No one is going to hell.

For by Grace you are saved. Grace=love. We are supposedly God’s children. Would you send your child to hell? There are levels in heaven. I see it as sort of the boogyman story parents tell children.

See you in heaven.

I’ll be the one cleaning the toilet.

Um… No, it really doesn’t work that way. Hell (a.k.a. death) comes to those who do not do what is required of them to gain eternal life (see: Bible, The). I presume you are talking xtianity here?

Before you polish that scrub brush up…

New American Standard, btw. Anyway. That’s the full verse. Paul is telling the Ephesians you cannot simply work your way into heaven. God sent his son for that reason.

(Left in the other stuff for fun.)

Don’t see love in there.

Now, would I send my kid to hell? No. God judges us by our actions. If we are worthy of heaven, we get in. We get in by a combination of believing in God, asking Jesus to save us, believing in that, and trying to live by his guidelines.
We are human, and we will fail from time to time, but we are expect to do our best.

This one is open to debate. Jesus did say (John 14:2)
“In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you.”

Now, I’m not sure if he means “If you make it, you’ll have a place” or “we hand them out up there based on how well you did down there on earth.”

Rats! Asmodeus is One of the Good Guys, too! I was looking forward to a good argument between Satan and Asmodeus on who can go to Hell!! :smiley:

SZ…you seem to know your bible…just what are “Stars in your crown”?


                          Ephesians 2:8
                          For by grace you have been saved through faith; **and that not of yourselves, it is the
                          gift of God;**

That it is my friend…a gift.

You see God loves us all…but someone has to clean the grease pits.

My church looks upon hell as a bleak godless joyless place, where you stay until you truly repent all your sins (assuming you go in the 1st place). There might or might not be “punishments”, but if so, they are there for those who are not only personally evil, but led others into evil, such as Hitler.

Saint Zero is right – you are taking this out of context. (For by grace) you are saved by FAITH.

Living a life of Faith means putting your trust in God for your needs (food, clothing, and a place to sleep), rather than having trust in The Beast via money or power.

Now there is no reason in and of itself the God should decide to forgive our failings in the course of genuinely living a life of Faith – but he does, and this is grace. But, if you continue to rely on the Beast for your “salvation”, God’s grace does not extend to you.

Sorry for the inconvenience!

God’s grace will save you, but you have to accept him as lord and savior first. God loves us all, but he will judge us at judgement day.
I think I have the OP right… Hope I’m on track. It’s been a LONG time since debates at MC. :slight_smile:

Admittedly, Hell, Michigan is a small town, but to say that no one is going there is a little harsh, don’t you think? AFAIK, Paradise, Michigan isn’t all that great, either…

Hell’s Kitchen is one of the finest diners in the Midwest, however. And you must admit that both Hell and Paradise are an improvement over Purgatoire, Wyoming.

I can’t find it in the two I have here. Can you recall anything else about it?


Show me in that verse where it says I have to accept anything. Isn’t a gift given without strings?

A gift is freely given, true. But if you choose not to take that gift?

Hell, in one sense, is an utter separation from God. The ultimate estrangement, and the worst kind of loneliness. God doesn’t send you there… you send yourself.

Hell and Heaven aren’t necessarily places. They are states of the soul. You can be partly in heaven here on earth, just as you can be partly in hell. It is a rejection, or acceptance of grace, that determines this.

Unless of course you’re a Calvinist. Then it’s all predetermined anyways. =]

Do you accept the gift?

But you have to have faith. And don’t think this means everyone who calls Jesus Lord will see the Kingdom. You must keep Jesus’s teachings and be perfect as God is perfect for this is God’s will.

i’ve already made my reservations in hell, thank you very much. paid cash, the devil doesn’t take plastic. LOL!

Dal Timgar

I’d rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints

Billy Joel


Where in that verse does it say I have to do anything at all but accept the gift?

And the verse is not taken out of context.

Anyone wanhna talk about snake handling?

Er, for by grace you have been saved through faith.

Keep in mind the author is writing to an audience which already had faith, which is to say keeping the teachings of Jesus. So you are not only taking it out of context by getting rid of “through faith” but doubly so as you are pretending you are who the author is writing about.

you’re so vain, you probably think this song is about you as the song goes.

Vanity is the most deadly sin, Asmodeus.

So just what does the “and not of yourselves” mean? I interpret it to mean I don’t control it. The Lord has faith in us. I have it whether I like it or not.