Again, I think that’s reading too much into his statement, even though I can see how some people might get that impression.
I think you are reading way too much into the OP, which is me. How on earth could I define my style as being agreeable and flexible and considerate without your drawing the conclusion that I’m some sort of masochistic “give-me-more-abuse” doormat? Are you drawing that conclusion because of something specific I’ve written here, or are you drawing it because that one allows you to make me solely responsible for the situation I’ve described? As I’ve explained it, inviting conflicts risks reminding this woman of all the other abusive relationships she’s been in that she (says she) is desperate to avoid now, though obviously her psychological makeup tells me that wanting rationally to avoid them and resisting emotionally being attracted to them are two different processes, and she probably won’t reconcile this without much consideration, which she may not be willing to do anyway and which she is certainly at the very early stages of reconciling, if she’s even begun. By the time she’s done, if ever, I’ll be long gone. I can’t deal with this over the long run, but it’s tolerable-to-excellent on a day-to-day basis.
So I’m in it for the fabulous sex, for the pleasant company, and for the time being. Meanwhile, I’m seeking to date other women, and when I find one whom I like, I will break the news to her and leave her to get on with her life, with my good wishes and with an open door if she wants to try again with much more emotional commitment to me, assuming I’m still available, which I may not be. Some of the responses have helped me to understand her psychological makeup, and the challenge I’m facing here, which had me good and confused, and has made me feel better about my plan to see other women, and to get active in doing so.
I’m basing it on this:
“I’m in no condition to object very strongly to any of these conditions.”
and especially this:
“stuff where I could easily assert contrary views or display annoyance but instead find ways to work things out without undue conflicts.”
You’re constraining yourself from expressing normal, healthy emotions in a normal, healthy manner because any disagreement or annoyance might make the fragile little flower wilt. That’s fucked up, every bit as much so as a battered woman tiptoeing around her abuser because any backtalk might make him blow up. I don’t know if it’s because of you or her or the way the two of you combine, and frankly I don’t care because it doesn’t ultimately matter–regardless of who’s bringing it on, it’s fucked up.
In my quest for wisdom on this subject, I don’t think I’ve found anyone who has said it better than Alexandra Burke:
Or…and this is just a thought…you behave like an actual adult man, stop wasting both your and her time, and focus on finding the sort of relationship you actually want to be in.
How are you going to find other women to date when you’re technically still attached to this current one? As far as I know, any respectable woman worth your time would run at the first sound of “I’m seeing someone right now, but I’m ending it with her as soon as I know what we have between us is real.” And if you choose to omit this whole “it’s complicated” mess, then you’re being dishonest from the start and you’ll find yourself in another empty shell of a relationship where you can’t be the real you.
I don’t think you know very far. Are you saying that no one, in an unhappy relationship, may go out on a date until he/she has severed all ties to his/her BF/GF?
I’m going to find these women to date, and a woman to date exclusively eventually, while still technically attached to this woman, because SHE has asked to have a non-exclusive dating relationship while having an exclusive sexual relationship. She is going out tonight, for example, with a bunch of her single women friends, and I understand that such evenings pretty much consist of going to places where there are available single guys. I don’t believe she is going to bed with any of them tonight (she’s pretty clearly laid out her standards–no sex on a first- or second-date, and I believe she will stick to it), while I am going to a party where I expect there will be quite a few single women, any of whom I feel free to ask out if so inclined. We don’t share a lot of details, but I think we’re both clear on what we expect: a little notice before either of us moves on.
I don’t get what kind of world you live in–if I’m in a non-exclusive relationship, do you think I’m going to expect of any woman who accepts a dinner date with me to be celibate at the time we first go out? For all I know, any woman I date has come to dinner straight from an orgy, and that’s all she can know of me. If I’m asked for an explanation of my situation on the first date, I’ll say something like “I’ve been seeing a lot of women [which I hope to be doing] lately, but I’m hoping to get into a serious long-term relationship sooner rather than later --I don’t feel very comfortable dating around,” which is the truth. Do you think I’m going to be grilled as to whether I’ve had sex recently, and with whom, and under which understanding? I wouldn’t presume to ask a woman on a first or second date such impertinent questions, and I’d feel free to answer them as generally and as truthfully as I’ve indicated above. I would break up with my current GF if I were getting into something serious with someone else, and that’s pretty much what my current GF is expecting, sooner or later, with one or the other of us. When it comes up with my newer GF, I’ll tell her, “I’ve been seeing someone, and sleeping with her, but I’m looking to get out of the relationship–it’s a non-exclusive sort of thing, I’m not happy with that arrangement, the woman is technically still married and she doesn’t want anything long-term, so it will be no problem making a clean break, and I want to.” Unless the new GF is looking to date someone who’s spent the last few years in a monastary, I don’t see where she’ll have a problem with that, and if she does --well, fuck her. I’ll find someone else.
Dude, if we went on a date and you told me you were sleeping with someone else, but don’t worry because it wasn’t serious and you would break up asap, I’d be gone SO FAST. Not because I was a nun, but because (1) I wouldn’t trust you to break up with her and (2) it would really tell me a lot about you. And none of those things would be good.
I’ve been on your side until now, prr, and I do think that others have been overly hasty and/or needless harsh in their judgment of you. Having said that, I’ve got to agree with Elysian’s latest remark.
I, on the other hand, would have no issues with someone making such a statement to me.
Well, except the part about looking for a serious relationship. That would send me running out the door screaming. But the rest of it? Sounds good to me. I date around, and I’d expect a compatible guy to the same.
Why do you think it would reflect badly on prr?
p.s. Is this the woman you were talking about in this thread?
p.p.s. Regardless of everything, you really should break up with her. As much as you say that you enjoy her company and the sex, it just seems that seeing her is a humongous drain on your mental and emotional energy.
I don’t understand the idea that you think prr is a “nice guy”. Since when is using an abused girl for sex (and a little company) until something better comes around something a “nice guy” does? No, it’s specifically how a “jerk” acts.
He clearly doesn’t care that much for this woman romantically, yet you keep telling him to change for her. Why should he? If he wants to change, he can, but doing it because she is asking him to is stupid.
That said, before you find someone else and break up with her, I think it would be an interesting experiment to try telling her that you plan on doing exactly what you say here. But he should only do it if HE wants to.
@tdn: a lot of the knowledge you want him to learn would be useless in a committed relationship. Think about it. Either he’ll fake it, which will never last, or he’ll change, which will cause him to attract other women, and be tempted to cheat on the committed relationship.
You seem to be quoting a lot of stuff from a book I know, and the author always pointed out that his stuff does not work in relationships. In fact, when people who wrote him mentioned acting too much like a wuss, he would sometimes respond with “What do you want to do, get married?”
QFT.
I think that in the modern world, where people don’t have to get married to any particular person to please society, and can sleep around/whine about the opposite sex/etc etc, there is going to be a very big percentage of people who simply never find a partner that fits their criteria, no matter how generous they think they’re being. And we should just learn to deal with it.
Mostly because if that was said to me when I was in the initial stages of a relationship, when I was weighing up my options, I would have little backstory and none of the objectivity that people are applying in this thread. I think the post directly above this one said something about “using that [poor] girl for sex” and if I didn’t know any better that’s exactly the conclusion I would come to.
If I asked for an explanation and prr told me that the girl was emotionally unreachable etc etc then I wouldn’t really trust him to be telling me the truth. It sounds a little too pat and a little too much like the sort of games callow young men play. In fact I think I’ve had that very line spoken to me before when the girl was definitely NOT cool with him dating others.
Now, after reading this thread and not caring one way or the other, I can shrug and tell prr that it’s his life and he does with it as he wishes. But if it was me on the other side of a fledgling relationship with him I would drop him as quickly as possible.
You beat me to it, but yeah. This thread essentially boils down to “My girlfriend doesn’t appreciate me and treats me like a consolation prize. It’s like she’d prefer to be with someone who treats her badly. What the hell is wrong with her?” :smack:
Who cares what’s wrong with her? Nothing you can do about it. Figure out what’s wrong with you, and address that.
Ah. Well, one of the reasons we may see it differently is that you see a couple of dates as “initial stages of a relationship” or “a fledgling relationship.” I see them as nothing but a couple of dates. Different orientations, I suppose.
Um… no. If he learns it for real, and really changes, then he can have a much more fulfilling committed relationship, either with that particular woman or with someone else.
What book is that?
I live in a world where women with good heads on their shoulders don’t get involved with men who are already attached. I don’t care if you have an agreement or an open relationship, or whatever it is that you’ve worked out in your situation. Dating is hard enough as it is, and it’s silly to add drama when it can so easily be avoided. So, yes… you should be “single” before you pursue someone else.
That’s not to say that Green Bean doesn’t have a good head on their shoulder. Obviously, she knows what she wants and that’s why she’d be okay with dating someone in a complicated situation because to her, dating means going out and having fun without worrying what comes out of it long-term.
You, however, would say:
And that already, is a twisting of the situation. You’re not “dating around” if you’re still speaking of your girlfriend as your girlfriend. It’s not like you’re single and have gone out on a few dates with several different people to get to know them and see where it goes. It’s something else when you’ve invested your time into a relationship, only recently realized it’s not working out the way you wanted it to work out and thus looking for someone else to satisfy you emotionally. Essentially, what it comes down to is that you are unhappy with your current relationship, but you have this need to not be alone that you would rather stick around “for the sex and companionship” than to release the burden before moving on. Kinda hard to jump ships when you’re still anchored onto something.
Here’s the deal.
When you pressure her for reasons why she’s not that into you, she’s just trying to be kind. Saying you are “too nice” is being kind, if she were being honest she’d say too fat or too old or not rich enough or too bald or not good in bed or whatever real reason she has that you can’t change. If you turned into bad boy, you’d just be an asshole that she’s not into.
and if you are really a nice guy you won’t bring another woman into the picture until you’re free of her, it sounds to me like you just want another girlfriend to try to make her jealous or show her what she’s missing or some reason that has nothing to do with the 3rd party that you risk hurting with your little head games - pun intended.