What do you think?
Minority. You?
The fact that a religious cult can indoctrinate women into accepting a role as second-class citizens doesn’t imply that they are being treating with respect.
Thanks for stopping by.
Note to self: Nawth Chucka does not like to answer uncomfortable questions.
Dude, when you ask someone a question, you are supposed to answer the same.
I’ve listened to the audiobook memoir of a woman who grew up in the polygamous FLDS community ruled by Warren Jeffs. According to her, the LDS practice of banning alcohol didn’t originate until most followers agreed to forego plural marriage, and the FLDS sects don’t necessarily ban alcohol. IIRC her last name is Jessup, and she obviously got out in the end.
What dude are you addressing?
You. He answered your question and asked what you thought, whereupon, you ducked the question.
This is close to the historical record. The “Word of Wisdom” is held to be a revelation from God to Joseph Smith in 1833, which recommended, but did not command, avoiding wine, “strong drinks,” and “hot drinks.” Joseph Smith continued to drink wine until the very day of his death. Tea and coffee were very popular among the pioneers in Utah, as was tobacco and drinking.
From the early 1850s, Brigham Young started to push compliance to the Word of Wisdom, but it was not until the 1890s when the Church has publicly accepted the end to further polygamous marriages (while continuing the practice in secret) that it was elevated to a strict commandment by the church president Joseph F. Smith in the early 1900s. Although early church practice was to have the members vote on such matters, this was never the case for the change of status into a commandment.
Scholars have pointed out that the polygamous offshoots of Mormonism are often closer to the original Mormon church than the main LDS branch.
Ah. I am not a dude, hence my confusion. I’m a woman who lives in Utah and when I’ve already stated my opinion AND shown a link showing research to back it up, I’m not going to repeat myself so don’t bother asking.
You already stated your opinion on the matter of whether Utah was good or bad for women. I’m not asking you to repeat that. I asked you a separate question:
I don’t believe you ever answered that.
This is the the real answer. I’m not at all surprised that HurricaneDitka is attempting to change the conversation from the real serious issues in Utah concerning how women are treated. It’s simply easier to ask if they are happy 'cuz they sure as hell aren’t going to tell a priesthood leader that they really would like some changes. Nawth Chucka is wise to not get suckered into that trap.
Perhaps you’ve heard of the “Ordain Women” movement? I’m pretty sure that’s a direct refutation of your claim that “they sure as hell aren’t going to tell a priesthood leader that they really would like some changes.”
I’m not Mormon but have many friends who are and am related by marriage to dozens of them. A few are feminists pushing for change (i.e., less patriarchy) within the LDS church. I know “feminist Mormon” seems like an oxymoron, and they tread pretty carefully due to fear of excommunication, but they’re there. They’re also pushing to change the way rape is handled by the LDS Church.
And back to the OP, the few LDS I’ve asked have said they’re sticking to “Mormon,” if for no other reason than “the Church” and “the Church of Jesus Christ” don’t address what to call members: Churchians? Church of Jesus Christians?
I’m unaware of this issue. How do they perceive rape is “handled by the LDS Church” today and what change(s) would they like to see implemented?
Among ourselves we usually just say “member” (or perhaps “member of the Church” if it needs additional clarification).
Perhaps you overlooked this exchange on the subject:
Both I and Nawth Chucka both recognize the uncomfortable reality of the situation - these people are victims of psychological abuse and brainwashing. So sure, they’re ‘happy’ about it, in the same way that a person who’s been raised on lead-laden tapwater thinks that pure water tastes strange. (I’m speaking in general here, obviously: exceptions exist, characterized by not being happy about the situation.)
I invite Nawth Chucka to correct me if I’m incorrect about her, but until then, does this answer satisfy you?
This is already the name of the most common configuration for Mormon cars:
Tudor (rare)
Fordor (a few)
Mordor (the vast majority)
If that’s meant as an acknowledgement that most women in Utah don’t agree with the sentiment that “Utah is terrible for women”, then yes, I’m certainly satisfied. I happen to disagree with your opinion that they are “victims of psychological abuse and brainwashing”, but I doubt we’ll see eye-to-eye on that point either.