If you want to negotiate your rent, you can’t work backward from the mortgage to decide a fair rent. First of all you should be aware that there are other amounts involved here (down payment? maintenance?). Second of all, none of that makes any difference.
The first thing I would do is to investigate alternatives. Find out the least amount of rent you could pay to live someplace acceptable and keep that in mind. If his demands exceed that, make it clear that you will have to leave. You may indeed have to leave, but I doubt it. After all, he has a mortgage to pay. Also, since this is a new situation, what is going to happen when the furnace breaks - is he going to ask you for half (or two thirds)? Whatever the situation is, both of you should understand it going forward. One of the advantages of being a renter is usually that your expenses are fixed. His are not. Also, you get to leave when you want (or when your lease lets you).
I would try to sit down with him and make a formal agreement.
The real problems are going to come when arguments about cleaning the common areas erupt. Good luck with that.
If you split utilities based on the number of people living there, under the assumption that each enjoys an equal amount of the utilities, then the fact that four people are essentially living in the house does, indeed, make a difference in what is “fair.” It is the difference between 1/3 for each roommate and 1/2 for each couple.
It doesn’t matter if he doesn’t OWN the place, as a paying tenant he has rights to enjoy the space. That doesn’t mean that either party can have parties til 3am on a work night, but it does mean that either party should be allowed to enjoy the common areas within reason.
This is no longer a roommates divvying up expenses situation. It’s a landlord tenant situation. “Fair” doesn’t enter into it. Only what the landlord is willing to accept and what the tenant is willing to pay. Even if the landlord said they had to pay all utilities, it would certainly be unreasonable, but it has nothing to do with “fair” or “unfair.”
They could have an agreement specifying a split based on the number of occupants, but even then it wouldn’t be about “fair”, it would be about honoring the agreement.
It’s the landlord’s house, but it’s the OP’s HOME. When you rented, did the landlord have the right to tell you that you couldn’t have visitors in your own home?
Tenants have rights. The OP isn’t crashing on his buddy’s couch, he’s paying rent. That means he gets to have (within reasonable limits) a birthday gathering. That’s what we use our homes for, from time to time.
I am definitely in favor of the OP and the landlord sitting down and putting on paper the terms of the lease. Anything else is just going to devolve into hard feelings on both sides.
You’re no longer a renter, you are a boarder. What you get asked to pay for your monthly board is completely at the home owner’s discretion, and doesn’t need to have any bearing on what the home owner’s monthly mortgage payment is. After all, if a person owned their own home outright and decided to take in a boarder, you wouldn’t expect the boarder to live there for free, just because the home owner no longer has a mortgage!
So you need to change your mindset. You are no longer ‘equal’ in terms of power (when you were both renting off a third-party), but that’s not to say you don’t have rights.
You definitely need to have a conversation with the home owner, acknowledging that the nature of the relationship has changed. Discuss all the scenarios and see what his take on them are. For example, if his girlfriend stays more than x nights a week, does she contribute to bills. If you want to have friends over, what is the agreement. If you and your girlfriend were to split and she left the house, would he expect you to pay more to cover what she was paying. Etc, etc.
This isn’t a negotiation, the home owner gets to set the rules. You then decide whether you are prepared to live under those rules, in which case you stay, or whether it’s time to move on.
I disagree, both sides have the right of refusal, and both sides must agree to the terms. It’s a business agreement, the OP is paying HALF of the owner’s mortgage, and HALF the utilities. If the agreement goes south, the OP has to rent elsewhere, and the owner has just doubled the cost of owning the home, until he finds another tenant, who is going to be sharing the house with him for the forseeable future.
Both sides have a lot to lose if the house rules can’t be worked out. It’s a situation built for fruitful negotiation. The OP shouldn’t think of the discussion as one where he must enter on bended knee and wait for his lordship’s decision.
But at the end of the day, if the boarder doesn’t like the rules the home owner wants to set, then it’s the boarder that will be moving out, not the home owner. If that’s not an imbalance of power, then I don’t know what is.
And just because the home owner is charging the boarder an amount equal to half the owners mortgage, does not mean that the border is PAYING half the mortgage. The only time the boarder is paying half the mortgage is when the boarder’s name appears on the mortgage contract.
I believe that Sandra nz is correct that the OPer is a boarder, not a renter.
Before accepting a boarder, it was the responsibility of the homeowner to establish house rules. For instance, if the boarder is expected to ask for permission to host gatherings, then that should have been agreed upon before allowing the boarder to move in. He should have also spelled out how utilities were to be divided. Since this wasn’t done, it’s essential that they come to some agreement on such things now.
Imbalance of power is being a part time register jockey making minimum wage at a Wal Mart with 50 open job applications on file. You don’t like the work rules, they have folders full of people looking to take your place.
This landlord doesn’t have anything of the sort. He’s potentially relying on his boarder to fund a large chunk of his monthly bills, and he actually has to share his home with the person he makes an agreement with. Most folks don’t take on boarders because they’re lonely.
This landlord has FAR more to lose by kicking out a boarder than Wal Mart has to lose by firing a 20hr per week cashier.
Let’s just agree that we disagree on the meaning of ‘imbalance of power’. You think it’s more about who has more to lose, I think it’s more about who gets to make the final decision (regardless of whether it’s a good or bad decision).
Yet the landlord still can set any rules he wants so long as they’re legal. You do not have a legal right to a birthday gathering for example. If you don’t like it, tough shit. Find somewhere else to live. If the landlord’s rules are unreasonable and he can’t find boarders, tough shit again. This isn’t that difficult.
I think a fair arrangement would be for your roommate to give the Master suite to you and your girlfriend… then you would split the rent 3 ways. This the the arrangement I had in college when I was in a similar situation.
If he doesn’t want to do that I think the arrangement you have now is the fairest solution…hter are TWO of you and only ONE of him and yet you are splitting the rent in half. Seems pretty sweet to me.
Still not quite right. You’re right that the mortgage and the amount of the mortgage payment are irrelevant. However, there is no rent in the traditional sense, as the OP is a border in the owner’s house. The pertinent questions revolve around the market tariff (it really isn’t rent, as that term is traditionally applied to tenants who rent and have control of a property) for occupying a bedroom in someone’s house, how much use the border is entitled to throughout the remainder of the property, whether utilities should be split, and if and how often the border can have overnight guests.
All of this should have been discussed and agreed to before the OP moved in, but perhaps can be accomplished now. Probably not, though, and I stick with my earlier prediction that a moving truck will be showing up in the near future.
If you already perceive greed and controlling, on his part, you need to get out.
Pointing out that your girlfriend cleans the house, or his room is bigger, is just bullshit nonsense and has less than nothing to do with matters of costs or tenant rights.
Your perception of him, right or wrong, has already doomed this venture, to my eyes. Start looking for another place. It may be a bargain but nothing is worth living with anger and resentment, which you seem to have already developed.
None of you bothered to discuss any of this before agreeing to live together, and so you’re all equally at fault for the mess you have now, in my opinion. Your foolishness is about to cost you a friendship, I’d wager.
Just how ugly it gets is entirely within your control. It’s not too late to bring a little adult maturity to the situation. Be honest, you have resentments, this is clearly not going to work. Let’s all just accept that and move on, we’ve all learned somethings and that’s enough.
Well, except for – maybe – the “lay down some ground rules”, I don’t see any signs that the OP is being hostile about this. More like asking for opinions.
They do need to try to hash out a formal agreement, but I think it’s a bit premature to talk about it getting ugly or him having resentments. Even if they can’t agree and the OP moves out, it doesn’t necessarily doom the friendship.
