We just got the rates for health insurance for 2010 and I just about flew off the handle:
Rates for employee + spouse are over 10x higher than just the employee - what the helll is up with this? I could see double (obviously) and I could see higher than double, but seriously 10x?!
I have not paid much attention to this before and wouldn’t have this year, but they also added a tobacco surcharge. on top of the “not participating in our health nazi plan” surcharge, which they had last year.
I am just a big bundle of WTF??!!
I am going to be asking HR about the employee + spouse = 10x. that just seems unreasonable to me.
Sounds like they’re trying to encourage spouses who might be employed to use their own employer’s benefit plan.
“10x” sounds like a lot, but what’s the total amount? Is it $20 for you and $200 for the two of you? Or $200 for you and $2,000 for both? If the total is reasonable, that’s what matters.
I am also a bit ticked about the other surcharges, but I understand them. that tobacco surcharge will be a kick in the pants to the Mr. He has tried quitting and has never been successful yet.
Well, noble as his efforts may be, his continued smoking is harmful to his health (which you all clearly know) and pose a tremendous cost for the company. Lung cancer ain’t cheap.
My wife’s employer covers all of her health insurance premium and none for spouse or children, so it would be infinitely times more expensive for her to add me.
Exactly - I pay zero and a spouse would have to pay what it cost. Actually, I can’t even get Himself on my insurance, as we’re not married, so his insurance would cost infinity.
This is why I think I’m missing something about the whole health insurance thing in the US. I’m in Canada and I paid my bill today. I paid it online. It was $10.80.
There is obviously some aspect of the debate that I’m missing. Who would want to pay so much? I just don’t get it.
I would love for someone to explain it to me. I fully accept that there is a lot I don’t know about it. If I have to go to the doctor, I make an appointment and go. If I break my arm I go to the ER.
Our system is not perfect, far from it. But for the average joe it works pretty well.
My insurance also has a tobacco surcharge. I don’t smoke, but I wondered how do they know for sure that you’re a non-smoker. Couldn’t you just lie on the forms? Do they test your lungs? Do they rely on the HR people at your work to report back if they see you outside having a smoke? Or is it the sort thing that they think will just come out if you need to go to the doctor for some repiratory ailment?
I think they are implementing this for NC state employees this year and I seem to recall hearing that they were going to do random audits of state offices and take saliva samples (or something like that) of “non-smokers” to check for compliance.
That is what I pay a month. I know taxes also go towards it, but that’s what I pay per month.
And I’ve heard that argument that we get less service but I just don’t see how that’s true. My aunt went to the hospital on Friday with fuzzy vision so they kept her in for the weekend. My dad has had cancer and shingles, and he has epilepsy. He had radiation, an extended stay at the hospital and just went for his blood tests to make sure his epilepsy is under control. Now my mom and dad do pay more than I do, they pay $90 a month for both of them.
I’ve had my tonsils removed, about once or twice a year I end up in the ER because of my asthma, I broke my arm, I had to have two toenails pulled because of an infection.
I’m just not seeing how I am getting less service.
It also completely ignores the fact that “more” is not always “better”, even in healthcare. We’ve got folks who are over medicated as well as folks who can get the medication they need, as an example.
FloatyGimpy–It is not that we want to spend so much, it is that the available choices are so high. I shall attempt to explain. FWIW, IANan insurance underwriter, this is my understanding given I have worked in the medical field as a medical biller & medical office manager.
Here we go--> My employer (70employees) offers health (vision & dental also) ins coverage for "Employee", "Employee + spouse", or "Employee +family". ***Boss pays a portion of my monthly premium as a benefit.*** Included in the "benefit" is the opportunity to have health insurance with a group w/o needing to have a physical exam and few, if any, riders for any "pre-exisiting condition".
***Boss does not pay any portion to cover spouse or family. ***
So, “Employee only” will always be less than “E+S” or “E + F”.
The health ins coverage offered can be a PPO, where I pay less out-of-pocket if I go to contracted doctors and facilities(a deductible + a copay of 25% or 35% after ins pays "allowed amount"); a HMO, where I can only see a **certain group of doctors & facilities to receive the full benefit ($5 fee at time of service, that is all->no balance due after ins pays) of having coverage-**if I see a non-contracted D or F I pay 100% out of my own pocket;and a high deductible PPO plan, where I have a high deductible but pay a lower % or nothing once the deductible has been met.
If I get health insurance on my own as an individual my choices are limited by the number of ins co that do not cover my set of “pre-exisiting” conditions and those that do, or will cover me but not treatment of those conditions. Individual coverage will be more $$ than group because there is no “pool” of healthy (read-not using the system) members. I would be subject to a physical health exam and likely an investigation as would my dependents that I wish to have covered with me.
Insurance companies via contracts dictate to my doctors the services I may be provided. If I wish to do something unapproved it likely will be paid by me @100%.
I could go on and on but I hope this explains a little of what we in the USA deal with to have health insurance.
I can’t comment on how they enforce this, but I’d be willing to bet that if you checked the “non-smoker” box, then had something go wrong with you related to smoking they would use that to rescind your insurance and/or not pay for the smoking-related illness.
Best to be truthful on health insurance forms. You never know when you might need the insurance, and it’s pretty well recognized that the insurance companies can and will do anything they can to avoid paying for expensive treatments.
right now my company is on the honor system, but why even go there. too much risk of something bad happening regarding health because of that and don’t want to be screwed because I was cheap. Its “only” an extra $50/mth. He’s gonna try nicorette (sp?) again, so fingers crossed.
I live in NC and am a state employee, so I can tell you a little about this.
The state has hired a contractor to go out and do random testing at state offices starting next year. They will take saliva samples, and those will be tested for a byproduct of niotine. If you are found to be a smoker, you’ll be put on the state plan with the highest deductibles/copays if you aren’t already on it.
Also, if you have a BMI of 40 or over, off you’ll go to that plan as well. The following year the BMI requirement will drop to 35.
You can get exemptions if you can prove that you are actively involved in a smoking cessation or weight loss program.
There’s been some grumbling about this, but I expect when those teams of testers actually start showing up in offices, that’s when the real shit will start hitting the fan.
I don’t understand. What are you paying $10.80 a month for? I pay about $700 a year on my Quebec IT because of my income, plus about $550 for drug insurance. But that doesn’t begin to pay the cost. The member who represented me about five years ago and happened to be Minister of Health told me that 45% of Quebec’s budget goes to medical care. All those doctor’s visits, my pacemaker, etc. are not cheap. In addition I pay about $1600 a year to my former employer for complementary insurance for my wife and me. That covers things like allowing me to get blood tests (which I do every six weeks) at my family doctor’s instead of waiting at the hospital, chiropractic care, physical therapy I once required, and the like. Then there’s dental insurance, another $1000 or so for the two of us.
But the big thing is that that is all. Now that I am 72 I am collecting all those services I paid for but barely used over the years.
Even if your taxes aren’t making up a significant amount, somebody is paying for the difference, because I assure you you’re using more than $10 worth of healthcare a month.
In the states, sometimes you fall under a government program that pays for part or all of it, sometimes your employer pays for part or all of it, and sometimes you pay for it out of pocket. And, fundamentally, medical care is expensive. Doctors and nurses are expensive, medicine is expensive (to develop), hospitals are expensive. And, particularly, life-saving and life-extending treatments tend to be very expensive, both because they’re on the edge of medical science and because they can be. The utility of money after you’re dead is pretty low, so people are willing to spend anything (or, more often, pay for insurance or vote for government programs that will spend anything) to live a bit longer.
There are arguments to be made about efficiency and profits and various signaling and incentive problems. Some of those arguments have merit and some don’t. But none of those will make the average health care cost for a person be $10.