Mom Sells PS2 on eBay as Punishment

[Ms2001]

@yosemite

In the real world he’d also be in front of the judge, too, possibly facing jail time, too. He also might get into some trouble for drinking alcohol.

That’s true. But jail time for accidentally damaging a used bugle and drinking a few beers, both of which were stored in the open in his home? While the law might allow a judge to hand down that sentence, it’s still a fantasy.

The impact I experienced was equal to the imact that I inflicted.

Unlike the kid in the eBay story.

I also didn’t break the law by drinking alcohol, which, whether you want to address it or not, is an additional source of concern for most parents.

Actually, I did address it, in my very first post to this thread.

You’re still not getting it: YOU DIDN’T STEAL ANYTHING.

Harp on that point all you want, it’s still no more relevant than the fact that you didn’t give up your prized possessions.

But that’s not the only point, and you keep on refusing to address it: They took his PS2 to show him what it felt like.

Are you feeling okay? I did address it, and in fact you quoted the part of my post where I did so.

What he felt, as implied by the story, is far worse than what his mom felt - it’s akin to punching someone in the face after he steps on your foot, just to “show him what it felt like”.

Furthermore, you’re only guessing at the woman’s motivation. Here’s what the eBay story says about her reasons for selling the PS2: “I AM SELLING THOS PRIZE possession TO RECOOP WHAT I LOST.” That doesn’t suggest she had any deep lessons in mind. (Nor does it suggest she went to school past 4th grade.)

Maybe, possibly she did it for the reason you claim - and maybe, possibly the kid doesn’t exist at all, she stole the PS2 from Wal-Mart, and sold it on eBay to get money for cigarettes. Both possibilities are speculation, and neither are worth debating since there’s no evidence to back them up.

I daresay it would be easier to replace a PS2 than it would be to replace a gift of champagne that they’d held onto for a year, waiting for just the right moment to drink.

Are there no wine stores in Arkansas?

If you’re suggesting the wine is irreplaceable because of the sentimental value it has as a gift… well, notice that the story doesn’t mention where this kid got his PS2, so for all we know, its origins could’ve been just as sentimental. (Of course, we already know how much the kid valued it, since that detail is actually in the story.)

@Rilchiam

Drank beer. Even at 17, this would still be a bad thing, but if a 13 y/o is sneaking beer, that’s a sign of either an alcohol problem, or a kid who doesn’t recognize or doesn’t have limits, or both.

You might want to tell, er, Europe about that. Seems they have somewhat different views on how old is old enough to start drinking beer and wine.

@CrazyCatLady

So, Blalron, what you’re saying is that kids are going to steal things, and break things, and lie to you about it, and that’s A-Okay?

Actually, if I may speak for Blalron just this once, I think what he’s saying is:

I’m just saying make them work to pay it back instead of simply taking stuff.

Not really “a-okay” at all.

[Basandre]

“This situation with a child none of us know which may or may not have happened - is it fair or unfair? Judge only on the little information given. Typed, double spaced, and remember to spell-check. 20% of your final grade.”

[yosemite]

@Mr2001

That’s true. But jail time for accidentally damaging a used bugle and drinking a few beers, both of which were stored in the open in his home? While the law might allow a judge to hand down that sentence, it’s still a fantasy.

I’m not sure what you’re getting at here. The kid would go to court, go through all that hassle, etc., (whether or not he was put in juvie would be a different matter) and that would be more “real world” than his mom selling his PS2. Which would you prefer?

Unlike the kid in the eBay story.

Yeah, unlike the kid in the eBay story. The kid gave up something that looked like it was worth less than what he stole. And, he drank and lied and all that happened (that we know about) is that he gave up something that can easily replaced as soon as he earned the money. All I did was use a few stamps that looked like they were worth less than a dollar, and I ended up paying about $15! I didn’t lie, I didn’t drink I didn’t sneak around, or nothin’! That’s not fair man!

Harp on that point all you want, it’s still no more relevant than the fact that you didn’t give up your prized possessions.

Let’s get this straight again: “prized possession that can be easily replaced.” I gave up money. I gave up money that I really earned (babysitting those little hyper terrors could sometimes be a nightmare). This kid gave up something that he valued, but very likely never worked for or earned in any way. And what then? He can earn the money and get an identical “prized possession” back. I probably would have had to give up something that I owned too, if I didn’t have the money.

Are you feeling okay? I did address it, and in fact you quoted the part of my post where I did so.

No, you didn’t address it: you addressed the supposed “feelings” of loss about the specific items, which is only part of it. You did NOT address the concept of having something taken from you. That was the lesson that he needed to be taught, and needed to be taught in a big, severe way. Even if he had stolen something with no sentimental value to the parents, (but was still equally expensive) he was still a thief of a valuable item and he needed to learn what it felt like to have something valuable swiped away from him. Something that mattered taken away from him would get the message across to him all that much more effectively.

Furthermore, you’re only guessing at the woman’s motivation. Here’s what the eBay story says about her reasons for selling the PS2: “I AM SELLING THOS PRIZE possession TO RECOOP WHAT I LOST.” That doesn’t suggest she had any deep lessons in mind. (Nor does it suggest she went to school past 4th grade.)

Well, it’s pretty freakin’ likely that “teaching him a lesson about what it felt like” was a big part of what motivated her to take this action. “Giving you a taste of your own medicine” with such methods is a time-honored technique and almost every sitcom and TV show and many pieces of literature explore this theme. This woman would have had to have lived under a rock to not be aware of the irony and appropriateness of taking something away from the kid in order to get her point across to him.

Are there no wine stores in Arkansas?

Typical evasive tactics from you. So the champagne he stole has no significance, even though it was obviously an expensive gift, and many people hold very sentimental feelings about gifts from certain people, right? Well, then that particular PS2 game has far less specific significance, since there are plenty of stores in Arkansas also where he can buy another one.

If you’re suggesting the wine is irreplaceable because of the sentimental value it has as a gift… well, notice that the story doesn’t mention where this kid got his PS2, so for all we know, its origins could’ve been just as sentimental. (Of course, we already know how much the kid valued it, since that detail is actually in the story.)

Well, for all we know the kid licked the bathroom floor clean every night to earn the money to pay for it. But since there is no information about it, and there is information about the champagne . . . And of course the kid enjoyed the PS2. He’s 13 years old and played games on it. But the fact remains that he can easily replace it. As soon as he earns the money.

[Ms2001]

@yosemite

I’m not sure what you’re getting at here. The kid would go to court, go through all that hassle, etc., (whether or not he was put in juvie would be a different matter) and that would be more “real world” than his mom selling his PS2. Which would you prefer?

False dilemma. What I would prefer has already been explained.

If his parents were interested in giving him a taste of the real world, court would have been the way to go. Without knowing more about the kid and the situation, I can’t say whether a taste of the real world is actually what he needed. But I can say that imposing a harsher punishment than he’d receive in the real world is inappropriate.

No, you didn’t address it: you addressed the supposed “feelings” of loss about the specific items, which is only part of it. You did NOT address the concept of having something taken from you. That was the lesson that he needed to be taught, and needed to be taught in a big, severe way.

Perhaps. He could just as easily have had something else taken away - money, for example.

If indeed he had never had anything of his taken away before, then maybe he really didn’t know what it felt like to have something taken (in whichever sense of “felt” you’re using that doesn’t involve feelings of loss ;)). I can see the use of giving him that experience, but I don’t think it was necessary to take his most prized possession to show him, because the impact of losing something he loves and cherishes outweighs the simple feeling of “hey, something was taken from me”.

Well, it’s pretty freakin’ likely that “teaching him a lesson about what it felt like” was a big part of what motivated her to take this action.

We can speculate about all kinds of things that are pretty freakin’ likely. Doesn’t mean they’re true.

So the champagne he stole has no significance, even though it was obviously an expensive gift, and many people hold very sentimental feelings about gifts from certain people, right? Well, then that particular PS2 game has far less specific significance, since there are plenty of stores in Arkansas also where he can buy another one.

You said the PS2 was something he “very likely never worked for or earned in any way”… which means someone gave it to him as a gift, right? If his gift is replaceable, so is hers.

[World_Eater]

@Blalron

A bottle of wine will only give you one night of enjoyment.

So what? Should we all refrain from activities that provide one night of enjoyment from now on.

Possibly it will give you some added “special” enjoyment due to the sentimental value, but you can get just as drunk off of $10 box wine.

Yes, because what’s the point of drinking if you can’t get stinking drunk? :rolleyes:

A PS2 gives continuing enjoyment for a much longer time frame. It can entertain someone for weeks, months, possibly years.

Or it can be one of the worst time bandits in the world.

If you could measure happiness in units (let’s call them “hedons”) then I think the PS2 has much more hedons of value than the wine.

This is the dumbest statement I’ve heard in a long time.

[Genghis_Bob]

So the kid’s sneaking around on his parents, drinking beer and wine on the sly, and trying to hide the consequences of his carelessness?

For careless breaking, we usually deliver a “serious talk” about being careful with other people’s stuff. For careless breaking and then lying about it, we get medieval - grounding or loss of TV/Computer/PS2 priveleges. That’s part of our job in instilling character in the little heathens.

For sneaking, drinking and then lying, the potential consequences in the real world (outside the family) could be much higher, so the response of the parents should be more emphatic - these are supposed to be teachable moments here. Nip this behavior in the bud at 13, and it’s smooth sailing through adolescence; fail to correct it now, and it’s hell on wheels until he leaves the house.

At 13, the kid probably has the werewithal to earn money, and also at 13, he now has the ability to do some serious property damage if his careless/sneaky ways aren’t mended, fast. It’s nicely symbolic to make him earn back his PS2, just like anyone else would whose property he might damage. Selling it on E-Bay is just a very visible signal to the kid that This Is for Real - it ain’t coming back.

Real behavior on his part = Real consequences.

It’s the job of the parents to prepare the kid for citizenship in the the outside world, where nobody will care how much you love your PS2, your car, or your freedom. I think Mom found a good way to let junior get a taste of what Responsibility is all about; I hope she also drives home the lesson behind her actions, so he doesn’t go through life with a big ol’ my-mom-stole-my-PS2 chip on his shoulder.

[yosemite]

@Mr2001

False dilemma. What I would prefer has already been explained.

If his parents were interested in giving him a taste of the real world, court would have been the way to go.

The brutal real world, yes. That would be one way to go. A less severe “taste” of the real world would be for him to lose something that he valued very much, and not involve the law at all.

Without knowing more about the kid and the situation, I can’t say whether a taste of the real world is actually what he needed. But I can say that imposing a harsher punishment than he’d receive in the real world is inappropriate.

You mean giving up a game for a few months is more “severe” then being dragged into court, facing a judge, and all that? Absurd.

Perhaps. He could just as easily have had something else taken away - money, for example.

And perhaps that would be what they would have done—had he had any money. We don’t know, of course. But if he does have money that he could have used to pay for the damage and stuff he stole, but they took his PS2 instead, I guess that means he already has funds to buy a new PS2 sooner, doesn’t it? (And NO, the parents didn’t have to accept small incremental dribbles of repayment over a long period of time instead.)

If indeed he had never had anything of his taken away before, then maybe he really didn’t know what it felt like to have something taken (in whichever sense of “felt” you’re using that doesn’t involve feelings of loss ;)). I can see the use of giving him that experience, but I don’t think it was necessary to take his most prized possession to show him, because the impact of losing something he loves and cherishes outweighs the simple feeling of “hey, something was taken from me”.

What are you talking about? He needed to learn it, and in a big way after all that he did. It sounds like this was the only possession that would have any impact on him anyway, and that’s what he needed to learn. To learn what it felt like for something that mattered to be taken away. It’s obvious that the champagne mattered quite a bit to the parents.

We can speculate about all kinds of things that are pretty freakin’ likely. Doesn’t mean they’re true.

Of course. It is only 99% freakin’ likely, but you’ll cling to that 1%. I understand.

You said the PS2 was something he “very likely never worked for or earned in any way”… which means someone gave it to him as a gift, right? If his gift is replaceable, so is hers.

We’re going around in circles here and once again, it’s typical evasive tactics from you. It sounds less likely that the PS2 has sentimental value, specifically because of who gave it to him (we don’t know who gave it to him, of course). It sounds likely that the game had significance to him because it was a game and he enjoyed using it. It sounds more likely that the champagne has sentimental value. (They’d been saving it up for a year, after all. For whatever reason, it was precious and significant to them and they made a point of indicating that it was a “gift,” as if that added to its significance.) Either way, their gift was taken from them—stolen from them, and the person who did it shouldn’t expect any special consideration because of his delicate feelings about his “gift.” He sure didn’t give any consideration, and he needs—no, deserves—to know what it feels like to have that done back to him.

[Daisy_Mae]

@Blalron

It’s this attitude (that a rather trivial offense automatically makes the kid a “little fucker”) that turns kids into criminals.

Kids will be kids, for fucks sake. You don’t need to get medieval on their asses by taking their most prized treasures away from them and auctioning them off. I’m not saying don’t make them pay it back, I’m just saying make them work to pay it back instead of simply taking stuff.

Taking away a fucking toy is getting “medieval” on a child’s ass? What Brady Bunch house did you live in that losing a luxury is such horrific torture? Give.me.a.break.

What about the issue of said child drinking beer with his friends (who are most likely underage as well) in her house? What if one of these kids was drunk and fell down a flight of stairs and seriously injured himself in her home?

Something very similar happened to a patient at our hospital and the owners of the home were in a shitstorm of trouble with the courts for improper supervision. Eventually they got out of the criminal stuff but they did have to pay in civil court. Even though they won the criminal complaints, they had to spend a lot of time and money fighting the issue for something they didn’t even do wrong.

So pardon me if I don’t cry a river for this poor, mistreated child who broke the law. He knew what he was doing was wrong yet he CHOSE to do so anyway. He should be punished. Losing a luxury like a PS2 sounds just about right.

[Kaitlyn]

Assuming the story to be true, I haven’t the slightest objection to what mom did.

My comment, however, is that, real or not, the story does seem to have had the effect of driving up the price a bit. A used PS2 with no games can quite easily be had for under a hundred bucks on e-bay.

[Bad_News_Baboon]

I’m starting to wonder if Mr2001 isn’t in fact, e-bay boy…

@Blalron

If you could measure happiness in units (let’s call them “hedons”) then I think the PS2 has much more hedons of value than the wine.

‘Hedon units’? Dude, unplug the Zelda already! That statement sounds so inspired by some final fantasy sort of game (collect the blue crystals to upgrade your hedon units!).

One of our friends has a child who plays PS2. Really. That’s all he does. He goes to school and he plays PS2. I’ve never seen him play with any other toy. His playstation was taken away for a day (it was supposed to be a week, but I digress) because he was being punished. I swear, you would have thought that his life was coming to an end. He threw the biggest fit I have ever seen a child throw.

Granted, I’m in no position to judge seeing as my child is a baby. I may one day be in that situation, but Lord, I hope not. I kind of think that if a child is so attached to a PS2 that it ecclipses, say life, maybe it should be sold.

I understand that the PS2 is not the point, but some of you are going on as if it were the Holy Grail the mom is selling.

[Ms2001]

Well, yosemite, you’re right, we are going in circles. We clearly have different ideas on the purpose of punishment, the usefulness of speculating on the story, and the love a woman can feel for a bottle of wine. Your ad hominem attacks are not helping either. Guess I shouldn’t have expected any better… this is the Pit, after all.

@Bad News Baboon

I’m starting to wonder if Mr2001 isn’t in fact, e-bay boy…

Heh. I’ve still got my PS2, I don’t live with my parents, and I don’t like skating or champagne. I’m not a teenager, but I remember that even when I was, I was still a person, able to make my own choices and face up to my own obligations; therefore I try to assume other teenagers are also people, and treat them accordingly.

I kind of think that if a child is so attached to a PS2 that it ecclipses, say life, maybe it should be sold.

Now that just sounds cruel. “If he likes it more than anything else in the world, maybe it should be taken away.”

[Bad_News_Baboon]

@Mr2001

“If he likes it more than anything else in the world”

This wins my vote for saddest statement of the year.

Hey there Johnny, what is your most favorite thing in the world?
-My playstation2!

[barney fife]
NIP IT IN THE BUD!
[/barney fife]

[Ms2001]

@Bad News Baboon

I understand that the PS2 is not the point, but some of you are going on as if it were the Holy Grail the mom is selling.

Clearly, the PS2 doesn’t have much inherent value. But according to the story, it basically was the Holy Grail as far as the kid is concerned, and that’s what concerns me. If he didn’t treasure it so much, it still would’ve been rude for them to sell it without giving him a chance to come up with the money himself, but he’d only be inconvenienced, rather than miserable.

This wins my vote for saddest statement of the year.

Hey there Johnny, what is your most favorite thing in the world?
-My playstation2!

I dunno, I thought yours was a little sadder.

“You see this, Johnny? This is a .45 magnum. You’re gonna give me your PS2 or your life.”
“…”
“Come on, kid. Pick one or I’ll pick for ya.”
“I’m thinking, I’m thinking!”

[CowPatty]

Count me among the skeptical. From the mom’s auction:

“I AM NOT GOING TO PUT UP WITH THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR FROM A CHILD. EVEN A 6’3” 13 YEAR OR ANY ONE WHO DISRESPECTS ME & MY STUFF.”

From the mom’s eBay “About Me” page:

“I have two small children and i like to buy for them and sell what they outgrow.”

There’s nothing small about a 6’3" 13-year-old. But what am I doing posting? I just remembered I’m a lurker and too shy to post. Eeeek!

scuttles away to hide

[yosemite]

@Mr2001

Well, yosemite, you’re right, we are going in circles. We clearly have different ideas on the purpose of punishment

Me, and most of the people on this thread (many who are parents) have a different idea about the purpose of punishment, apparently.

and the love a woman can feel for a bottle of wine.

Ah, yes, her love for the wine. Apparently that is meaningless compared to the kid’s precious game. The game is all and everything and the only thing that matters. The wine? Well, there are liquor stores in Arkansas, aren’t there? :rolleyes:

And let’s not forget the sequence of events here. Both the wine and PS2 were left undisturbed, and would have remained so, had not the kid decided to swipe the wine first. But oh wait. That detail doesn’t matter! Because he loves the game, so God Forbid he ever have to give it up! No matter what he takes of anyone else’s!

Your ad hominem attacks are not helping either.

Oh dear. I am so mortified. You mean that my exasperation at your evasive “bait and switch” techniques hit a nerve? So sorry.

@Bad News Baboon

[barney fife]
NIP IT IN THE BUD!
[/barney fife]

Hilarious! And so true!

I guess kids are gonna fixate on whatever they fixate on, but some attempt by the parents to widen their horizons is not uncalled for. Especially when the kid has proven to be untrustworthy and a thief. And let’s not forget this possibility:

@Daisy Mae

Something very similar happened to a patient at our hospital and the owners of the home were in a shitstorm of trouble with the courts for improper supervision. Eventually they got out of the criminal stuff but they did have to pay in civil court. Even though they won the criminal complaints, they had to spend a lot of time and money fighting the issue for something they didn’t even do wrong.

Scary.

Why should the parents tolerate such behavior when it’s their (the parents’) butt on the line if something goes wrong? The concept of “nip it in the bud” applies to this as well.

[Rilchiam]

@CowPatty

Count me among the skeptical. From the mom’s auction:

“I AM NOT GOING TO PUT UP WITH THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR FROM A CHILD. EVEN A 6’3” 13 YEAR OR ANY ONE WHO DISRESPECTS ME & MY STUFF.”

From the mom’s eBay “About Me” page:

“I have two small children and i like to buy for them and sell what they outgrow.”

There’s nothing small about a 6’3" 13-year-old. But what am I doing posting? I just remembered I’m a lurker and too shy to post. Eeeek!

scuttles away to hide

Good point. Although…it’s possible that she created that profile when the now-13 y/o was younger, and therefore small.

Just trying to touch all bases here, though I do share your skepticism. Hope I haven’t scared you back into lurking!

Oh, and Mr2001:

Now that just sounds cruel. “If he likes it more than anything else in the world, maybe it should be taken away.”

Look at the title of this thread. “Mom sells PS2 on eBay as punishment.”

Again assuming that the story is true, the mom decided that taking away the thing the kid liked more than anything else in the world would be the most effective punishment. The way she tells it, he had little interest in anything else, so if she took away any other privilege or possession, he would have thought, “Well, at least I have my games.” If the kid is real, and he doesn’t make the connection between the heartbreaking loss of his PS2 and the gravity of his offenses, then his skull is thicker than yours.

[Ms2001]

@Rilchiam

[Mr2001: Now that just sounds cruel. “If he likes it more than anything else in the world, maybe it should be taken away.”]

Look at the title of this thread. “Mom sells PS2 on eBay as punishment.”

Again assuming that the story is true, the mom decided that taking away the thing the kid liked more than anything else in the world would be the most effective punishment.

Well, one of us must be taking Bad News Baboon’s statement in the wrong context. Note that I was responding to this part of his post, not to the OP:

@Bad News Baboon

Granted, I’m in no position to judge seeing as my child is a baby. I may one day be in that situation, but Lord, I hope not. I kind of think that if a child is so attached to a PS2 that it ecclipses, say life, maybe it should be sold.

That doesn’t look like a punishment to me; it looks like a general statement that if a child values a video game too much, it should be taken away. Hopefully he will clarify the remark and set one of us straight.

[Daisy_Mae]

@Mr2001

Well, one of us must be taking Bad News Baboon’s statement in the wrong context. Note that I was responding to this part of his post, not to the OP:That doesn’t look like a punishment to me; it looks like a general statement that if a child values a video game too much, it should be taken away. Hopefully he will clarify the remark and set one of us straight.

per Merriam-Webster:

punishment
Pronunciation: 'p&-nish-m&nt
Function: noun
suffering, pain, or loss that serves as retribution
Imagine that? Taking away something (a loss) that serves as retrubution.

I guess the parents should pick something that he won’t miss to punish him. That’s brilliant! Losing something that he cares NOTHING about will show him. Good thinking. I mean, in the “real world” some people in this thread seem to like to talk about, no one actually has to give up something they like for something they do wrong. Right? There aren’t consequences for one’s actions.

If someone royally screws up at work, they don’t lose their job, right? If someone steals or commits another crime, they don’t lose their freedom, right?

I have to admit that it does make me laugh that there are a few people actually acting as if the parents denied the child food, water, clothing, or shelter for their bad deed. IT IS A VIDEO GAME. A luxury. An “extra.” It isn’t something that will KILL him if he lives without it. I’m just hoping Mr2001 doesn’t call Amnesty International to report the cruel mistreatment of this poor, suffering teenager.

If losing his game until he can afford to work to get a new one is THAT traumatizing for him (as some in this thread ar trying to suggest), therapy is certainly in order before the big, bad world gets ahold of the child and kicks the ever-lovin’ shit out of him.

[Ms2001]

@Daisy Mae

per Merriam-Webster:

punishment
Pronunciation: 'p&-nish-m&nt
Function: noun
suffering, pain, or loss that serves as retribution
Imagine that? Taking away something (a loss) that serves as retrubution.

Please re-read the quote that I was responding to. It was not about punishment, nor about the kid in the OP, it was a general statement about “a child”–read “any child”–who is too attached to his video games.

I’m just hoping Mr2001 doesn’t call Amnesty International to report the cruel mistreatment of this poor, suffering teenager.

Too late! The Amnesty International jackboot squad has already taken the woman into custody. I hear she’s serving 5 years in a maximum security Amnesty International detention center, where she will be denied access to beer, wine, and eBay.

[Cazzle]

@CowPatty

Count me among the skeptical. From the mom’s auction:

“I AM NOT GOING TO PUT UP WITH THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR FROM A CHILD. EVEN A 6’3” 13 YEAR OR ANY ONE WHO DISRESPECTS ME & MY STUFF.”

From the mom’s eBay “About Me” page:

“I have two small children and i like to buy for them and sell what they outgrow.”

There’s nothing small about a 6’3" 13-year-old. But what am I doing posting? I just remembered I’m a lurker and too shy to post. Eeeek!

scuttles away to hide

On this page it says: Member since: Aug-19-00

It’s possible the mother wrote that profile when she first joined four years ago - when her 6’3" 13 year old was a somewhat shorter 9 year old.

Then again, looking at her feedback history, it appears she may not have started selling until Oct 02.