Not a strawman, why not just label it what it is, prejudice.
But I will note that you are a bit touchy here, why allow yourself to do so and then bitch when people who have truly suffered oppression and assign a moral failing to their frustrations?
Why are you uniquely granted the right to be so much more fragile than your fellow citizen? Are you really surprised that they may be pissed off for being treated as Untermensch?
I’d buy that except for the fact that if this was the case, then they should’ve at least referenced the prior firing of Quinn Norton, and how they were changing their attitude considering a similar situation had happened again. Problem is they didn’t do that.
Thanks for the insight. But it was your comment that I found tedious, not Sarah Jeong’s. Does finding you annoying place me in opposition to all marginalized people?
Jeong has been quite clear that she feels her rhetoric was wrong. She stopped tweeting in the “fuck white people” style long before this was “exposed”, and has apologized sincerely. So far as I can discern, my view on the issue is exactly the same as Jeong’s: that’s this style of rhetoric is a mistake, because the impact is divisive; but that this mistake doesn’t define her, she’s not a racist, and that she deserves her place at the Times.
So are you failing to hear the perspective of this “Untermensch”?
I try my best, but thats the bitch about privilege, it is hard to see the extra barriers others face. I simply will never experience it and it will be an ongoing process my entire life. I do try to ask and understand though vs resorting to some asinine model minority myth.
But ya I get you were being fragile about my statement, once again are you surprised that people that have been screwed over because of no fault of their own are pissed?
Of course I’m not surprised. It’s one thing to try to empathize with people’s lived experience, it’s impossible for an old white fart like me to truly understand what it’s like to live as a black teenager in Detroit, or a young Korean woman. I’ll try my best, and listen and try to learn. But it’s quite another to patronize people. She’s a highly intelligent Harvard graduate. I would hope her brain functions rather better than mine. I’ll debate her ideas on their merits, and criticize them when I think they are wrong.
Yeah, but it’s still a racist generalisation, doesn’t take much to add ‘Some white men’
That’s understandable, but you’re doing no one any favours when you promote an ideal (Which was advocated by some white intellectuals) Of allowing one group to use overt racist generalisations over another due to a power dynamic, how is that progressive?
It’s a prejudiced generalization, it is hyperbolic to call it racist under non-naive understandings of the concepts.
I’m not promoting the ideal, you are by expecting groups that have very valid beefs with bullshit bigoted policies to be ideal before you are willing to overlook the fault for falling short.
It’s time to put on our big boy shorts, take some jabs and reach out and try to make our country equal for all. Yes we will take some heat in this case but it is condescending to say how these people should react to real, racist polices and public reactions.
So you accuse me of strawmanning by strawmanning yourself, brilliant. No one is asking POC to be ‘ideal’ the problem itself isn’t necessarily with Sarah Jeong, it’s the institution that she works for, who in their folly, have propagated a hypocritical stance to promote what they think is being fair, and when called out on it, have tried to blanket all criticism of their behaviour by associating any such criticism as being an alt right or conservative hit job.
Take my example, if they had treated her the same as they treated Quinn Norton, would there be an uproar? Or would people of said NYT are enacting an equitable standard for whoever makes such posts? The root of the ire of all this is the hypocrisy of their stance.
We have no right to say how these people should react, they aren’t pets and it is just as dehumanizing to tell them so.
They are people, and to call them ‘childish’ for not being polite for being screwed over is no difference then calling them a ‘boy’ or other determining ideas.
POTUS and other white men who still use real racist language mean we will get some flack still, and our recourse is to reach out to people and try to move forward and not to subjugate them by calling them children for being justifiably pissed.
Lots of people are better than the typical white racist coward but that is a demonstration of the great people we are missing out on due to this stupid social construct that we inherited. But my problem is that while I think your intent was good you were still treating them as inferiors.
The only thing us white men have to fear is a level playground, and thus when white men rant it is in an attempt to maintain this subjugation and thus less moral than someone who may need to vent because of real valid discrimination.
Us white cis men have no freaking business in telling these groups how they should react. If sub-groups start massive forced sterilization programs or start passing jim crow laws this could change but not under our current system.
This doesn’t mean that I am approving of the behavior, but that compassion is needed, not scolding or coddling.
Ah yes…because calling for her to be fired hurts the paper right? Even though she has tempered her views as documented earlier in the thread.
While noting:
You didn’t read down:
Please enlighten me on how these POC are performing forced sterilizations on white men or how the POTUS is using KKK dog whistles with KKK slogans like “America First”
Because I can show how POC are still suffering under our system. All you have to lose is your super special I’m better status that apparently is so scary as to cause an entire political movement to elect an idiot as President.
Except getting attacked or their business demolished in the “wrong” neighborhood for the color of their skin. And before you reflexively say that I do that too, no one asked me permission to profile anyone.