More eBike Questions

In My Humble Opinion
41

Just throwing out a few thoughts.

Since you have a cycling background, you probably know that a decent bike uses quality parts. I doubt that you are getting decent parts on a drop shipped bike from China.

Have you ridden any ebikes just to try them out? A 250 watt motor could do the job. While 1100 watts does sound lovely, how do you know that’s what you need?

For example, here is what I consider a decent quality bike, a Salsa Confluence. Now, $3K is probably 3 or 4 times more that you want to spend, but the bike has a few advantages. First, it uses parts that any bike shop should be able to work on or get replacements for. Second, it is a 33 pound bike, which is something manageable to pedal if you do somehow run out of battery, and does not present a problem with the bus rack limit. Finally, and most importantly I think is that the Salsa meets UL 2849 and 2271 certifications, which means the battery won’t catch fire when recharging.

On the other hand, it’s $3k. And that may be a deal breaker. But a lighter bike with a smaller motor may end up being a better fit for you, hence my question if you’ve ridden any to get an idea of what works for you.

42

I hope you find a bike that makes your commute what you wish it to be.

I admit my objections with e-bikes are not so much with the devices themselves - which CAN serve a legitimate purpose for some persons, as it is with so many assholes I see riding them. My main gripe is with folk riding them on the multi-use rec paths. They are posted “No Motor Vehicles,” but the county doesn’t enforce it and has even stated that the lower level ones are permitted. You don’t see folk commuting up hills. Instead, you see folk zipping along at 25+ MPH, making no effort to pedal, and clueless of the courtesy for a shared path.

Then there is the issue of “fast enough to get into trouble, not fast enough to get out of it.” Same thing used to happen with mopeds. On a bike, most folk are very aware that they have to be cautious to protect themselves. On a motorcycle, you can get away with a lot more. But with e-bikes, I see adults and children riding them on the sidewalks as well as streets, ignoring all traffic rules, and essentially being hazards.

If I were you, I’d consider getting a motorcycle and skipping the bus leg.

By all means, get an e-bike. Just don’t be an asshole on an e-bike! :wink:

43

I always remind myself when I start getting sucked into these kinds of arguments: it’s not cars vs bikes, or regular bikes vs e-bikes. It’s the nice people against the assholes.

44

Re torque sensor vs speed sensor: I should have been a little more specific. The torque sensor just helps you when you start pedaling from a stop. With a speed sensor, you have to give the bike some momentum before the assist kicks in, and that can require considerable effort, especially if you are starting on an upslope. Many of us who find a ebike appealing want one because our elderly bodies need some assistance or else biking just isn’t fun or practical anymore. Even if your bike has a torque sensor, it will still give you a readout of your mph, trip miles, etc.

I strongly second what others have suggested. Test different bikes before you buy one. Try one from a dead stop with a torque sensor vs a speed sensor. I did, and immediately knew I had to have the torque sensor even though it was more expensive. Ordering a bike online is IMO setting yourself up for disappointment.

I bought an Aventon bike. It was very expensive (about $1600 3 years ago, would have saved $250 by assembling it myself). I haven’t regretted the extra $$, though who knows how much they cost now with tariffs etc. Good cycling to you!

45

That’s why a lot of the cadence-sensor-only bikes fall into class 2, because they add a thumb throttle for that off-the-line boost.

46

I don’t get it. It seems that a few of you are saying it makes no sense for road bikes and road tires to even exist because mountain bikes are just as good on roads as road bikes are.

47

For riders who are not performance oriented, a MTB is a legitimate choice for road riding. Especially if the roads are less than smooth and/or hilly.

48

I have been thinking about getting an ebikes and want one I can easily pick up for sure. and one that doesn’t catch fire would be ideal!

this is what the local bike shop owner said is happening, there are a LOT of new regulations (state of OR and national) because people are not using them for pedal assist, they are just using them a little motorcycles, basically. He told me that a few weeks ago and since then I have noticed: whenever I see ebikes in my town, the rider is not using the pedals.

49

curveball:

do you know an e-bike is the best mobility solution for your needs, or could some other device (e-scooter) be ultimately a better choice?

When I investigated e-bikes, the good motors-battery combos (without bike attached) ran $800-900 … for that price I got a complete e-scooter with the same specs as the motor-battery combo

50

My Aventon has a Shimano derailer and Tektro brakes. Definitely made in China parts, but at least name brands. The Aventon is at the lower end of e-bike prices, and seemed better made than some in the same price range, but not as nice as the Trek or Specialized at twice the price.

The best way to avoid falling into bike snobbery is to just set a budget and find the best bike at that price. There is always something nicer for more, and no upper limit on what you can spend.

I ruled out anything with a cadence/speed sensor. The assist had the tendency to kick in during low speed maneuvers, which is very upsetting. The torque sensor is based on how hard you’re pedaling, so gentle pedaling at low speeds might produce no assistance, because it’s not necessary. Push harder, and it will add a bit more.

If you want a bicycle that makes you feel 30 years younger, get an e-bike. If i you want an electric motor scooter, then look at those. If you want an electric motor scooter you can ride on bike paths, then get an e-bike and try not to ride like a jerk.

The best possible thing to do is search for e-bike stores in your area, and go ride some.

51

Some thoughts from someone who commutes by e-bike:

  • 28 mph (~ 45 km/h) sounds like a crazy speed to me to ride on bike paths. I’d be loth to travel at that speed if my e-bike allowed that (my bike stops the power assist at 25 km/h as required in Germany for bikes that can be operated on bike paths, without a driving license, and without a license plate; the fastest I have ever ridden was 32 km/h down a long slope on a smooth path).

  • With e-bikes powerful disc brakes and a sturdy frame (and a sturdy fork in particular) are much more important than with conventional bikes, due to higher speeds.

  • Unlike with conventional bikes it is very easy to achieve speeds that are unsafe to ride.

  • For my needs (a commute of 18-kilometers one way, with 200 m height difference), a 500 W motor and 500 Wh battery has been proven sufficient.

52

Looking at e-bikes for sale on Amazon, some have rear racks and some don’t. If an e-bike doesn’t come with a rear rack, is there any reason why I couldn’t buy one and install it myself?

(I’m not looking to carry heavy stuff on the rack, I’m thinking maybe 25 lbs. max. A bag or two of groceries. My cargo and I together would top out at about 200 lbs.)

53

As an owner of a Class 3 (28mph) e-bike, it absolutely is. I would never ride on a bike path at that speed.

But it’s a not an unreasonable speed on the road. I regularly see 30-ish mph on the downhill parts of my ride into town. But that’s not an e-bike thing. I do that on my ‘acoustic’ bike as well.

54

For reference, 28 mph is as fast as I ever pedaled a mountain bike (26 inch + medium knobbies) on paved, level streets. That was from 25 years ago, I was working in a bike shop, quite fit, accurate bike computer, etc. I did get into the 30s on downhills but that takes white knuckled concentration.

55

I bought one for my Aventon Pace 500.3, but I had to get it from the Aventon website because this model has a very wide rear hub. Be sure any rear rack you order will fit your hub (the one I had on my Bianchi non-ebike wouldn’t fit).

56

Yeah, that’s the tricky part. Because I’m trying to decide if I should order an e-bike that doesn’t come with a rack already installed, and hub width isn’t a measurement they tend to include.

Basically I’ve decided that rather than spending four figures on my first e-bike, I’m going to go cheap - there’s e-bikes I can get for $500 or so including shipping and 2-year protection plan - and if it doesn’t work out so great, at least I’ll have a more clear idea what I should look for when it comes to spending more serious bucks for one.

But even the cheapo bike has to have a rear rack.

57

Our goal is to stay above 13 MPH, and generally average 15-16. An occasional fancy-pantser will whiz past us on the paths, but the fastest are consistently e-bikes.

58

Just ordered this one. Going low end because (a) my needs re range, power, speed, carrying capacity, etc. are on the minimal side, so a generic e-bike with a rack has a good chance of doing everything I need it to, and (b) I figure even if it’s less than I need it to be, I’ll get a better fix on what I really need.

Anyhow, it’ll be delivered in a week or ten days, and I’ll see how it all works out then.

59

I used to (back in the 1990s until about 2005) bike to the state parks in Indiana-- I bought a parks entrance pass every spring. To and from, there were crazy hills, that when I drove, I had to go up in 4th gear (in a 5-speed), and I heard from people with automatics, they had to take them in 2nd, or their A/C shut off.

I didn’t think twice about biking up them, and going down, there were always a few cautious cars going the “recommended” (yellow sign) speed of 25MPH, and I passed them. It took a couple of minutes to go down these hills, and that is with judicious use of the brakes, that could have overheated if I’d used them too much.

I biked so much back then, I didn’t worry at all, because the bike was like an extension of me.

My balance is good now, but not as good, and as a result, I’m much more careful-- also every ebike I’ve seen has disk brakes, not the wheel-gripping kind I had in the 80s; my current acoustic bike has disk, and, as I understand it, won’t overheat even in an “excessive use” situation. Or, actually, I think, don’t FAIL from overheating.

60

Excellent tip, thanks. I need a rear rack, so I guess I should order it with the bike.

I found one with the motor rated 750w, albeit the assisted wattage is 1000w, but as I understand it, it just does that for short bursts, so it should be a nice uphill assist. It has a throttle, but can make use only of 750 wattage with the throttle.

This bike has everything I was, shipping is reasonable, and is normally $1,495, but reduced by 60%. All the bikes of this brand are reduced this much on Amazon, because they are from last year.

It has a 4.75 average rating, and is being dogged by a user who rated it 1-star because his package opened, and the shipper taped it back together, apparently without all the padding, and it arrived damaged.

Can’t remember the weight off-hand, but it’s under 50lbs.

I’ve been reading Indiana laws, and you can actually have a bike with a motor higher than 750w, you just need to register it as a motorcycle, and have either a motorcycle license, or a driver’s license and a motorcycle permit (in the second case, you can’t carry passengers), and follow laws as though you have a motorcycle, like keeping in off sidewalks-- however, it can’t be on the highway unless it can go the posted minimum, usually 40MPH.

So, basically, the high-powered motors are the worst of both worlds. They are bicycles, and subject to the actual physical limitations on bicycles, but legally they are motorcycles. I’m sure the law is just written to discourage people from getting them.

Still haven’t ordered because I need an answer from the bus system.