Minimum civilian proximity tolerated by a US Navy aircraft carrier

Factual Questions
1

Hey

I don’t know how often I can post new questions before I start annoying people, but I’m new and I have several to get out of my system…

Anyway, I live in Victoria, BC and last summer the US Navy parked the USS John C. Stennis (CVN 74) about 500m off shore. I went down for a look because it’s not every day a Canuck like me gets to have a good look at one of the most powerful war machines ever created.

While it was there I noticed that in the surrounding waters life went on as usual. There were some little sailboats bobbing around and I think I saw a windsurfer. None got that close, of course.

My question is, how close can a civilian actually get to one of these ships? How close do I have to get in my zodiac or while swimming before people start getting excited? What happens?

Thanks

2

The distance is whatever the Captain says it is, and ditto the warning procedures. I’m sure there’s a regulation that suggests a distance, but the Captain has a lot of latitude to change this. If you break the boundary, you may get a warning from a bullhorn. If you continue to approach, you may get warning shots from an M-16 or a heavier machine gun. However, some ships in some conditions may just go straight to shooting. For example, a Navy friend of mine mentioned a low-profile night deployment where the waterway they were using had been closed down to public boat traffic. The orders were that any boat they saw out there was a hostile, and if it got inside the zone, it was forfeit (since a warning would violate their main mission - getting out of port undetected). I don’t know if they had to act on that or not.

Also, if you are tear-assing right towards the ship in a zodiac with your beard flapping in the wind and an “Allah is all-powerful” T-shirt, your first warning might be that they sink you, send a rescue team, and take you aboard so they can fill out the forms to reimburse you for the boat. Yeah… reimburse you. That’s it.

Usually ship security procedures – especially standoff distances and how many warnings you get – are closely held (my Navy buddy wouldn’t tell me what the range was). If there’s a sailor who knows it’s okay to answer this, he should go right ahead, but it’s the kind of answer that could help plan an attack.

3

It’s most probably changed since I was an indentured bilge rat but yeah, what Jurph said: Captain’s choice. But a lot would depend on which port. Since we’re not going to invade Canada until after Iran and depending on your gender and swimsuit you may have been able to get close enough to sell coconuts.

4

Hmmm… coconuts are a little sparse around here. The only one I have will have to go into constructing my swimsuit. How about smoked salmon, we got tons!

5

[QUOTE=Shamozzle]
Hmmm… coconuts are a little sparse around here. The only one I have will have to go into constructing my swimsuit. How about smoked salmon, we got tons!
[/QUOTE]
You already have palm trees; how much more difficult can coconuts be? :slight_smile:

(Still jealous that my aunt used to live on the Island and phone us in mid-February that her flowers were in bloom while we in Ontario still had 40cm of snow. Fate got back at my aunt, though; she moved to the Bruce Peninsula and was snowed in for two weeks this past winter.)

6

[QUOTE=Shamozzle]
My question is, how close can a civilian actually get to one of these ships? How close do I have to get in my zodiac or while swimming before people start getting excited? What happens?
[/QUOTE]
It’s whatever the Canadian Government says it is. What they say, I have no idea. However, a U.S. ship will defend itself in foreign territorial waters if need be. What is need be? That’s up to the Navy and, even if I did know, I certainly wouldn’t post it.

As for U.S. territorial waters, federal regulations address this. The Naval Vessel Protection Zone extends out 500 yards from the ship. This zone is in effect while the ship is underway, moored, anchored, you name it, with rare exception.

Basically, vessels may enter the 500 yard perimeter, but may only do so at minimum safe speed. Vessels are prohibited from getting closer than 100 yards unless said vessel has explicit approval from the Coast Guard (who will likely have vessels on scene for security), the senior naval officer present in command, or official patrol.

The zones are taken very seriously. The USS Cole, tanker Limburg, and several attempted suicide boat attacks in Iraq serve as gruesome reminders that the threat by boat is very real.

7

[QUOTE=Scruloose]
It’s whatever the Canadian Government says it is. What they say, I have no idea. However, a U.S. ship will defend itself in foreign territorial waters if need be. What is need be? That’s up to the Navy and, even if I did know, I certainly wouldn’t post it.

As for U.S. territorial waters, federal regulations address this. The Naval Vessel Protection Zone extends out 500 yards from the ship. This zone is in effect while the ship is underway, moored, anchored, you name it, with rare exception.

Basically, vessels may enter the 500 yard perimeter, but may only do so at minimum safe speed. Vessels are prohibited from getting closer than 100 yards unless said vessel has explicit approval from the Coast Guard (who will likely have vessels on scene for security), the senior naval officer present in command, or official patrol.

The zones are taken very seriously. The USS Cole, tanker Limburg, and several attempted suicide boat attacks in Iraq serve as gruesome reminders that the threat by boat is very real.
[/QUOTE]

Very interesting, thanks for that answer.

8

You’re welcome.

9

[QUOTE=Sunspace]
You already have palm trees; how much more difficult can coconuts be? :slight_smile:

(Still jealous that my aunt used to live on the Island and phone us in mid-February that her flowers were in bloom while we in Ontario still had 40cm of snow. Fate got back at my aunt, though; she moved to the Bruce Peninsula and was snowed in for two weeks this past winter.)
[/QUOTE]

Well, I don’t know about palm trees but we do have monkey puzzle trees which are fairly amusing, monkey or not.

I actually moved here fairly recently from the Alberta oil fields and the climate is indeed a nice relief. Also, It’s pretty funny when the city literally falls to its knees by way of a two inch snowfall.

10

I remember being on a guided missile cruiser back in the late 80’s as a midshipman. For some reason, we had gotten underway from the pier in San Diego and dropped anchor somewhere in the bay to run GQ* (General Quarters) drills. As a 3rd class midshipman, my GQ station was with my running mate, who manned one of the .50-calibre machine guns mounted on the side of the ship.

We didn’t have much to do during the drill other than man that machine gun. I’m pretty sure we had ammo, but the gun certainly wasn’t loaded. Anyway, as we sat moored in the bay hour after hour, we passed the time by aiming the machine gun as the various sailboats that went by. :slight_smile: (If this seems childish, it was. I was 18 years old and my running mate was a 2nd class petty officer who was about 22. Both of us were bored out of our skulls as well.)

Anyway, I remember one sailboat in particular that got particularly close. It was coming straight for us, about 250 yards away, when the master noticed the .50 cal tracking it. The guy threw his rudder over so hard that he almost capsized. :smiley:

*The submarine force refers to GQ as “battlestations.”

11

When the USS Ronald Reagan was parked offshore here, I’m pretty sure I approached closer than 500 yards, but I kept a close eye to make sure I wasn’t pissing anybody off (no warning shots over the bow). They probably figured I couldn’t pack a ton of explosives on an 18 foot Hobie catamaran. On the other hand, that boat is so friggen’ huge, I could have misinterpreted the distances involved.

OK, upon looking at Scruloose’s post, I can see I wasn’t violating any law.

12

[QUOTE=Shamozzle]
Also, It’s pretty funny when the city literally falls to its knees by way of a two inch snowfall.
[/QUOTE]

That’s rather baffling.

13

[QUOTE=Andy]
That’s rather baffling.
[/QUOTE]

You and me both.

Here’s why it happens:

The snow is compressed into a slick sheet on the streets before it can be removed.

The weather is usually mild and after a day/night-melt/freeze cycle the roads are like ice rinks.

The city lacks the resources to sand or salt the ice in a timely manner because it is required so rarely.

Unlike the vast majority of Canadians, people in Victoria don’t bother to put winter tires on their vehicles. Also, even if they had winter tires, they are horrible snow/ice drivers because they do it so rarely.

Thus, driving is absolute treachery.

Knowing this, a remarkable percentage of the population doesn’t go to work. And they can’t take public transit because the city buses stay off the roads as well.

So, no workers, no consumers, no commerce, and so on…

I should point out that this happens rarely, maybe once every 5 to 10 years, and it typically takes 4 to 6 inches of snow. When I mentioned 2 inches prior I was being
facetious.

I’m originally from semi-northern Canada and I find this all hilarious. In my last job I was driving an $800,000, 25-ton truck at 110km/h through dense forest on winding, icy, single-track logging roads through semi-blizzard conditions, at night.

I find it all pretty funny