In response to the ideas put forth that Heinlein went with the flow of the sixties, or that he turned into a “hippie”: just not true. Heinlein, if we take his word for it, began the writing of what would become Stranger In A Strange Land in 1948, but put it away, as he knew the social mores would have to change before it would be publishable. I sense that Heinlein always hated the social taboos on writing and speaking about sex, etc., and it seems to me that instead of him catching up with the sixties, the sixties, to an exent, caught up with him.
He pretty much despised being a “guru” to commune dwellers, etc. and although kind to those who sought him out, he made sure to distance himself from them, and spoke disparagingly of most of the counterculture. See Grumbles From The Grave.
Heinlein a Fascist? Hmmmm. That’s a GOOD one. Haven’t had to answer this one in quite a while, but here goes:
Certainly, in Starship Troopers there is a WORLDWIDE society based upon citizenship requirements. Those requirements being civil service. Either in the military or in some other role, and they would have you sorting stamps if you were fit for nothing else, because of disease or infirmity. BUT: What about Stranger in a Strange Land, where the new society being formed is ANTI military in nature, and calling every person to be accountable for his or her own actions?
Heinlein is a racist?
Sure. In Farnhams Freehold there is the American culture of the future completely dominated by blacks. But if you actually read the book instead of just passing judgement, he describes PEOPLE. I am constantly amazed by the number of “literate” readers that consistantly miss this point. It could have been ANY ethnic group, or the human/alien amalgam from the X Files, and it would NOT have mattered to the story, or to the point.
Heinlein is a sexist?
Laughable. If he had treated all his female characters or leads in the same fashion, I might possibly could agree with you. But read Friday. Let me know how SHE is treated. Or how about Dora, in Time Enough for Love? How about Podkayne, in Podkayne of Mars? Do you think he might be describing different societies than our own, maybe…? I always took his premise that people defined their own relationships, and that Big Brother should keep strictly hands off. In ALL other cultures within human history, a woman was ready for marriage just after the onset of menses. Just as a man was ready after puberty. This is a historical fact, regardless of how people might “feel” about it today. What he TRIED to do was rub the modern man’s nose in the fact that our laws are NOT the laws of the universe, and in fact would be considered weird be ANY other culture or race up until the time America was formed as a country, mainly by “forward” thinking Fundies of the time.
Anyone like to comment? I can cite anything you would like.
Yup. He mentions several times in Time Enough for Love through Lazarus that his Tertius famly just wouldn’t believe the mores of the American society of his time. This is particularly true where he’s explaining to Laz & Lor why they can’t accompany him back in time, and so he ends up disembarking the Dora alone in a pasture.
That is so VERY true, VB. Most Americans have this “thing” about their laws being the One and True Correct Way® that they have REAL culture shock just traveling to foreign countries. Just imagine a culture 2,000 years ago. Or in the future.
Yeah, but that’s what I was getting at. The two books couldn’t be further apart in terms of ideology (at least, from my recollection).
I appreciate Sir Rhosis’ comment about Heinlein starting *Stranger in a Strange Land * in 1948. That does sound odd, though: Heinlein was a discharged American serviceman in the commencement of the Cold War, and writing about a new Jesus from Mars who lived in a commune?!?
Actually, Heinlein was discharged due to TB? Something like that anyway, in 1938. MUCH earlier than the cold war. He then was hired to work in a “Manhatten Project” type group, along with Isaac Asimov and another author during WW2 (I think it was Van Vogt). And he did start Stranger slightly after the War, but ended up putting it away while he wrote his “Juveniles”, which decidedly aren’t.
The thing that I absolutely LOVE about RAH, other than he was the father of modern SF, yadda yadda, is one simple story related by another author, Spider Robinson. He was talking about his early days as an author, BARELY making the bills, and being hungry alot. Anyway, one day in the mail, this box of money appears. From the Heinleins. No strings, no questions asked. Spider was simply astounded that Bob knew of his work, much less had heard that he had fallen on hard times, and sent the gift. This, from a “money hungry” author who bent the publishers over a barrel.
Not to be nitpicky, but I believe Heinlein was discharged around 1933-1934. I believe he graduated from Annapolis in 1929, and seem to recall reading that he served around five years before coming down with TB.
Stranger In A Strange Land, IIRC, began as a story idea called “Gulf” (long story about this issue of Astounding, predicted a year before publication), but he wrote another story to the title. I believe he wrote a piece for a librarian’s magazine in which he had a throw-away line about alien names, stating something to the effect “Why can’t a Martian be named Smith?” A MARTIAN NAMED SMITH was the first title, I blieve, but was changed. So I’ll emend my statement to say that he began thinking about writing the book in the late 40s/early 50s.
The other author to work with Heinlein and Asimov was L. Sprague DeCamp, the only one of the three who was active military. There’s a famous photo of the three of them taken during this time which years later in 1975 or so, they duplicated (assuming as nearly the same poses and expressions, albeit now thirty years older, that they had in the original) at a World Con or something like that.
Virginia Gerstenfeldt was a young Navy Lieutenant working for Heinlein at the Philadelphia Yards. After the war, Heinlein divorced his wife and married Ginny.
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*Originally posted by Tuckerfan *
**Heinlein was also not the only one to speak kindly of Ginny. In Requiem, nearly everyone made it a point to speak of how wonderful Ginny was to Heinlein. When RAH was too ill to complete a rewrite of ***Stranger in a
I attributed it to the problems he was having with cerebrovascular blockage, myself. Although he said he was much improved after surgery, it is not uncommon for difficulties to linger.
I attributed it to the problems he was having with cerebrovascular blockage, myself. Although he said he was much improved after surgery, it is not uncommon for difficulties to linger. **
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(Sorry. I toyed with the idea of previewing, but foolishly opted not to. Obviously.)