New cars come without spare tire? WTF?!

Should have got the GT, dude. I could fit my bicycle in the back.

Mine have had (and has) a better sunroof. :cool: :stuck_out_tongue:

Yes, you could drive the car even on four flats. Why would you think otherwise. They’re not called Run Flats because only one can go flat!

Run Flat Tires are not new. Corvettes have had them since 1997 and they are standard on many cars and SUVs. I believe that the whole BMW line up has them (hence the Mini having them since Mini is a BMW brand).

There is a lot of disinformation regarding their whether or not they can be repaired. So long as the puncture is not in the sidewall and they have not been run at 0 psi for an extended period, you can get them fixed. Problem is finding someone to do it since most tire places will want to sell you a new one at high dollars and baulk at the liability issue - they have no knowledge of how far you have driven them flat.

My experience with them is good. I have never had one go down completely, the car alerts me to a tire with low air pressure and I have plugged two of them on my wife’s car with no problems.

This is a good thing because the ones on the back cost way north of $400 each.

I would never buy a new car without a spare (or tires you could drive on flat) and I’ll have to start checking rentals. Yep, flats are really rare, but I’ll happily make the trade off to haul around a spare rather than have to deal with a flat and hostage to someone coming to bring me a new tire.

Oh, a B, eh? Taking up valuable roadspace with your huge, hoarking vehicle! My midget trunk has just barely enough space for the tools and spare parts necessary to enjoy a nice sunday drive, and that’s about it. :stuck_out_tongue:

I haven’t had to change a flat (knock on wood) in two cars, 200K miles & 16 years. I have had to use “fix-a-flat” stuff once or twice.

Now, sure if I was going offroading, then I’d want a full-sized spare. Otherwise, all it does it take up trunk room, weigh the car down, and cost me extra $$.

This frightens me. I have an 03 WRX and I’ve used the spare three times.

And that’s offset somewhat by the air pump.

What bullshit.

My previous car (a Mazda RX-8) came with an air compressor and some kind of goop that you pump into the tyre to seal a hole. No spare.

Two thoughts:

  1. If GM is not putting spares in base-model cars, there is a very good economical reason, at least in GM’s estimation (they could be wrong, see, e.g.: Pinto). But they didn’t just wake up one day and go: “Hey, what the hell, let’s make cars without spare tires for kicks and giggles!”

  2. I’ve had multiple instances of need for a spare. Had one just the other day: swerved to miss something in the road and caught the edge of a ripped up curb, which ripped out the sidewall of the tire for about 5". Needless to say, a run-flat wasn’t going to matter in that case. I, personally, would not want a car with no spare tire. I cannot IMAGINE renting such a car. Make sure that Enterprise knows you are upset at that situation, and that it wasn’t disclosed to you when you signed the contract for the car!

The other Grand Prix models come with a spare, it’s only the GXP that doesn’t. Since it is the high performance model of that car, and it has different sized tires/wheels (the other models have the same tires front/back) then I suspect the issue lies there.

It’s the most expensive model, so saving $50 on a tire is unlikely to be the problem. Weight could certainly be an issue for performance reasons. The differing tire sizes could be the reason as well, since I know that reason has been used on other cars (but Johnny L.A.'s Porsche is a counter arguement).

Time to call Pontiac?

Sure. But how much does it really take for GM to put a spare, even a small one in a car? And instead supply a pump.

$20? $50? I would not buy a car that did not come with and had the tools (lousy as they are) to fix a flat.

Yes, in GM’s estimation it will save them money. Not many people will think to ask if a new car comes with a spare tire.

My Pathfinder came with a first aid kit 'fer crying out loud. I thought it was a bit cheesy at first, and I’m sure I paid for it, but what a good idea. It’s actually a pretty good kit and I have used it (besides bandages it has antibiotic ointment, tweezers, tape, scissors, magnifying glass, and even a Mylar ‘space’ blanket). Need a bandage? Oh, I have one in my car. And they designed a good place to put it.

Grumble. People are becoming less mechanically inclined with every passing hour, I know. But really.

I see your point. And tire tech has come a long way. Still the last time I had to change a tire, I was glad I had a spare, or it would have been a very, very long walk.

As far as the extra weight and CAFÉ standards, it would seem that they are trying to get blood out of a turnip.

Rick would you buy a car that didn’t have a spare tire as standard equipment?

Before you get your knicker is a twist over what GM is doing, the entire industry is doing the same thing. in this thread alone we have the following car makers not putting spare into cars:

GM
Volvo
Mazda
Mini Cooper

In addition I can tell you for a fact that some other Ford, Chrysler, BMW, Nissan, and Porsche models don’t have spares. I suspect that most other car makers also don’t have spares on some models, but I don’t know that for a fact.

When you factor in the cost of the pump and goop that is supplied in lieu of a spare, I doubt very much if there is much if any cost advantage for the car maker in leaving out the spare. The advantage comes in packaging (they don’t have to find a spot to mount the spare), and fuel mileage (less weight is good).
Don’t underestimate the importance of the packaging part of this. Take for example the Volvo C70 with the roof folded there is enough room in the trunk under the roof for a weeks groceries or a couple of small suitcases for a weekend trip. However if you put a spare tire there, you would only have enough room for 2 sandwiches and a bikini. Compare and contrast the reactions of a prospective buyer when they see the difference in trunk sizes. What would be the effect on sales of this car if it came with a spare?
As far as gas mileage goes, the Volvo S80 V8 does not come with a spare. There is plenty of room for one, but it was deleted because of weight concerns. The car was going to get hit with a gas guzzler tax ($550 IIRC) due to poor mileage. The spare went bye bye along with a few other items, and the fuel mileage increased to the point where there is no more tax.
Also with the advent of Tire Pressure Monitoring Systems (TPMS) on new cars, there is a higher likely hood that the car owner will keep their tires properly inflated, which will decrease tire failures.

DSYoungEsq Actually a run flat tire would have preformed just fine in the situation you had.

ETA on preview: enipla I have driven lots of miles on both of the Volvos listed above that do not have spare tires. If I had the wallet to afford one, I would buy and very happily drive either one of those vehicles. Unfortunately when I retired and actually had to write a check for a car (damn that sucks after driving free cars for 15 years) my wallet could not handle the hit.

Well and good Rick.

What it comes down to is a consumers choice. And also where you live and what you need your vehicle to do for you.

Including an air pump instead, may be a good idea. And with the TPMS (amazing what a little RFID chip can do isn’t it), and better tire technology, people are less likely to have a flat and get stranded.

The link to the Volvo convertible pretty much shows that there would be very little room in the trunk. I suspect the same from the Mini-Cooper. Not sure of the Mazda.

And as far as packaging the spare, I understand. They take up room. Lots of it for a full size.

The Grand Prix rental (from the OP) is a mid-size. I suspect that those that are interested in buying a GP would not even consider that it does not come with a spare. It’s a sporty sort of family car. That bugs me a bit. But, perhaps the spare is not a something that is necessary.

And I suspect that a rental company would NOT want your average driver to change the tire. It’s a bit sad. But this is where we are now. That bugs me. No spare tire? No problem.

It seems that many people believe that rescue is only a cell phone call away. It doesn’t always work that way.

Heh.

Yeah. Get off my lawn. And I’m only 47.

Doug

Well, at least “temporary fix” solutions might prevent one problem I saw played out in the old days when spare tires were universal, and flats more common:

Driver gets flat tire. Puts on spare. What with one thing or another, doesn’t get around to fixing flat tire and forgets they are running on the spare. Driver gets another flat tire a few months later. Remembers “spare” is flat. Is SOL.

These days, “run flats” or a temporary patch plus a compressor might actually be a better idea for most people. The consumer rejected the “toy spare” idea, which was another attempt to save space.

Most Grand Prix come with a spare. Only the GXP version doesn’t have the spare, the sporty version. It’s not even an option, which leads me to believe it has to do with the different size tires front/back.

Another data point of the “sporty” version of a car coming without a spare: BMW M Roadster came with a compressor and a tank of goop (the tank of goop is actually built into the bottom of the compressor, and you can either use the compressor by itself or route the hose through the goop tank to seal a minor flat). I’m led to believe the corresponding “normal” Z3’s had spares, although I’ve never actually checked.

Hey, the old Subaru 1400/1600/1800 GL/DLs didn’t even put it in the trunk; they stuck it right on top of the engine. It was always a riot to see someone open up the bonnet and boggle at the tire sitting aft of the air filter. (Owing to a large, very accessible engine bay, the flat-4 engine configuration, and transverse mounting let it lay very low in the bay, which also improved handling characteristics. Except for a tendency to rust out at the slighted provocation, they were great cars.)

Actually, given the wide availability of repair/tow services, the pressure to reduce weight, the prevelence of cellular communications, and increase passenger/cargo space, and the current litigative atmosphere, I’m surprise carmakers even include a spare tire and tools these days. Automakers have been been sued many times for accidents resulting to using compact jacks, and while most of these accidents are operator-caused, having changed tires on the Chevy Corsica and Jeep Liberty I have to wonder what passes through the minds of engineers as what passes for safe equipment when it comes to jacks and tools. (The stamped metal spanner that came with the Corsica was beyond a joke; I found that if you put enough force on it to actually turn the nut, it would spread out and pop off, usually flinging itself in the general direction of your left eye.) And the percentage of drivers who have more than a rudimentary clue as how to correctly and safely change a tire dwindles, making it a all but useless. It’s not as if “spare tire” is a decision-breaking option; it’s just a cost for the manufacturer that is also a potential liability. If I were designing a new passenger car, I’d probably eschew the spare tire, too.

I’d definitely want a spare (or two) on a true off-road vehicle. If I’m driving in the waywayback where it would be inconvenient to call for a tow service in the case of an unpluggable tire damage, I’d want to carry a full-sized spare, not a dinky doughnut that’s not rated for highway speeds. In the plasticine civilization of the suburbs or urban environs, having a spare is a convenience that most people will never make use of. And rental car companies generally don’t want you changing tires anyway, and will either lock the spare in place or remove the tool kit from the car.

Stranger

I blew out a tire on my Nissan pickup once, about 15 miles off the road in the Mojave Desert. Pre-cell phones, and all we had was a doughnut spare. That doughnut not only handled the whole 15 miles of jeep track back to the Kelbaker Road, but it took us all the way into Barstow, where I finally got a new tire. Not bad for a “dinky doughnut.” :smiley:
Now, I carry a full-sized spare in the truck. Once is enough.

I’m not a fan of vehicles without full size spares. Thinking of the family cars…

My Mazda3 has a donut spare inside the vehicle but below the floor. The Suburban has a fullsize tire mounted below the vehicle (I really don’t like that idea, but it does clear up a lot of space in the back). The SSR doesn’t have one, and my mom ripped a chunk of sidewall out of it and had to go get new tires for it. I think my parents are planning on getting a spare that splits the difference between the front and back sizes. And the Toyota has a full size spare in the trunk, under the floor, which is currently flat.