Then I wish he would just fucking say that rather than try to tease his argument out of ME.
You’re shifting the goal posts.
You rather foolishly tried to blame Arab and Muslim anti-Semitism on Zionism and now when confronted with anti-Semitism that dramatically predated Zionism you’re trying to pretend you said something different.
Yes, like I said, I read wikipedia.
WTF is the point of your questions. You method of argument is very very very tedious. If you have a point to make then just fucking make it.
Well, you should talk to Ibn, because he thinks you are utterly moronic.
Which countries and who said this, because the people who drafted UN Resolution 242 have explicitly said that isn’t the case.
Did you read my post where I say “MODERN anti-semitism” There is no goalpost shifting here, just careless reading on your part. Its ok, it happens to all of us.
I know anti-semitism existed before the aliyahs, they even had a term for christians and jews and separete rules that applied to them. But MODERN islamic anti-semitism
You throw around accusations of foolishness and mornicism a bit too easily when you don’t really understand what you are reading. You might want to ease off of that.
You want me to name names? No, most of the countries were South American and Asian. Resolution 242 seems consistent with their position.
Anti-semitism and xenophobia have not changed their definitions over time.
Me? You mean Jews? So this is about Jews?
I guess I could be offended, but then I remember that if it gets really bad and your attitude catches on and it becomes about Jews not about government and history, then I guess I can emigrate to Israel.
Provided it still exists.
And maybe my stepmother wouldn’t have been born in fucking HAIFA if her mother hadn’t been JEWISH IN POLAND when the Nazis invaded! Damn, maybe if Ruth had suffered in the ghetto like her mother, then the matter of one’s dual citizenship wouldn’t exist, either. :rolleyes: Freaking Jews.
Who are your secret friends in the State Department again?
…you think everyday Iraqis or Afghans would allow known Jewish troops on their soil? Are you fukkin nuts?
You seem to put me in the same category as the Israeli government. Do you do this for all Jews? You do know that American Jews are serving in Afghanistan, too, right? And that they don’t all declare religious status when serving in Muslim countries? And that the AJC, AIPAC, and synagogues all over America engage in ‘support the troops & families’ activities?
Also, have you ever heard of this thing called military intelligence or support? Christ. How many French and German troops are in Iraq?
And Israel being our nuke watchdog in the ME is incredibly beneficial. If they didn’t handle it, we’d have to. Bet you wish they’d succeeded in taking out Saddam , eh? 
Hey, how come America hasn’t been called in for war crimes re: Afghanistan or Iraq?
What is “mornicism”?
I’ve never accused anyone of it.
Yeah. It comes from hatred and irrational fear of Jews…that’s hard to realize?
I welcome discourse from intelligent individuals. Actually, I happen to think that well-educated and thoughtful people are extremely attractive and I apparently have a pension for being a rabid militant Zionist, nu?
I see this working in my favor.
Maybe Juden sind unerwünscht, lit. ‘Jews are unwanted’, can be translated into Arabic by Ibn for me…?
Hatred of Semitic Mormons.
Actually, it seems to be you that cannot imagine any alternative other than [ol][li]Giving the Palestinians (and Hamas and Hizbollah) everything they ask for, or [*]Genocide.[/ol]I find it odd as well as unfortunate that you don’t consider “negotiating in good faith and a willingness to compromise” even as a possibility. [/li]
Israel was willing to give up 95%. The Palestinians weren’t willing to give up 5%. Therefore, let’s blame Israel.
:rolleyes:
Regards,
Shodan
OMG!!!
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=7
If you really think you can defend that notion.
No, its not about Jews. Perhaps I use the word “you” too imprecisely. But I am amazed that every time I do, the assumption is is frequently that I am talking about Jews or being anti-semetic. WTF.
WTF does that have to do with the location of the nation of Israel? Once AGAIN someone brings up the holocaust and Nazis in a discussion about Israel when in THIS VERY FUCKING thread I get chewed out for claiming that people bring up Nazis and the Holocaust in Israel threads.
WTF are you talking about?
You think they wanted Americans there?
Yeah, and they’re Americans, not Israelis. I am asking what has ISRAEL done for us lately, not what have American Jews done for us lately.
What military intelligence or support has Israel been providing us that we send them billions of dollars and stand by them no matter what they do.
I’m not sure what that has to do with this discussion but we don’t get charged with war crimes because as John Mace might put it, who the heck is going to enforce against us.
Where did I say give them everything they ask for? I said stop settlement in Jerusalem as a precondition to negotiations. Giving them EVERYTHING they ask for would mean the dissolution of the state of Israel. WHERE did I say that. Put up or shut up dude cuz you have a penchant for using the word “everything” in a way that most people do not.
Perhaps it is my own lack of imagination but you seem to think that peace is not possible with Palestinians because you can never trust them. At that point what are your options? What if they get close to purchasing a nuke or three?
I’m sorry. Did the definition of ‘antisemitism’ change?
Everytime you talk about Israelis, you say “you” to me, and I don’t know if you are talking about Jews or Israelis because you switch back and forth.
No…you were hinting that if Jews had not settled in Israel, then the Palestinians wouldn’t be blowing shit up…and I said are you seriously going to blame that on Jews? You’re going to blame it on my mom that she was born in Haifa? She was only born there because someone else decided her family wasn’t welcome in Poland.
Blaming the Jews for the settlement of Israel and the hatred of Jews is just wrong.
The average Afghani or Iraqi was much more responsive. And they would not have tolerated the IDF.
You keep saying YOU! so I don’t know what you mean.
First; they don’t have our unequivocal support: check your history. Second, if you really want to know about the military relationship, go and Google. I’ve posted it several times. I’m tired. And grumpy.
When Israel attacks Hamas in Gaza, it’s a war crime. When we pummel Libya or the Taliban, it’s justified. Gimme a break.
The other day, Abbas said that after E. Jerusalem is his capital, he will not let “One single Israeli” step foot in it. He also said that not one Israeli could set foot in the West Bank.
But no worries, cause he also expects every Palestinian Arab in Israel to stay there – plus a few more million to move in.
Sounds about fair: No Jews in Judea. Muslims only.
Yes. As your own usage in this very thread illustrates, it now includes “failure to unquestioningly cheerlead everything Netanyahu does”.
The *reasons *don’t enter into it for you? Really? :dubious:
Nor do excluded middles or false equivalences or special pleading, to start the list of fallacies for which you’ve provided so many examples for us?
So you believe he means everything he says, at face value, is that it? Are there any other politicians who have such absolute credibility with you?
The source of the antisemitism changed. The nature of the antisemitism changed. Today’s anti-semitism seems to stem largely from zionism and the creation of the state of Israel.
I am almost never talking about Jews as Jews in these sort of debates.
Sorry, if I wasn’t being clear enough. I didn’t mean to hint at it. I meant to flat out say it. Palestinians wouldn’t be blowing shit up if the state of Israel had not been created.
So who forced Zionists to carve a country out of Palestine?
You have any arguments to back up the first half of that statement?
Sorry I’ll try to be more precise. But now that you know what I mean, do you have a response?
No of course its not unequivocal. Golda Meir refrained from first strike in 1973 because Israel would have lost our support. But what have they done to warrant our support after the end of the cold war. I understand their value during the cold war. What is their value to us now?
Where did I say it was justified? I said that noone has the ability to take us to task over it. And frankly I do believe there is a difference between pummelling the Taliban and The Libyan Qadafi forces on the one hand and engaging in what looks an awful like collective punishment on the other hand.
How is that responsive in any way to what you quoted?
You’re still dodging the question. Are you still continuing to argue that Israel froze settlemt building or do you now agree with me that they didn’t? Can you just answer the question please?
And exactly what do you think that I’m dodging? This is just another attempt to change the subject, isn’t it? Provide an actual link to something you think I’m dodging.
Don’t foget to answer the question you’ve been dodging for five or six posts now.
If W. JLEM is not a settlement, then Israel froze settlements.
Freezing of settlements was not a precondition until Obama made it so.
He won’t read it this time either.
Regards,
Shodan