Two nations fighting over a tiny strip of land on the Mediterranean? Isn’t that what the entire Israel/Palestine complex is?
How so? Can you envision decades more of the constant attacks and demonization by Arabic and Muslim countries? When Iran eventually gets the bomb, would Israel feel safe? Or are they hedging their bets against any Arab and Muslim country never getting nukes? Seems like it would be wiser to make peace now from a position of strength than later on when everyone around you is armed to the teeth
I disagree. Israel in a much weaker state has fought off stronger countries before, and probably will do so again. I think they are absolutely safe in the 1967 borders.
First, if the Palestinians, Syrians, and Lebanese all attack, you only really have to worry about Syria, that’s the only major power of the three. And they have no chance against Israel.
Second, I doubt Israel can be destroyed by a sustained effort by some of the countries bordering them, not now, not with Iran still nukeless.
Third, in the past, the countries around Israel were much more hostile and they STILL didn’t all team up and attack, so that’s not going to happen now. Iraq and Iran’s not going to team up to attack anybody, and Syria and Jordan’s not going to play buddies even to get rid of Israel, who serves as a nice wedge issue to divert attention away from their regimes’ own failings
Israel is safe save for the occasional terrorist rocket attack. Their existence is not threatened in any way. And yes, destruction is a high bar, but that’s only because the alternative is a continuing occupation. I find that to be unsustainable, not the equivalent of worrying about weak countries tossing nerf balls at your tanks
Is constant warfare going to do that? No. Even countries that have hated each other historically eventually made peace and mostly live side by side with minor issues now. Look at the Balkans. They couldn’t live in peace with madmen in charge and everybody squished into the same country. Wars were fought to separate them and keep them separate, and though they’re hardly like the US and Canada, nobody’s worried that WW3 is going to start in Serbia.
The US and England were one country, but we kicked them out. Even though we had another war later on, we’re better now that we’re not still claiming the same land like we used to. We needed to be separated.
The US and Mexico have fought wars. We basically annexed a bunch of states and told them to get lost. While relations between us aren’t completely rosy, nobody’s thinking a war’s just around the corner.
China and Japan hate each other, but once Japan went back to their own island after WW2, China’s not looking to start a war to get back at them. Neither is Japan creating legions of Gundams to reconquer Manchuria.
Hell, in almost every case I can think of, if 2 countries both claim an area, they’re going to keep claiming it until war breaks out. Once things have settled, however, the losing country will generally make a big stink about it but most realize that that price of another war isn’t worth it. We have plenty of disputed lands that move the world closer to another war. Kashmir has been a constant area of mistrust between Pakistan and India. Russia and Georgia just fought a mini-war over South Ossetia.
In almost every case I can think of, occupation forces or vaguely defined boundaries are bad for peace. If a country thinks they can get a piece of land, even if they can’t win a war over it, they’re going to keep claiming it. To not do so would be polical suicide for those in charge, they’d lose face, their country would lose face, so you have to keep claiming it. If Israel and Palestine were forced into 1967 borders, clearly defined and enforced, then there will be bad blood for a while but eventually they’d get over it. Both sides could claim they tried their best, but eventually both sides would realize they’d have to move on. That’s why they need to settle this as soon as possible instead of the perpetual stalemate that’s going on right now.
Considering how much the peopled in the Middle East, except some Turks, despised the Ottoman Empire that statement makes very little sense.
People in Dublin would be far more likely to see a return to being ruled by London.
So fucking what? How is that any different than being worried about a country not being “white” enough?
What did he say?? I don’t speak Hebrew but I wanna know…
I agree and disagree. You cannot ignore the historical persecution of Jews as a race/religion by comparing it to any other major group. Their spread and their longevity and the fact that many of the major religions dislike them have made them a target. While in principle, it does seem like a racist view, I would think that if anyone in the world deserved a state just for their race/religion for protection, it’s the Jews.
That said, they should just do what cafeteria Catholics do and amend their religion so that Jews are more easily created, and get rid of some of the weird rules that make people think they’re weirdos. Creating new Jews, even if not really devout ones, can only be a good thing for Israel
Then they wouldn’t be Jews. I signed up, I know. It’s not “Do you love Jesus, Son? Come on down!” It’s rather important to these guys. 
The devout guys believe G-d gave them these rules, and you can’t monkey with that.
Race and Religion are different.
A better analogy would be a nation of black people keeping their borders closed from a territory where most people were members of the KKK.
Is it really that Hamas and Al Qaeda are one and the same?
Netanyahu says that in Obama’s face. Why is it that lies like that float at that level?
Look, there are 300,000 settlers on the WB. There are 2.3 million Palestinians. Short of genocide or ethnic cleansing, the Israelis are never going to make the WB their own.
Do Israelis generally accept this or not?
That is a terrible thing to say. Have them alter their religion to be more accommodating so that they aren’t the subjects of antisemitism? Didn’t Christians try to persuade them to do that already?
Personally, I think the right wingers in Judaism do need to relax a little re: conversions, but not a damned precondition to be safe from terror!
wtfmate
They are both terrorist organizations, and there has been concern that AQ is now in Gaza. The State Dept. has already said so. That’s not a lie at all.
It’s close enough. Better for you guys to water down your religion than to have it disappear completely. And you can certainly monkey with god’s rules, because a lot of them make no sense
The danger of course is to regard those “settlers” as anything other than negligible. They have no rights. However the push for permissiveness and tolerance of the behavior is there. Tolerance because they are held as something less than normal people.
Can Obama hold the line against that view?
There is a “concern”. You don’t say, eh? S, it is not a lie? Well, then, carry on…
:rolleyes:
Cite where he said that Hamas and AQ are the exact same organization.
First… the united states president should never get to draw borders… thats what the U.N is for… second… if mexico got enough illegals over here… and demanded that we give texas back and started shooting rockets at san antonio… and the french president said we should go back to pre spanish american war borders… would we listen? also im pretty sure england occupied D.C. during the war of 1812… if the primer of china demanded that we go back to pre 1812 borders would we?.. look if isreal was just given the land in 67 by the un then maybe i could see… but the truth is they were attacked and out numberd by the tens of thousands… and won… they actully had alot more land then they do now but gave most of it back… bottom line… they won so they get the spoils. i mean… after the ottoman empire was broken up the mid east has beeen a hot spot of anti semitism, anti christainity, and even sunis and shities… it should be up to the people of isreal alone… no one else, also the Us should stay out of it unless geneocide or something like that is commited… if they wanna buy guns and tanks… since they are an ally then sure we could use the money. Also jews dont raid mosques and churchs like the muslims seem to be doing… yea… over in “free” egypt… the last six weeks there has been a jihad it seems agianst christians and churchs…
we have the most useless president ever… he wont win re-election
I do agree that Israel rightfully has the upper hand here and shouldn’t be punished for their wins, but we are a little more removed from 1812 than Israel is from 67. (:
I just wish that people would put it into context instead of spewing all of this rhetoric…and bad history lessons. sigh
edit: The UN can’t really draw borders.
Some folks would argue with both of those ideas.
I forget, is The Dome of the Rock built on top of the Temple Mount or vice versa?
Or have you decided there was a statute of limitations on occupiers?
Apparently only when politically prudent.
Israel defines Jewishness by race as much as by religion, and in neither case is maintaining a majority of any importance whatsoever. Who gives a shit if Israel isn’t majority Jewish in religion? I don’t see why everyone in the whole Palestinian region can’t just live as one state where race and religion are irrelevant. It works for America.