Notary procedure

I refinanced my mortgage last week. When I got there the notary had already signed off and stamped the documents. He took my DL to make sure I was the right person. It’s not a big deal but I assume the notary is not supposed to sign before I show up? Also due to CV I signed everything in the parking lot which did not bother me. And after I signed I jumped a guy with a dead battery. :slight_smile:

The purpose of the notary is to have an independent verification of the identity of the person signing the documents. If you turned out to not be the person you claimed to be, the notary would have not released their signature pages, at least that is the hope of the title company.

The more interesting aspect of this story is you jumping guys in the parking lot. :wink:

The notary was not the lawyer. I guess he was a paralegal or an assistant.

The notary has to verify your identity and watch you sign the document. There’s nothing wrong if they sign and seal before that as long as they destroy the document if there’s a problem.

I’ve had notaries affix their seal before I signed things (though I was in their presence when they did).

He did not watch me sign since I was in the parking lot and he was inside.

You vouched that the signature was yours. He checked your ID. Does he really need to actually see you physically sign it?

As a former notary, I say yes, he must witness you signing the document. As Reality Chuck says, a notary must first determine 1) that you are the person who is signing, and 2) that they witnessed you actually sign the document. If that doesn’t happen, then the notary should withhold and destroy any signature page that was pre-certified for expediency’s sake.

Under the circumstances, I can understand the notary’s distaste for spending any more time with you face-to-face that he/she must. But the entire point is that if someone’s identity/signature is called into question, the notary can testify truthfully to the above 2 points.

I would never have done it the way your notary did.

For $600 I thought the lawyer should have at least said hello to me from 6 feet away and thanks for the business. I never saw him. The credit union picked him, not me. Won’t be using that lawyer again .

Also I had to sign a document that COVID 19 was not impacting my financial situation and that it would not in the future. I guess that might be standard now.

Someone I know had some documents notarized lately. The notary (bank officer) checked their ID, then watched them through the glass (or maybe the closed-circuit TV) at the drive-up window as they signed, then took the documents in, signed & stamped them, & returned them to the customer.

That seems like it would satisfy all the legal requirements: he verified the ID of the person, and then ‘witnessed’ them sign the documents, so he could testify to all that.

Great way to handle it.

I don’t know what state the OP is in- but NY has changed the procedures for notaries to allow notarization by a combination of video and fax so that the notary and signer don’t have to be in the same place.

I am in NC , don’t know if laws on notaries were changed here.

In Ohio, lawyers like me are automatically also notaries public, as long as we file our notary commission with a court somewhere in the state (I did so in the county in which lived at the time, but no longer do). I was trained that I should do nothing as a notary until the person was actually in my presence. After confirming his or her identity and seeing the person sign in my presence, I could then fill out the jurat, date and sign it and apply my seal. I would not have done what the notary in the OP did.

How on earth could you (or anybody else) guarantee that covid-19 would not impact your financial situation in the future?

Good point so that document probably is not legal .

As a current notary, I would not notarize a document unless I watch the person sign it after they are properly identified, or if they are personally known to me and acknowledge the signature. In my state…and probably elsewhere, there are some recent provisions for video notarization, but it’s a pain in the ass. I’m not doing it.

My guess is that the guarantee is not exactly that covid-19 would not impact his financial situation in the future but rather a statement that he doesn’t have knowledge of any future impact- for example, that he’s taking a 20% paycut/being laid off/taking early retirement to avoid a layoff effective 2 weeks after signing the documents.

You normally have to declare any future events that you already know about, or reasonably expect.

So that would be stuff like: “I haven’t lost my job yet, but I’ve been told that the business is shutting in 6 weeks.”

Agree with Oak and Elendil’s Heir - everything done in the presence of the individual swearing the document.

I’m a notary. It says right in the handbook that it is okay if a person that I either personally know or have checked identification states to me that the signature on the document is his and that he signed it. I don’t need to actually see him sign it.

This comes into play when I hear people saying that banks and other places won’t notarize powers of attorney or other “serious” legal documents. As a notary, all I am doing is verifying that a particular person signed a document. All that crap above the signature? I’m not making any statement about its validity or anything else simply by notarizing it.

You paid him $600 and he did the job that you wanted him to do. Why the complaint? You want to be pals now? Maybe have a couple beers together?

I’ll be cordial to someone if they are there, but I figure most people want to be in and out with the least amount of bullshit possible.