the third.
Incorrect - the House delegations favor Trump, not Biden.
If the election is contested, and if Biden can’t win the majority of delegates, then it could go to a House vote. But it’s not a straight House vote; it’s a vote by delegation. Republicans have a majority in 26 states (for now); Democrats maybe have 24.
It’s very obvious what Trump is trying to do. He’s trying to claim that even though he didn’t win the election, he can still find a constitutionally valid argument for staying in power. Bear in mind, that will probably be the death of voting and elections as we know it in America if that should come to pass.
It’s not too long a shot - not when you are a cult posing as a political party. The GOP “leaders” in those states have been on the tea party and Trump train for the better part of a decade. They have aligned with his voters and his brand. And they have seen what happens to political careers when they cross him - those careers come to a screeching halt.
Right. And in 1876 there were many veterans of the Civil War still around who had direct experience in putting down a rebellion. We are lacking in such a group at this time.
Look, if 73 million people are cool with ending democracy…that’s a problem that really can’t be fixed. Maybe this is it.
By “Powerball-low” odds, I meant the odds of it getting to the House in the first place, not the odds of the House voting for Trump.
It is his likeliest and only way to win. You can’t just declare a coup in America, it has to have a good constitutional veneer to it in order to prevail.
Just an article that helps us understand that this was either The Plan from fairly early on, or just one of the contingencies that DJT was ‘strongly’ considering.
I don’t know which way this thing is going – not even a good guess – but I view it as:
- distinctly possible
- fairly improbable
- and with disastrous associated consequences
Hey, @asahi … first, you’ve been hitting it out of the park. Kudos. Second, can you think of anything substantive, feasible, and possibly efficacious that average citizens can do … today ?
Any Trump supporters on the board think this is unAmerican?
Anyone?
Just speak up any time.
McEnBlarney said it’s a routine meeting.
You would not be alone, except maybe for being the only person with an actual pitchfork and torch.
Rather than abide this protracted and awkward silence, may I offer this very catchy tune – one I’ve taught to several big parrots:
Keep in mind who you’re dealing with - acknowledge that these are people who are behaving in a way that is foreign to most of us. Most of us have taken our democracy for granted, assuming that we all understand and play by the same rules. One of the things that anti-democrats (authoritarians) do, one of the advantages they have, is that they already know that they are playing by a completely different set of rules.
Ideally, the best way we could have dealt with them was to never have voted for these mother fuckers to begin with. Unfortunately, we can’t necessarily control that. I’ll submit that not everyone who voted for Trump and the GOP necessarily advocated quite this…but it doesn’t matter because they are in office now and have very real power.
So now that that train has left the station, there is really only one language they are going to understand. I don’t necessarily mean violence, but they have to be confronted with force somehow. Again, they are playing by an entirely different understanding of “the rules.” And they will continue to play that way until they are threatened with a price they are not willing to pay.
Opie: “Paw, what should we do if Trump doesn’t step down, or steals the election?”
Andy: “You ever hear how Mussolini’s transition went?”