NYC was about to introduce congestion pricing in Manhattan below 59th St. next year. For some reason they need permission from the federal highway administration (why?). Which they had assumed would be automatic. But according to and article in the Times, they will not get approval.
The obvious, although unstated, reason is that New York did not vote for Trump. I cannot understand why a federal office has to approve a purely local action like this.
Because the federal gubmint helped pay for some of those roads. This also looks to be the first congestion tolling in the US, so they’re looking at it long & hard as it could set a precedent.
I’m not doubting you but I can’t find where it’s been rejected yet. I don’t have a NYT subscription so can’t get very far on their site.
There is congestion tolling in Austin on the 1 Loop; see here for pricing. They’re calling it “variable-priced tolling” rather than “congestion tolling” and it’s “express lanes” rather than “toll roads”, but it’s the same thing.
Those don’t appear to be the same thing. Those appear to be optional tolls for using the express lanes. NYC’s congestion pricing is like what London has. Any vehicle entering midtown (or Lower) Manhattan pays them, no matter what road you are on, an expressway or just a local avenue. If your vehicle goes below 59th St, you pay a toll. The only way to avoid the toll is to not have a vehicle below 59th St. I believe if you circle the block a few times looking for parking, you pay multiple tolls.
Why would you pay multiple tolls? In London, it’s a daily charge - doesn’t matter how many times you drive in or out. It also only operates 7am - 6pm.
The logistics of that make it impossible. Think of how much it would cost to set up.
It’s one thing to set up tolls on all streets that cross 59th Street (plus exits on the highways and on the tunnels (which already have tolls)). It’s another to put one on ever intersection.
I overstated when I said it would be rejected. But they expected approval would be routine. Then the orange menace denounced it and now they expect it will be rejected.
I’m pretty sure they’d just have cameras all over Lower Manhattan and decode the license plates and send bills to the registered owners.
There’s only around 10 southbound streets or roads at 59th Street. It wouldn’t cost that much to set up a camera system at those entry points, which is all you need, besides the existing toll systems at the bridges and tunnels. (Collection of tolls at NYC bridges - at least the ones I’ve used - is entirely by camera now; there are no toll booths.) You could also set it up to charge only once per day per car.
Ummm, why would you need one at every intersection? It’s only needed at about 10 SB Avenues & the four tunnels & thee (or four?) bridges that bring you in below 59th St.
This is the biggest, boondoggliest (is too a word) bullshit ever invented. They somehow managed to get (& pass) a vote on it w/o details, like how much the toll would be.
The zone would also not include the FDR drive (highway along the east side of Manhattan) north of the Brooklyn Bridge so require cameras at each exit into the zone. But with automated stations it would seem practical under the same system that now governs a few crossing into Manhattan, camera reads your plate and charges your EZ Pass or sends a bill to your house if you lack one. Although actually right now most river crossings into the zone either still have some manned toll booths (Holland/Lincoln Tunnels, GW Bridge is now cashless only on one approach route but not the other) or don’t charge a toll now (Brooklyn, Manhattan and Williamsburg Bridges).
A specific feature is that passenger cars would not be charged more than once a day.
On politics, DeBlasio (mayor), who is distinctly further left than Cuomo (governor), was originally opposed to this idea, favoring higher taxes instead, but later dropped his opposition. As for Cuomo’s claim (and friendly media articles amplifying it) that it’s being held up by Trump as a vendetta, I wouldn’t take that at 100% face value though wouldn’t entirely dismiss it either. There could be an element of electoral politicking on both sides.
What did you mean by saying circling around looking for parking would cost you multiple tolls? That would theoretically happen only if you repeatedly crossed 59th St. However, it would be easy to program the system to avoid that.
What did you mean by saying circling around looking for parking would cost you multiple tolls? That would theoretically happen only if you repeatedly crossed 59th St. However, it would be easy to program the system to avoid that.
Not sure where I saw it but I know I saw it. Maybe it was speculation as to what would happen because the bill was passed w/o any details as to what the tolls would be.
Also, is that once in a 24 hr period or once per day? The difference is if I first cross it at 11:59pm & then again 5 mins later do I get one charge or two?
Article here explains the process. When the state and the feds met last April, it was left undecided whether the project required a full environmental impact statement or could get by with a quicker assessment. No decision has yet issued from the feds. The state could have gone ahead with the longer process just to be conservative, but they were hoping for approval for the quicker approach, and they presumably didn’t expect to be stalled this long. Note that the feds do not have the final word here; even if the parties agree that a quick assessment is appropriate, outside parties can still sue to try to impose the longer process.
In other words, there was no factual basis for your remark.
Seems like you are going out of your way to imagine possible problems with the system because you don’t like it.
Are you opposed to the tolls in general? If not, what would you consider a reasonable price?
Is is common for legislation allowing for the collection of new tolls or fees to specify exactly what they would be?
Restrictions to restrict vehicles in midtown/downtown Manhattan have already been successfully done after 9-11. Not seeing any such logistical problems, actually it’s far easier today then back then. We also have the model in London which is working, also Germany has a system to restrict vehicles in high population areas based on emissions, which also works.
I don’t know about congestion pricing in NYC. It sounds ominous, though.
Toll roads (a rose by any other name…) for express lanes “to relieve congestion” in other parts of the US come to life by some pretty creative means. There’s a nasty word called “privatization,” which, IMHO, belongs in the same evil category as “contracting out.”
A corporation gets permission to construct lanes in the center of a freeway, and then for X number of years, the corporation can charge toll for vehicles using these express lanes. To make it even more twisted and devious, the toll charge can vary according to the time of day.
After X number of years, the corporation packs up its toll-charging business, and the lanes revert to complete State control.
At which time, they are probably a crumbling mess, which means the State has to fix them.
IMHO, it’s a hideous concept, and completely circumvents the entire “freeway” meaning.
“Congestion pricing” is probably something equally nefarious.
As far as traffic control, easing congestion, managing traffic flow, bah humbug.
It’s a way for somebody to make money.
~VOW
When the MassPike was built, they promised the toll booths would come down when the bonds were paid off.
The bonds were paid off in the 1980’s,
Still got toll gantrys. Who knows how much they are charging these days? (At least every-bodies in-laws had to find other jobs…)