Jerry Falwell sent me an e-mail (I dont know how I ended up on his mailing list; I’m an liberal atheist) asking me to sign a petition to “protect the pledge of allegiance.” Here was my response: (I’ve put this in GD since its a controversial issue that many people will probably attack me for.)
uh oh
Now your on their list …:o
Hey, if it makes you feel better. But there’s no way this’ll make a difference, unfortunately.
Knee-jerk Atheists are no better than Knee-jerk Christians (or Muslims, or Jews, or Hindus, or Snake-worshippers). Neither side can see a phrase like “under god” for metephor.
Rob
Yeah, the only thing that could possibly accomplish would be to get it off your chest.
Enlighten us. How is it a metaphor?
Simple: It’s a metaphor when the damn liars who know full well it’s not (the hoard of congressfolk) want the people who know it’s not to bend over and take the violation of the constitution.
This rant-addition brought to you by a veteran and a believer in deity.
Is this the petition you got? Or has he written a new one?
http://www.buzzflash.com/alerts/2001/12/121401_Falwell_Email.html
Yeah, oh well. I’m still glad I did it, even if he’ll never read me.
How am I a “knee-jerk Atheist”?
Oh, the ryan no it’s a different petition.
Qwerty:
Because you are pretending to be so offended by the phrase “under god…”.
Quite frankly, I think you are just posing.
Rob
And why, if I may ask, do you think that? Do you know qwertyasdfg in real life? 'Cause otherwise, you have nowhere near enough data to even guess about what he does and does not believe.
From one newbie to another, and all that.
I was being charitable. If Qwerty really is all that upset over a little phrase like “under god”…well, we will just say it doesn’t bode well…
Rob
Right, only Christians can possibly be upset by this whole issue…
**Qwerty:
Because you are pretending to be so offended by the phrase “under god…”.
Quite frankly, I think you are just posing.
Rob**
I believe you are missing the point here. Why, exactly, is it just a little thing when a government does everything they can to recite a “patriotic pledge”, one that includes a phrase that contradicts the personal beliefs of millions? Also, if it is just a “little thing”, why wouldn’t Christians also be “posers” for getting extrodinarily upset over the removal of two words? Getting offended by a blatant violation of SoCaS does not necessarily mean that one is thin skinned.
As a Christian, I am upset that anyone is being forced to call America a nation “under God”. What conclusion do you draw from this?
And by the by: calling qwertyasdfg a poser does not qualify as being charitable.
Re: the OP, I’m on that same damned mailing list, and apparently it’s Falwell’s goal to get one million signatures on this stupid petition of his. He might even succeed. I haven’t responded, mostly because I don’t want him to know that he’s sending to a valid address. I do want to find out who gave him my addy in the first place, but the details of that are more appropriate to the Pit than to GD.
Taran: I think Jerry found me because his college has a list of email addresses of students that he wants to advertise to. I’ve gotten mail from all sorts of colleges, including “Liberty” University, which he is apparently the chancellor of (which contradicts its title.) I guess he’s borrowed this list for his own personal uses. I had a comment about this, but it was, as you said, Pit material.
I gotta be honest, I don’t really understand what you’re trying to say here. Care to explain a little, please?
I don’t want to speak for Monty, but I think he’s saying that the “metaphor” claim is lie/excuse, to trick atheists and other dissenters into giving consent, while the people making this claim actually take it literally, and don’t actually consider it a metaphor at all. Thats how it seems to me at least.
I think what Monty is trying to say is that people (specifically, congresspeople) do not actually believe it is a metaphor, they are merely saying that it is a metaphor in the hope that this (rather weak) argument will let them squeak past the first amendment’s Establishment Clause.
BTW, I hated saying the “under God” part of the pledge when I was in elementary school (1970s). In 5th and 6th grade, I rolled my eyes (like this: :rolleyes: ) instead of saying “God”.