All right, this is the whiners’ forum, right? I figure I might as well give myself a big boo-hoo. Anyone got a hanky ready? This is gonna be annoying.
Here goes. Okay, I have a lot of friends who listen to music. However, a whole assload of them seem to have no real concept of the actual history of music. This, in of itself, doesn’t bother me. But when they voice the ignorance, it gets on my nerves. I’ll give some examples (of course, I’m going to sound like a pompous asswipe doing so, which is usually one of the perks of whining), all of which were said by the same person:
Example 1: The bloke’s playing some MP3s, and of course I start complaining about how derivative the pop punk he’s listening to is. He takes umbrage at the term “pop punk” and I explain that a real punk rocker would giggle at the Good Charlotte type crap that the mainstream-rock world thought of as punk. He got upset again, and said, fine, I’ll play some real punk. And puts Green Day on.
Example 2: “Elvis wasn’t rock and roll, the drumming wasn’t heavy enough. He was white boy blues.” :rolleyes:
Example 3: This is a different guy, but he tried to explain to me that heavy metal was “ripped off” of punk rock. I point out that heavy metal was pretty clearly established by 1970, when Black Sabbath released their self-titled. He couldn’t find anything before the mid-1970s that was defined as punk… so he started claiming the bands that punk took their lineage from as punk bands (like The Who, as goofy as that sounds).
Individually, this sort of thing only mildly grates on my nerves. But when there seems to almost be a cultural epidemic of claiming knowledge on things based on the few snippets you remember from watching VH1 Behind The Music, that’s when I start to get annoyed.
Icebrand, I just finished talking to you in my pit thread, now I have to follow yo to yours. You are so absofuckinlutely right, especially about point number one. Even if your friends hate you, you can rest in the divine knowledge the rock gods have shared with you and know that you’re right.
The only thing uncooler than listening to lame mainstream punk-esque crap is insulting other people that do. Real punk rockers get a sort of vague amusment from the whole thing. Really- it’s kind of cute. But it’s nothing new. And you’ve tread no new ground saying that it sucks. The only more trite thing you could do is say “punk is dead” or something.
Pop punk means different things to different people. To me it brings up fond memories of pogoing in tiny clubs to the Mr T Experience and the Groovie Ghoulies. And some of the best music in the world is derivitive. You can rip off the Ramones any day of the week and I’ll be all over it as long as you have energy and humor. I’ve never been a Green Day fan, but there was a time when Green Day could do it. Maybe you ought to be careful about what terms you bandy around.
Oh yeah, the point of that is that you can never be a poser by truely and enthusiastically likeing something. But the easiest way to be a poser is care enough about what other people think of you to publically deride them.
And everyone has to start somewhere. I discovered punk rock by staying up too late and hearing the punk show on the crappy alternative radio station (hopeing to hear more Pearl Jam, doubtlessly) in eight grade. Other people discover it by listening to Green Day and digging a bit deeper. Maybe your friend will, maybe he won’t. If you really want to influence him, introduce him to some new, less publicized bands. Don’t just sit there and take easy shots.
But if they publicly deride YOU, turnabout’s fair game. Especially if they change the music you’re playing in the middle of a party. While deriding it.
Icebrand, I’ll tell ya what. I’ve never been a fan of punk; or much of anything that pretended to be punk. I have no doubt that if I told you what kind of music I do like, you’d snort Mountain Dew (or whatever true punkers drink) out of your nose whilst rolling on the floor with laughter. But I’ll make you a deal: if I ever decide to take up listening to punk, I’ll be sure to consult you first, so I can make sure that the punk I’m listening to is worthwhile punk. Okay?
There, there, everything’s gonna be all right. Jerk.
Everyone knows that REAL punk rockers drink a 50/50 mixture of water from the drainpipe and urine.
Oh, and anyone claiming that REAL <insert type of person> <do whatever> is a tool.
I agree that it gets very annoying when I hear a 12 year old girl telling me that Avril Lavigne is punk, or when I see a 16 year old kid wearing a mohawk and a Good Charolotte shirt at the same time (both have happened recently). All I can do is slowly shake my head and walk away. They’re young and are absolutely convinced that they are listening to “true punk.” Whatever makes them happy, you know?
Elvis laid the groundwork for all this music today. He started it all. I don’t know why my brother likes today’s music and rap. Rap is so horrible sounding, it makes backstreet boys look good.
Like the time I was listening to El-P’s Fantastic Damage, a great underground-ish hip-hop disc, and this guy comes in and he’s like “What is this, a joke?” and pops out the disc to put on his “Hip Hop Mix Disc #3.” Oh yippy skippy, Nelly!! I’m glad someone finally exposed my joke music and turned me on to the deep lyrics and rich tapestry of beats that is “Shake Ya Tailfeatha.”
Americans really do seem to have a thing forever sub-categorising and pigeon-holing their music. When I have a look at the categorises that appear in online CD databases I don’t recognise half of them and disagree with another quarter. But obviously the differences must be awfully important in the US.
What’s the deal? Does the label affect the content? Would you just die if you inadvertently listened to some “Ska Alternative Rock” instead of the “Alternative Rock Ska” that you’re really a fan of?
I have this argument with my brother a lot. We both listen to a lot of metal from northern Europe. We’ll find a new band, and I’ll say that I’d call them death metal, for example. He’ll tell me that the proper name for it is melodic progressive black metal instead. Seems like such a waste of breath to me.
I think it was the Brits that came up with all the different terms for techno…drum and base, house, hard house, trance, trip hop, hip hop, jungle, acid jazz, ambient, underground…AHHHH it drives me nuts!!!
Yeah, that’s us 'mericans in a nutshell. Like, we use the complex term “Techno” and in Europe they simplify this by calling it jungle, breakbeat, drum 'n bass, trance, goa, garage, big beat, acid house, garage, ambient, dark wave, happy hardcore or any mixture of these words (happy goa, garage house).
On preview, I’m going to beat Tezmac with mallot. :smack: