Are you from Los Angeles or something?
the Los Angeles, I believe.
tomndebb, do you agree with those who expressed the following
or do you oppose democracy?
Regards,
Shodan
Do you think that the wishes of those people, if expressed at the ballot box, should be discounted and overridden , Shodan?
I’ll gladly compare them with other countries in the region with a similar economic profile.
Oh, hey, surprise! Liberia and the Philippines and Armenia and Cyprus aren’t amazing paradises of freedom. Who’d have imagined?
In fact there have been several warnings. But thanks for the reminder.
Goodbye.
No, I don’t. But wanting your elected representatives to be people of faith is rather different from supporting the death penalty for apostasy.
Regards,
Shodan
As we consider Tentative Solutions to the Muslim Problem, there are many factors that need to be resolved, before we can make even the most modest proposal. For instance, at what age does a child become irreversibly indoctrinated into the evil and violence of Islam? By necessity, this will be a somewhat arbitrary distinction, as a child of three who has been thoroughly indoctrinated might be unsalvageable, but one who had a “moderate” upbringing may not be.
Or should it be four, or five? Let it be noted that previous applications of this sort of Solution made no distinctions at all, children simply lumped in with their elders. While this reflects the methodical simplicity and efficiency that they are widely known for, our modern and enlightened attitudes might not permit such a direct and obvious method.
Or perhaps take a leaf from their own history? Incorporate and absorb Islamic children into a paramilitary force that will raise them for useful and suitable roles as warriors. Christian soldiers, or perhaps Jesussaries? Let it be noted that this is largely an option for male children, other options for female children are obvious, but may well offend our delicate moral sensibilities.
True. But Robert163 wasn’t talking about Muslims who favor the death penalty for apostasy, he was aghast at the very idea that Muslims think favorably about their religion’s influence on their countries’ politics (according to him, for example, 95% of Indonesians are happy with the influence of Islam on Indonesia’s politics, but the number of Indonesians who say they favor the death penalty for apostasy is only 18% even among those who want to see shari’ah made the the law of the land).
Meaning that what Robert163 thinks is so damning for Islam is the exact same thing that most Christians in the US also say they want.
That’s a fair point, but there are a number of other Muslim countries where a majority are **not **saying the exact same thing that most Christians in the US say -
Robert163 can speak for himself, but I expect that he is more aghast at the ideas expressed in the OP.
But I see your point.
Regards,
Shodan
In other words so caught up in the algorithm of ideological gotcha cycles, the Regards has gotchaed Tomndeb about a subject that he was not responding to and was not a point made by the person tomndeb responded to, but importance is the ideological gotcha algorithmic operation…
No there is not, but there is a consensus:
No it is not, it is defined by Muslim hatemongers using the misogyny inherent in Islam.
I know that, for those of you raised to unquestionably regard Islam as a perfect religion, it is near impossible to see any criticism of Islamic orthodoxy as having arisen from a source other than ignorance or bigotry and hatred. However, there are many other reasons to be skeptical of the claims that the requirement or expectation that women cover themselves in the manner that exists in Muslim communities is not discriminatory and harmful.
Some of those reasons have been elaborated on here, by a Muslim woman.
Rather than spit out such hateful garbage concerning your presumptions about the motivations behind the criticisms, maybe try to address the concerns themselves.
Which is a serious problem. But looking at the rest of the survey shows that not even high percentages of Muslims who say they favor making shari’ah the law of the land correlates to supporting the death penalty for apostasy in a lot of places, making the causal connection between wanting shari’ah and wanting death for apostates false, to say nothing of the even falser causal connection between merely wanting Islam to have an influence in politics and wanting death for apostates.
If he was, then he wouldn’t have included Indonesia. Robert163, who believes that “Islam=bad”, merely looked for countries with high numbers of Muslims who think that the role Islam plays in the politics of their country to be a good thing, and assumed that it proved his pre-determined conclusion (more pro-Islam people=more bad, QED!). And I was pointing out the problems with that assumption of his.
For people who think we should “do something” about Islam, I propose that our modern-day, PC, liberal policies ARE doing something. It is making more than 1 billion Muslims not want to kill us.
No, in fact you give me a website… woooah. I am so impressed you googled around to one of the many websites asserting the proper way to do something. Why that Verily shows Consensus…
There is no “consensus” as the actual images of actual hidjabs in the real world.
But it is typical of the othering hate mongerers to promote such ideas in their attempt to promote the intracommunal hatreds and promote their underlying agendas.
This is a typical straw man of yours. of course you do not know anything of how I was raised (in fact secular and quite indifferent to the religion).
However, interacting with the hate mongers and the bigots has taught me an appreciation of the importance of refutation of the bile and the lies and the distortions promoted by the bigotted hate mongerers, as their discourse replicates again and again the same pattern of discourse, the same tropes as led to the Final solution…
Indeed the more I see of your type of discourse and the more I see of the robertnumbers discourse, the more I feel sympathy for the very religious and the burden they bear and the less sympathetic I feel to criticisms that I see more and more as mere excuses to cover bigotries.
I have also learned an appreciation for the desire of the jews for the Israel, and their distrust of the christian european powers since we see the transfer of the same kind of discourse to a new minority religion. The intolerance and the hatred is in the same structure.
And, as Ramira’s link shows, what that actually encompasses varies pretty widely.
I like how you’re arguing with an actual Muslima showing you images of other actual Muslimas wearing a wide array of different hijabs that they’re all wrong about hijab not having any agreed-upon single definition.
And if you don’t want to read an anonymous statement posted on Reddit, I recommend reading this (free) book published by Women Living Under Muslim Laws.
It is being worked on, and progress is being made.
1880’s swimwear. Beach today.
Ha ha. Agreed. Seriously, all gender specific statutes regarding dress should be ruled as unconstitutionally discriminatory, like yesterday.
I had the pleasure of going on a bicycle ride with a Muslim woman the first time she ever wore shorts in public. The joy she expressed was astounding (once we were on the trail in the woods, and away from even the remote possibility that someone from her community would see her, before then the shame and fear was overwhelming to her). The freedom to enjoy the pleasurable feeling of wind on one’s legs is something that most of us take for granted, and her level appreciation of this experience astounded me, and is something I will never forget.
Who, specifically, is implementing these policies?
And why is it, do you think, that a Muslim woman critical of hijab might feel less comfortable publicly expressing her opinion than those supporting the tradition?