Wendell: I’ve always thought SZC were totally OTT about those trademarks, but your links just about confirmed that for me.
BTW clarification; the dwarves (dvergar) in the story universe are a human-created slave race.
Back ot the oriignal topic: My plan is to set it in a fantasy version of (mostly) Iceland with a Dickensian overlay.Basically a very cold island full of ancient lore and people who are all related to each other and preserve old storytelling traditions and also a huge Reykjavik-expy capital with slums. (Although 19th century Reykjavík was nothing like that) One later tradition is that of the kraptaskald or poet whose poetry has magical power. The Gandalf expy is a kraptaskald seeking the Jarknasteinn (a sunstone-- Norse version of anold English word for “precious stone” that JRRT got *Arkenstone *from)
What’s a good name for a fantasy version of Iceland/Norway?
Just a piece of advice. The use of foreign words in English texts is very tricky. I think you’ll notice Tolkien rarely ever uses more than one per sentence.
Except in his long Quenya poem Namárië (Galadriel’s Lament).
I don’t recall this particular poem but it is true there are entire sentences and poems that are in Elvish but this is really for atmosphere more than anything else. and they’re usually translated immediately.
It’s in “Farewell to Lórien.”
Thanks for the opinions Grumman, furryman and Wendell!
Here’s another question related to the plot:
Would an Oliver Twist like plot even work in a medieval setting? Although this fictional Icelandic/Norwegian setting (called “Issenheim”) isn’t actually purely medieval but also has overtones of the Victorian era. It was inspired by the fact that I wanted to create a far-future style setting with retro-futuristic steam technology and medieval Norse values inspired by the stuff I read about the Viking revival of the 19th century. Basically a society based on the idea that the Viking revival went really far.
I have a villain in this thing called Skallagrim the Quick (a name I made up on the spot) and I have no clue who he is but I know he would play a similar role to Thráinn the berserker in *Hrómund Gripsson’s saga.
*
beserker
IIRC, Icelandic laws required that a wealthy person take in nay destitute person (relative or not) and provide for them. There was also the vistarband or a sort of domestic servitude where if you were poor you were expected to register as a farm worker on a farm and if you didn’t you were forced to— but does this for example mean that there might not be large numbers of poorhouses?
The term “Viking revival” refers to a scholarly and a vaguer popular interest in the history of the Vikings:
If you’re going to use this in your story, you’re going to have to come up with an extensive alternate history which explains how (in your story) this led to a much wider change in society, bringing back the Viking customs you want to include in your future society.
It’s already on an alternate Earth… basically what if the interest was more than scholarly if you get my drift?
Excuse me. This is what I intended to link to:
What do you mean by “an alternate Earth”? Do you mean it’s another planet? Do you mean that it’s an alternate history? What is that history? You’re going to have to come up with an extensive alternate history which explains why the Viking revival expanded into a complete change in the society. It doesn’t sound very convincing to me, so I suspect that you’re going to have to be really complete and explicit in your background for this society to explain how it came about. Something that is simply an alternate history with no background will leave many of your readers dissatisfied.
@Wendell Wagner: My concept was/is in the saga ideas that the setting’s a post-apocalyptic future. For this one it’s a parallel world.
Here’s the series concept for the saga retellings (and maybe beyond)
[spoiler] Set in a post-apocalyptic world which has regressed to medievalism/feudalism after a nuclear war and climate change at the end of this century. In order to create more efficient labour forces and provide some form of defence along with the Coast Guard and Crisis Response Unit the Icelandic government orders the creation of a standing army including troops resembling deformed dwarves through synthetic biology as well as a beserker and ulfheðinn unit made up of humans who agree to be genetically modified through surgery (all expenses paid). Similar responses occur in other Scandinavian countries, the United States Britain and throughout the world.
A century after the war, the ulfheðnar and beserkers have married into prominent Scandinavian noble families (former crime families) Norse paganism and the worship of Odin have resurged in response to the newly hostile world. Climate change (rising sea levelsrapid cooling and warming, ) and the collapse of centralised governments has led to attempted invasions and Viking raids from all over Scandinavia, including Iceland which now follows the systems of godar and being divided into farthings. Countries are split into petty kingdoms again.
The most prominent families in Scandinavia in the world of the saga stories are:
Iceland: Völsungar (Völsungs, coming originally from Ostergotland in former southern Sweden, with some Norwegian and Icelandic blood)
Niflungar (Niflungs, Nibelungs) native-born Icelanders who have lived there since the Age of Settlement
Lofdungar (Lofdungs) native-born Icelanders-- their ancestry includes immigrants and thralls.
Denmark: Skjoldungar (Skjoldungs) The royal house of Denmark (Zealand, Lejre) who claim to be able to trace their descent back to the Viking Age and even further back eventually to Odin. They are the descendants of Danish gangsters. The Skjoldungar have a reputation as Vikings.
Sweden: Siklingar (Siklings): The royal house of Vastergotland. Rivals with the Völsungs.
Ylfingar (Wulfings, Ylfings): The royal house of Ostergotland who came to power after deposing the Völsung king Sigi and sending him into exile in Iceland. Distant relatives of the Völsungs.
Scylfingar (Scylfings): The rulers of Sweden (Central Sweden) who claim to be descended from Frey.
Norway:
Ynglingar(Ynglings) Rulers of Hálogaland and Ringerike.
[/spoiler]
That’s for the saga-related stories. My actual concept for this one is a parallel universe; a version of our world with magic and with all the real-world locations depicted as they were in Icelandic sagas, in particular the fornaldasogur. So basically a parallel universe.
Note: The concepts are different for both ideas. The post-apocalyptic setting is for the saga-related stories and the parallel universe setting is this story’s setting.
O.K., this is a confused world that you’ve created. You say it’s “a post-apocalyptic world which has regressed to medievalism/feudalism after a nuclear war and climate change” in which “the Icelandic government orders the creation of a standing army including troops resembling deformed dwarves through synthetic biology as well as a beserker and ulfheðinn unit made up of humans who agree to be genetically modified through surgery.” This is contradictory. If it’s regressed to the level of the Middle Ages, it can’t have synthetic biology and genetic modification. Furthermore, it’s not an alternate universe, apparently. This is just a possible future for our own universe. I had assumed that when you said that it was “a society based on the idea that the Viking revival went really far” that you meant it was a universe that diverged from ours in the nineteenth century, where the divergence started with the Viking revival becoming so mainstream that it caused a major change in society. You’re going to have to be much more explicit in your background. Where did this universe diverge from ours? If it didn’t diverge at all, what future events caused the things about the society that you’re discussing.
@Wendell: The future concept is for another story or series of stories.
This is hopelessly confused now. Apparently you’re going back and forth between two different story ideas. You’re going to have to carefully explain each of them.
About the idea mentioned in the OP.
The best way to explain what I’m trying to do with that is this:
You know how the Chronicles of Prydain series is a fantasy series taking its inspiration from Welsh mythology and legend, set in a country which is basically a fantasy version of Wales? The story mentioned in the OP (and any other possible stories in the same series that I might write) is kind of like the Norse counterpart to that. At least that’s what I want it to be but with a Victorian element. It’s set in Issenheim (fantasy Iceland/Norway).
The world in the OP is a fantasy world that takes its inspiration from early Icelandic history/traditional Icelandic mythology and folklore and sagas. Like what the Chronicles of Prydain does with Welsh mythology and legends.
Does that make it any clearer or less confusing?
Give me a complete background for one or both of the stories. The background should be several paragraphs long. Make sure that, if you’re giving the background for two of the stories, you’re clearly separating them so they aren’t getting mixed up. Perhaps you can give each of them a name if you give both of them. Otherwise I can’t understand what you’re talking about in this thread.
This one (titled Thórinn’s Company) is set in a country called Issenheim inspired by Norse (specifically Icelandic) history, mythology and legends in a parallel universe where magic and almost all mythological creatures from different parts of the world are real. The country itself is loosely inspired by Iceland and Norway in the High Middle Ages.
A lot of people in that country believe the world was created by Odin and two other gods from Ymir’s body, blood and bones. The other people in the country believe in-- well fantasy sort-of Islam, fantasy sort-of Judaism(mostly Dwarves. Sort of. It’s more complicated than that; fantasy sort-of Judaism was mostly adopted by humans from Dwarves through intermarriage, conversion or adoption) and fantasy Christianity (mostly humans and other races from the same area as the ones that follow fantasy sort-of Judaism. And fantasy sort-of Islam is pretty much a response to those other religions in theology and has its own prophet that brought the general religious rules that the religion’s followers live by. There are fantasy versions of other religions as well (lots of research to be done)
The basic political climate is based around the time of the Crusades. The fantasy Christians are fighting the fantasy Muslims over possession of fantasy Palestine. Back in fantasy-Western Europe there are attempts at forced conversion of pagans and genocide and the occasional heresy trial.
Does anyone have any advice on developing supporting characters? I tend to have the protagonist be the only really developed character (mostly because my stuff is mostly first-person) and I would like to have really developed supporting and minor characters in this one.