[QUOTE=Baldwin]
Not mandatory, but a reasonable response. Simply “noticing” body language and considering a likely emotion behind it is a far cry from ascribing the kind of thoughts and motives that the OP seems to be able to sense.
[/QUOTE]
This report is brought to you by “someone who has never lived in Japan”.
Now, I have a question for anyone who has lived in Japan - I know a white Canadian guy who has lived there, who has a Japanese wife (I think), and he says he has experienced very little prejudice against foreigners there. I need the Straight Dope on this - is there or isn’t there an extreme amount of prejudice against foreigners in Japan?
[QUOTE=BMalion]
Thank you for saying that, I was starting to feel bit miffed.
[/QUOTE]
Seconded. Apology accepted. Although I just about have the scurvy under control.
[QUOTE=featherlou]
Now, I have a question for anyone who has lived in Japan - I know a white Canadian guy who has lived there, who has a Japanese wife (I think), and he says he has experienced very little prejudice against foreigners there. I need the Straight Dope on this - is there or isn’t there an extreme amount of prejudice against foreigners in Japan?
[/QUOTE]
There is a lot of prejudice but it’s usually not readily visible. It is true that Japanese are, as a people, and if you can stand broad generalizations, one of the most polite peoples in the world. This is a surface (tatemae) gesture only though.
So if you live here for a few years, you may not even notice, apart from a few isolated cases. Live here for longer, attempt to integrate into society and live a normal life, with credit cards, insurance, start a business, hire a car, book into a hotel, go to a club after work - you will start to see more than what is on the surface.
Here’s a translation from oral testimony given in a recent anti-discrimination court case in Japan (that ended ambiguously) There is still no anti racial discrimination laws that protect foreigners in Japan.
Mr Komoda: Concretely, what sort of problems were there with foreigners at Green Sauna?
Mr Kobayashi: First, I experienced a sort of overpowering feeling whenever I was in the room with foreigners, not to mention a powerful body odor coming from them. I don’t know whether it was a sweat from the heat or a cold sweat, but I remember I was sweating whenever they were around.
[QUOTE=lobstermobster]
Seconded. Apology accepted. Although I just about have the scurvy under control.
[/QUOTE]
Go suck an orange!
[sub]It’ll help with your scurvy.[/sub]
[QUOTE=featherlou]
Now, I have a question for anyone who has lived in Japan - I know a white Canadian guy who has lived there, who has a Japanese wife (I think), and he says he has experienced very little prejudice against foreigners there. I need the Straight Dope on this - is there or isn’t there an extreme amount of prejudice against foreigners in Japan?
[/QUOTE]
Also, I think a lot depends on your mindset too. People who come here with the mindset of “I’m a funny looking foreigner in a strange land, and I’m just here to kill a few years before I start my life” have a very different experience from others who just want to be treated like everyone else.
If you want to read a bit about the treatement of some educators at some Japanese universities, I suggest reading the PALE archives.
Not all universities are like these of course, but reading the experiences of these people is enough to make you realise something is wrong.
It’s not all doom and gloom though! A recent survey shows that almost 60% of Japanese people think that foreigners in Japan should have the same basic human rights protected as Japanese people do. That’s some progress from earlier surveys. Yay!
I’ll stop spamming the board now, unless someone has some questions for me.
[QUOTE=Tabula Rasa]
[QUOTE=Duke of Rat]
It’s situations like that in the OP that make me wish I could fart on demand.
[/QUOTE]
You’re just not focusing properly. It’s like Luke trying to lift the rock during his Yoda lessons.
[/QUOTE]
If you can levitate yourself using a force from within, but not THE force, you just might be a redneck Jedi.
[QUOTE=Boyo Jim]
All this for a glare? Not even a word exchanged?
Talk about kabuki theater!
[/QUOTE]
If only it were just a single glare, then I wouldn’t have thought much of it, let alone let it bother me, but from the time my wife, the Lady in Red ,first sits down until we get through the commercials and previews, some 20-odd minutes (which should be a Pitting in and of itself) this “lady” keeps a nonstop, intentionally obvious barrage of broadcasting exaggerated expressions of disgust; including all the actions in the OP (although I admit taking poetic license in that she seems more like a cat person – while I would love to chainsaw a yippy dog, even I wouldn’t do that to a cat, it ruins the meat) and more.
When a woman slowly looks your wife up and down, stares at her t-shit for a few seconds, widens her eyes briefly while pursing her lips and then with a shutter of her shoulders and several quick shakes of her head – as if she had just witnesses something so terribly wrong that it would cause nightmares – she turns and whispers a comment to her friend, glances back and then resumes the comments, does it really take a clairvoyant to realize she’s unhappy with us?
For the last five minutes before the movie, she held her hand up to her face, blocking any possibility of her eyes wandering over to us in the semi-dark.
We did nothing, absolutely nothing, to bring on this level of contempt and scorn. I would have said something, but for my wife staring daggers at me when I was ready to make a comment. It’s just fucking rude, and there’s no possible excuse to keep it up for so long. If she was unhappy with up for whatever fucking reason she had, she could simply have looked away from us and talked to her friend.
If she had a problem with us sitting next to us, then she could have moved. It was assigned seating, so I wasn’t going to move, especially in light of her obnoxious behavior.
While she was throwing this tizzy fit, I kept trying to think of reasons which Miss Manners would find an appropriate basis for that obviously rudeness. For example, if you were in a social gathering and someone who had splattered your best china with your dog’s blood, then staring at him until he, or perhaps her, – let’s make this an equal-opportunity lunacy – feels uncomfortable would likely pass muster.
As some-one who has not lived in Japan for more than a few months at a time, but who has studied Japanese culture extensively and broached the subject of gaijin (foreigner) discrimation numerous times, I wholeheartedly endorse Isamu’s contributions to the thread. Being a tourist is fine, but trying to gain full, equal acceptance into life in Japan can be a daunting task.
Here is a satirical link that has a fair chunk of truth in it actually… No Gaijin Allowed.
[QUOTE=Autolycus]
As some-one who has not lived in Japan for more than a few months at a time, but who has studied Japanese culture extensively and broached the subject of gaijin (foreigner) discrimation numerous times, I wholeheartedly endorse Isamu’s contributions to the thread. Being a tourist is fine, but trying to gain full, equal acceptance into life in Japan can be a daunting task.
Here is a satirical link that has a fair chunk of truth in it actually… No Gaijin Allowed.
[/QUOTE]
Wait a second… That’s not even slightly hilarious!
What the fuck?
[QUOTE=dnooman]
Wait a second… That’s not even slightly hilarious!
What the fuck?
[/QUOTE]
shrug I thought it was funny… 
[QUOTE=dnooman]
Wait a second… That’s not even slightly hilarious!
What the fuck?
[/QUOTE]
Have you been to or lived in Japan? It may take some personal experience to appreciate the humor.
Strange, I thought Uncyclopedia carried false information.
Anyway, I think I saw that woman on the train this morning. 50-ish, look of absolute disdainful revulsion toward everything as she got on the train. Eyebrows up, mouth pulled down, it looked like she’d had that expression tattooed on her face.
[QUOTE=Isamu]
shrug I thought it was funny…
[/QUOTE]
That was a failed attempt at humor on my part. I meant no offense to anyone.
[QUOTE=featherlou]
Now, I have a question for anyone who has lived in Japan - I know a white Canadian guy who has lived there, who has a Japanese wife (I think), and he says he has experienced very little prejudice against foreigners there. I need the Straight Dope on this - is there or isn’t there an extreme amount of prejudice against foreigners in Japan?
[/QUOTE]
Yes, no, maybe. Depends on a lot of things, including the gaijin in question. For me at least, there’s a strong perception that it’s out there, but I’ve been on the receiving end of very little of it.
[greatly over-simplifying] Start with a country that’s 99% homogeneous in terms of race, religion, language and culture, and in which the language, religion (Shinto, anyway) and much of the culture are not shared with any other country. Add to that a nationalized eduction system that focuses (rigidly so) on socialization with very little exposure to anything outside Japan (until recently, and even then not so much). What you get is 130 million people raised to believe that there is one, and only one, correct way of doing everything. Dealing with gaijin becomes then a question of “how do you handle someone who does everything wrong?”
Some folks are simply racist assholes. At the opposite end, some folks are eager to experience new and different things and think foreigners are really cool. In the middle are the majority who are going to have varying degrees of curiosity and nervousness around people who look, speak, think and act differently from everything that they (the Japanese) were taught was correct. And because encounters with foreigners aren’t an everyday experience, even in Tokyo (we’re only 1% of the population, and the majority of that are the ‘invisible’ Korean and Chinese residents), perceptions are heavily colored by media portrayals or the loud drunks they saw on the train way back when. A calm and friendly attitude, plus some basic language skills (or an attempt at such), will get a positive reaction from just about everyone. Awkward and personal questions toward foreigners are also pretty common, and I know of some who get offended by them. I maintain a sense of humor and figure every bit of education (for both sides) helps.
All of the open racism I’ve encountered has been from apartment realtors (hopefully Rico won’t warn me for saying that). Taxis have always stopped for me, restaurants have always given me a seat, and the police have never hassled me (although from what I hear, I’m the exception on that last one). When people have been prejudiced (in the most innocuous definition of the word) toward me, it’s usually manifested itself as quiet nervousness or over-solicitousness (yes I can read the menu, yes I can use chopsticks, yes I know what this sauce is, no I don’t need a fork, thank you). If I encounter them a second time, the reception is usually friendlier.
The law is a different matter entirely. There’s nothing in Japanese law that forbids discrimination against non-Japanese. Japan has, however, signed UN treaties outlawing discrimination, and courts here have ruled that these treaty agreements have the force of law within Japan. Enforcement is non-existent, however, and the only businesses that have been successfully called on it (in civil suits) are ones that have been unusually blatant about it (putting “No Foreigners” signs in the front window).
As an aside, Debito (from Isamu’s link) is a somewhat divisive figure within the gaijin community. Personally, I think he’s Al Sharpton without the charisma. His approach seems to be jumping into every conflict, making a lot of noise and confrontation, and starting lots of lawsuits to bring about sweeping legal reforms. I’m more interested in creating small-scale social change by being active in my local community, making all the friends I can, and generally trying to be an example of “let’s all get along”.
I’ve opened this thread to allow questions concerning Japan. Let’s move any general questions over there.
[QUOTE=Tabula Rasa]
You’re just not focusing properly. It’s like Luke trying to lift the rock during his Yoda lessons.
[/QUOTE]
Yeah, well, Luke wasn’t in danger of shitting his pants if he lost focus. That’s the difference between dropping a rock and dropping a loaf. There is no try, only doo-doo.
[QUOTE=Duke of Rat]
Yeah, well, Luke wasn’t in danger of shitting his pants if he lost focus. That’s the difference between dropping a rock and dropping a loaf. There is no try, only doo-doo. (bolding added)
[/QUOTE]
::sniffle:: That’s beautiful, man.*
May I use this for a sig? It resonates wonderfully with my line of work.
*Evidently an excess of Dope has had a deleterious effect on my brain.
[QUOTE=WhatHappenedNext?]
::sniffle:: That’s beautiful, man.*
May I use this for a sig? It resonates wonderfully with my line of work.
*Evidently an excess of Dope has had a deleterious effect on my brain.
[/QUOTE]
Be my guest, I’d be honored.