A few weeks ago I was coming up to a red light. The car in front of me was moving over to the left turn lane, but there were cars in front of it so he couldn’t pull all the way into it. I proceeded to go around him and in doing that I got a bit too close for comfort. My bike (and left leg) were probably about a foot from the back corner of his car. Not normally a problem but I was still traveling at a decent speed and the incident shook me a bit as I realized how close I was to pinning my leg between my bike and his car. I mentioned to a friend that I want to pick up a pair of engine guards so that I would have less of a chance of crushing my shin if I ever happen to clip a car. The counter point he made was that if my engine guard clipped his car I’d be pretty much guaranteed to spin my bike.
So, no engine guard…probably break my leg, but hopefully be able to maintain control long enough to come to a stop and lay the bike down with my good leg.
With engine guards, lose control of the bike but less of a chance of serious injury (I wear a helmet BTW) and if I stayed on the bike while it fell the engine guards should protect me from the full weight of the bike landing on me.
Let’s assume no secondary injuries in the process (getting hit by another car).
I should mention that I’m going to price shop these and probably put them on. I’m still inexperienced enough that laying my bike down at some point or another will happen some day so this will protect me from that as well.
Also, while we’re here. When you’re riding with a strong cross wind, is it better to be going faster or slower, or doesn’t it really matter? There’s a bridge in Milwaukee that regardless of what’s going on anywhere else usually has quite a strong cross breeze and when it’s windy out, it can be downright scary and I’m never sure if I should go a bit faster for the sake of momentum or if I should slow down.
Well, I kinda don’t understand your question. The whole idea is to avoid ramming your leg or the engine guards into the back of someone’s car. It seems weird to me to really think hard about optimizing the outcome of that scenario–just do your best to avoid it altogether (perhaps by just slowing down and not going around the car).
Also, I’ve never encountered the situation you describe in my riding. I don’t think this is one of those inevitable scenarios that you have to plan for. It’s kind of like asking about the best underwear to have on if you get struck by lightning.
On the cross-wind thing, I don’t see how your speed makes much of a difference (but I’m prepared to be wrong if someone busts some science on my ass).
That’s like looking at a bunch of people that are debating helmet wearing (I know people who have said they’d rather get into an accident without a helmet then with one, but that’s for another thread) and saying “Well, just don’t get into an accident and you don’t have to worry about it”
Maybe I didn’t explain it well enough. Pretend you are coming up to a red light, as you approach the light a left turn lane appears to your left. You also want to make a left, but there are already about 6 cars in the left turn lane. You put on your blinker, and as you slow down you begin to enter the left turn lane, but because of the cars already there, you can’t fully enter it so about half your car is still in the normal driving lane. The car or bike behind you saw you begin to enter the lane, but didn’t see that you wouldn’t make it in, so when you stop they suddenly brake harder or go around you. This wasn’t a big deal, nothing happened, it just made me realize what could happen.
You’ll see the two cars near the bottom of the picture, the front one is entering the left turn lane. Imagine several cars in front of that one waiting for the light to turn green and that’s as far in as he could go. The cars behind him can either wait for him to move up or go around him.
I understood the scenario from your OP description. I think this is unlike the helmet debate because some kind of accident is reasonably likely to occur. I just don’t think that this very specific type of accident is likely enough to occur to specifically plan for.
Fair enough. To make it more general. Let’s say you’re traveling at a moderate speed. Under 15 MPH. Maybe you’re pulling into your garage, maybe you’re in a parking lot, maybe you’re going down a side road in a suburb with lots of parked cars and people around. The situation doesn’t really matter. You clip something (garage door, car backing out, someone opens their car door). Would you rather do it with or without engine guards?
I know, it’s a somewhat specific question. Actually maybe it’s not. Engine guards, as far as I can tell, have three purposes. To protect your leg if you clip something, to protect your leg and the bike if you lay your bike down, and to mount highway pegs on. So even though the scenario is somewhat specific, it’s been addressed, I’m just curious if the answer is likely to make the problem worse.
I’ve always thought of engine guards as engine protection. In case the bike goes down on its side, they protect the engine from damage. Nothing more and nothing less.
The bike will not be less safe with engine guards on, but you shouldn’t feel any additional sense of safety and security with them on.
The three things you can do to mitigate the inherent dangers of driving a motorcycle are to practice what you learned at your rider’s course, wear your safety equipment and keep your bike in good repair.
Think three steps ahead. Always have an out planned in case something jumps out at you. Ride as if you’re invisible - no one can see you, especially the person who is about to roll through the stop sign into your path of travel. Keep your high beam on during the day. Keep your bike in gear while at a red light, watch your mirrors and be prepared to move quickly to a safe spot if it appears you’re going to be rear ended while you’re stopped.
I ride a large touring bike. I find it easier to control the bike at slower than normal speeds in a strong cross wind. I’ve heard different opinions on this issue from other riders. The big fairing on my bike may create more surface area making my bike more susceptible to the effect of cross wind compared to lighter bikes with less surface area.
Well, sorry to be Mr. Fight-the-hypothetical, but I guess I’m gonna keep fighting. The impact of an event is a function of its likelihood and the severity of the consequences. Just talking about the severity of the consequences doesn’t make all that much sense to me when the likelihood is so low that it’s effectively zero.
I asked what I thought was a good question, the likelihood of it happening has absolutely no impact on the outcome of the event whatsoever.* You’ve made three responses to this thread, each of them basically telling me not to worry about it since it probably won’t happen. If you aren’t going to answer the question, I’d politely ask you to bow out of the thread, you aren’t contributing and I rather not have the thread derailed. People ask hypothetical questions all the time, instead of telling me it’s hypothetical so why worry about it, how about approaching it as a thought exercise.
I’d be more then happy to continue the discussion with you if you’d like, here’s what the question boils down to.
You are riding your bike at a slowish speed, say under 15MPH when you clip a non moving object. Ignoring any secondary injuries, are you likely to be injured worse with or without engine guards on the bike?
*The only time the severity of the outcome depends on the likelihood of the event is in stats class…if that’s what you’re going for, let’s just assume, since this is hypothetical, that the likelihood is 100%. The next time I take my bike out, I plan to purposely clip something…should I do it with or without engine guards to minimize injury?
I subbed at the crash repair center at my last job, engine guards do some, but not a lot, especially shearing action like that. Sliding down the road they help protect the bike, but being wedged would cause it to fail.
I am following this thread because I will probably buy my first motorcycle in a few days. So I don’t have an opinion.
I will add that in Paraguay engine guards are called mataperros - dog killers.
My first thought was the same as Rand Rover’s. Your expectations of controling your motorcycle with a broken leg seem naive to me. It’s possible but it’s not exactly what you’d plan for.
Beyond that and given the premises in the OP I’ll take a wipe out over a smashed shin any day of the week.
In some ways I will have to agree with RR. You can’t just think about the accident that might happen, you need to think about avoiding the situation in the first place.
Now to answer your questions, I don’t think the engine guards will do squat for keeping you from breaking your leg or getting into an accident. I don’t think you’ll break a leg at that speed anyway. The engine guards are to keep the engine from being ruined and it will also make the bike easier to pick up if the bike falls over.
As for the wind question, I’m not really sure. The safest would normally be to ride the same speed as the surrounding traffic. You’ll get used to wind at some point and not even notice it. Unless it’s a massive gust that goes away quickly, you’ll lean into it and not let it push you out of the lane. I don’t think wind is all that bad either, just something to get used to.
Newer riders might like reading David Hough’s books on motorcycling. He writes on all sorts of dos and don’ts, how to think while riding, and even answers questions not unlike the OPs.
I’m a new rider, so I’ll give a fresh perspective on the question. Assuming the guard impacts the car at a slow speed, you are either going to spin off, or stop suddenly going ass over teakettle. Either way, your chances of injury are completely random. those guards add a lot of width to a bike, and in my mind, thus decrease the maneuverability of the machine. Frankly, I think you’d be more likely to be injured worse than if your leg got clipped.
Cross winds are tricky things and I don’t have enough time with them to comment.
Its usually best. but not always, to get away from a falling bike thats moving.
Engine guards may help you get your leg out from under, instead of having the bike drag you along under it.
Truoble is, there are so many possible scenarios in a crash, I have seen people get serious injuries when you paddling a bike in a U-turn at no MPH, and others get away with high speed events simply becuase they were incredibly fortnunate just to slide instead of hitting street furniture.
In a car, the accident youare trying to avoid usually starts two cars up in front, with a bike, the accident you are trying to avoid can come from almost any direction, from behind, the side or three cars up.
Most engine bars I have seen will protect the bike in low speed falls, and perhaps
allow you to get says from the bike, the sort of engine bars that offer the rider more protection are bike ugly things, you see them in Urals and such beauties, or sometimes on Harleys.
Another advantage of engine bars is that when you drop your machine, they can be used to help you rock the bike a bit and assist you getting it back upright.
Jeez - why do people have to read the OP with such blinders on as to keep responding back about avoiding an accident in the first place?
Of courseJoey P wants to avoid a future accident - either similar to the one he almost just had, or one completely different.
But the main crux of the question is in the title of the thread itself - given a situation, any situation - which is more preferred, wiping out on the bike, or breaking a leg?
Seems a fairly straight forward question to me.
(I personally have no input, because I only ride a bicycle, and the whole impact of damage a bike can do to your body during a wipeout is significantly different).
If you’re taking sufficient precautions and wearing proper armor, wiping out should be safer. It’ll almost certainly cost far less in pain and money to repair a downed bike than a leg.
If you’re not wearing proper gear…I dunno. Better your leg than your head, but how likely are you going to be able to control yourself in that situation anyway?
I’d go for the engine guards. When I had a bike, they were called crash bars and were required to be on the bike. I’d hate to go sliding down the highway without them.
