It’s been bugging me for a while that MS word always tells me to set off dependent clauses with commas. The rule I learned in high school was that you don’t use a comma if the clause is an essential qualifier of what you’re trying to say. I can explain this better with an example:
Apples which are red are one of my favorite foods.
(ie I specifically like red apples, but not necessarily any other kind.)
Apples, which are red, are one of my favorite foods.
(ie I like apples, and, BTW, apples are red.)
Am I wrong here, or is bad grammar to be added to the many sins of Gatestopheles?
Gates is partially right and you’re partially wrong. The old-fashioned rule is to use “that” for restrictive clauses and “which” for nonrestrictive clauses. So Word sees “which” and figures you must intend a nonrestrictive clause.
Some grammar authorities these days claim that it is acceptable to begin a restrictive clause with “which.” These authorities, however, are anarchists at heart, and I decline to endorse their heretical views.
According to most U.S. style guides, you should use “that” for essential clauses and “which” for non-essential clauses. Hence Word’s grammar recommendations to you.
Some of my favorite references where you can read more about this:
[ul][li]Woe Is I by Patricia T. O’Conner, Grosset/Putnam[/li][li]Lapsing into a Comma by Bill Walsh, Contemporary Books[/li][li]The Well-Tempered Sentence by Karen Elizabeth Gordon, Ticknor & Fields[/li][/ul]
IIRC, in U.K. English it is acceptable to use “which” for non-essential clauses. All of my style guides are U.S. versions, though, so I can’t confirm that.
Hi minty. Could I trouble you for examples which clarify the ‘that / which’ distinction, as you understand it?
I’m a Brit with a reasonably good grasp of grammar, but I am interested in the ‘standard’ distinction, according to US English usage, to which you refer. Many thanks.
IIRC from my days supporting Word, Microsoft doesn’t actually write the grammar utility; it’s written by a third party. I know the international spelling and grammar tools aren’t written by Microsoft.
*ianzin, when I looked in my usage dictionary for that first post, I noticed that it said you Brits use “which” for both restrictive and nonrestrictive clauses. So my earlier post doesn’t apply to ya’ll. Set your MSWord language to “English (UK)” and you ought to be just fine.
But just so you know what I’m talking about, the American rule is applied as follows (plagiarizing from the OP):
Apples that are red are one of my favorite foods. (I specifically like red apples, but not necessarily any other kind.)
Apples, which are red, are one of my favorite foods. (I like apples, and, BTW, apples are red.)
Unfortunately it doesn’t work that way 'cause I have my grammer set to UK English and it still does it, it drives my Mum crazy but its just one of those things. It’s becoming more normal to use “that” and “which” rather than just “which”.
All part of Bill Gates’ nefarious plot for world domination, Catmarie.
Step 1: Monopolize software industry
Step 2: Who the hell is Opal?
Step 3: Force everyone to speak American English
Step 4: Declare war on the rest of the Universe
