I’ll invite Ellen Cherry and the other IMHO mods to comment.
Better mind your own neck there, Robespierre.
I’d be hesitant with your definition, LHoD. The “threadshitting” one seems hard and fast with at least something of an objective component while the “more interesting” standard seems 100% subjective–how can you debate a mod who says “X viewpoint doesn’t make the board more interesting to me”? I can think of a few mods (not necessarily here or not) who would use that as an excuse to shut down discussions or polls they don’t like.
I see what you’re getting at, but I disagree with that implementation.
So, if I can find one from this hyear it will become valid?
Oh, yes, the Terror, when the streets of Paris ran with warnings, and nobody knew who would next be forbidden from posting on a messageboard.
I’m not saying it’s fine and dandy if it’s old; I’m saying that if there are no recent examples maybe it’s not a pressing issue. For the record I’ll say I did find an instance from last August and another from two years ago.
Marley, I appreciate your willingness to look at this issue more closely, but I think it’s a lost cause. I don’t think banning sexism is a solution, or any other -ism, because these issues have to see the light of day or else they will fester.
I’m honestly surprised you did not realize this was an issue until now. The general culture of sexism here has been pretty much taken as a given at Dopefests and such. This whole thing has gotten really ugly, but I don’t know if it’s any uglier than any other contentious issue we deal with. The more I think about it, I don’t know if it’s a problem with misogynists so much as just inconsiderate people in general. But obviously that’s not going to change; we at the Dope love our inconsiderate people so much that we enshrine them in the Pit. For better or worse, that is our culture.
I don’t know what is the solution, other than people who aren’t comfortable here to just leave. Right now I am just so incredibly depressed by the lack of consideration shown by many people, on many sides, across the board, I don’t know what to think.
Good grief, folks. When I quote McCarthy, you should realize I’m making fun of myself a bit. It’d be nice if you’d also realize I’m mocking the melodramatic hand-to-the-forehead reactions that amount to, “You want to knock some creepy people off a messageboard? OMG IT’S THE INQUISITION!!!1!”
I’m not calling for revoking citizenship. I’m not calling for the Iron Maiden. I’m not calling for naming names. I’m not calling for witch-dunking. I’m calling for the bouncers at the bar to be a bit more vigilant in bouncing.
“Sir, just drink your Shirley Temple and let us do our job.”
And I’m surprised that in a lot of cases, people find it easier to shrug their shoulders and let a problem slowly become unbearable until it damages or ruins their experience than they do to press a button and report a post, or for that matter to just bring up the issue earlier. That’s extremely frustrating. I don’t consider the board a sexist or racist place to hang out and I don’t want posters to see it that way either even though I don’t expect to ever convince every person that every major issue is taken care of. You can’t show every poster the light, but the mods don’t mind setting boundaries. But it’s hard for us to address a problem if we don’t know about it, and I’m not seeing a whole lot of instances where people brought it to our attention first.
I don’t think anyone should be banned but I do think that enforcement of the “don’t be a jerk” rule would be helpful; sexism seems to get a pass here. More disturbingly, there’s a contingent of dopers who go all out to keep that particular culture unchanged.
I’m also really surprised that the Mods didn’t realize it was a problem until now. And I’m pleasantly surprised by Marley’s willingness to listen.
…the point was that people do exactly as you wish: they press a button and report a post, and that it is ignored.
I’ve seen one or two actual instances - there’s the IMHO (later Pit) thread, and there’s the post Sleeps With Butterflies mentioned - but not a lot of other examples. Which isn’t to say there are literally zero, but there is simply too much pent up feeling about this for me to believe it’s being reported nearly as often as it’s happening. I’m not trying to blame anybody, but this is not stuff the staff wants to let slide and it’s not stuff I would expect the MPSIMS or IMHO mods to let slide on the whole- not least of all because three of the five mods in those forums are women.
It’s hard to recall all the posts you report over the course of a few years at this place, let alone enough details of the post to search and post it here again. You’ve been given examples of times when it’s been reported and ignored, we haven’t gotten a response as to why the report was ignored. So you can imagine why many of us feel the futility of the “just report it” response.
I know.
I’ve asked the IMHO mods to post when they have a chance, but I don’t think we’re seeing a ton of examples - I can think of two here. And while I don’t expect everybody to remember everything they’ve reported - even though I think the mods usually hang on to thread reports - I continue to think there’s a disconnect there and it really is important that people report posts and that they take some initiative in raising concerns about broader trends. Because I don’t think any mods would let this slide on a large scale and I think it’s evident this is a discussion we could’ve had a while ago. If people can’t offer a lot of specifics and have been aggravated by this stuff for a long time and think a tipping point was reached some time ago, there’s not very much I can say other than ‘I wish you’d said something sooner,’ because this matters to the staff.
…there was a thread here in ATMB where I reported people for IMHO stepping over the line into personal attack: it was ignored. When you said in a later thread (paraphrased) that ATMB discussion was civil, I pointed out that other thread and asked you to review it, but you said it was too old (about a month) and it wasn’t worth it.
I’m sure there have been more reports than you “recall.” I don’t think its fair to blame people for not reporting when reports do get ignored like mine and Sleeps With Butterflies. After a while you just stop bothering. Its your message board, its your rules. Don’t put the blame on us.
You complain around here and you get snarked on. If you are in the minority you get snarked on. What this thread here is is momentum. A group that routinely has to suffer from the “snark” that this message board is famous for have “found each other.” Its much easier to speak out when you know there are people in your corner.
I think its sort of been the death by 1000 cuts. There have been very few single instances where I’ve thought “a moderator should deal with that” - and I seldom report anyone myself, it just isn’t something I do. Maybe five times in all my years. However, there is sort of a pervasiveness, not necessarily new (Satan and december could both be sexist assholes - neither has been here for YEARS).
There is a typical conversation pattern here where women post in good faith VS. men who post in bad faith and are clearly motivated by some kind of obsessive vicarious revenge.
It’s blindingly obvious to me when it happens (including some vomit inducing examples in this very thread)… I’d just say F*'em - kick their asses back to a fantasy football board if they can’t act right in a co-ed environment.
Thank you for acknowledging that, LC Strawhouse.
Marley23, I just want to say that I appreciate your efforts here. This is thread full of deep emotions, and you seem to have taken on the responsibility for the board’s view all by yourself, even though this is not your forum. You’re to be commended for that.