This is exactly the same reasoning of people who carry a pistol. Why not be prepared? Why not be ready if you needed to use it? Who knows what situation might arise that would lead to you having to use it? Isn’t it better to have something and not need it than to need something and not have it?
The idea that a holstered pistol properly carried with the safety on, concealed, on the person of somebody, could somehow lead to a kid blowing his head off, seems totally unfounded.
Different culture and all, but my brother’s father in law, Joe, was a cop; he and his wife moved in with my brother and sister in law when Joe was diagnosed with ALS. Sometimes his friends would go visit directly after coming off duty, therefore carrying. The first thing they’d do after crossing the threshold is take the gun off and ask “where can I put it?”
From his wife’s response the first time it happened, my brother figured out this was standard etiquette among the cops and their families; she confirmed it. I’ve seen hunters do similar things.
If I was going to not go over this, it would be because I didn’t respect them, not because I’d rather stay home than go somewhere without my gun.
I think that if there was someone with a CC permit I didn’t trust not to endanger anyone when armed, I wouldn’t want them in my house anyway.
I realized this might come up when it was too late to edit: those visitors could not leave the gun in the car, as they didn’t have a car.
First, I was not the one that talked about kids blowing their heads off. Second, I agree that sometimes being prepared with a weapon is better than not.
You seemed to conveniently have glossed over my question though: (insert "what would be… for “describe to me” to put in in question form)
"Describe to me, a reasonable scenario in which you leave the house (from a family dinner), retrieve your weapon from the car, and engage a target. "
Do you head off to a family Thanksgiving with the mindset of “In case someone tries to kill me or my family, I’ll be prepared to kill said person first, if it has to be kept in my vehicle I will run to that vehicle, load and fire my weapon as needed” ?
Are there random murderers wandering the streets that the public isn’t aware of?
The notion that one needs to be able to drop another person dead in less than a second, at any given moment, should be cause for alarm.
Please, before you rebuke these comments, just address my initial statement: "Describe to me, a reasonable scenario in which you leave the house (from a family dinner), retrieve your weapon from the car, and engage a target. "
Keep in mind that the “weapon in the car” is kind of the on going sentiment in this thread. My apologies to the OP for any derailment.
I don’t know anything about the “weapon in the car.” It doesn’t matter. The weapon in the car is irrelevant. What is important is the concept of “Concealed Carry.” Someone who carries, carries everywhere because he believes that a threat can occur anywhere.
This is the very basis behind the concept of carrying a concealed pistol.
Ok, for the third and last time …
"Describe to me, a reasonable scenario in which you leave the house (from a family dinner), retrieve your weapon from the car, and engage a target. "
If you don’t know about the “weapon in the car” you haven’t been reading all the posts in the thread.
It would be more likely to need the gun on the drive home (car breaks down in a dangerous area perhaps) than to need it during the party.
You’ve created this outlandish scenario that is totally implausible and unrealistic and you’re asking me to come up with an answer for it? You’re the one who should explain what the deal is with this absurd hypothetical and why it’s being discussed. Nobody ever knows when they are going to need to pull out a gun. Of course there’s never going to be a situation where someone says, “excuse me, I’ve got to go to my car,” then gets his gun, and then shoots someone. This is why people carry guns on them. It’s the whole point of concealed carry, that you have access to your pistol all the time because you never know when you’re going to need it.
At this point it’s not for protection in the residence, it’s for when the gun owner leaves. Home invasions are less likely than to be accosted at random out on the street, hence a need for it then. Of course it’s still possible to NEED it. Cite. What if even half the adults had been armed in that scenario? It may not have ended as badly as it did. So see, it IS possible to need a CCW anywhere, but for every crazy Santa out there there’s millions and millions of homes that go unmolested every day.
dnooman you seem to be quite anti-gun when there’s no need for it. Many of the responses I’ve seen say CCW people would keep the firearm locked in the car if the homeowner doesn’t wish to have them around. Comments such as
are inflammatory. Guns are tools, just like anything else, although they have a specific purpose. The only time one should want to “drop another person dead in less than a second” is when one’s life is in jeopardy.
See replies # 2,3 and 4 in this thread. They say they’d leave the gun in the car out of courtesy, I fail to see the reason in even having it there in the first place if it’s inaccessible. You seem to agree.
I’m not anti gun, nor anti-CC, but I find it disturbing when people feel the need to be armed every second of every single day of their lives.
Show me a significant number of cases where “the good guy had the gun”. “You never know” is as good as always or never, not a real figure, and it means what you want it to. Find a stat that predicts the likelihood of you ever having to shoot someone for any legal reason, you’ll have to agree that that number is infinitesimal.
If there is no time when carrying can be forgone, do you live your life as if you may have to shoot someone or something every waking second of your life? If so, and that doesn’t seem overly paranoid to you, then I think we need to agree to disagree.
Easy scenario: I am going over to a friend’s house for dinner, directly from work. I carry at work. Do I a) not carry that day at all, or b) leave the weapon in the car at dinner?
Car wins.
Not being critical of any view, but from my perspective the whole scenario is strange. In Australia, no one carries guns so the concept doesn’t emerge.
(Note - there will be exceptions of course. In the bush people will carry rifles etc for protection and in some areas criminals will carry handguns. This is not the norm for a gathering).
I guess another question then is if it’s okay to ask a guest to leave a gun at home or off the property, is rude to fail to inform your host that you’re carrying a gun if they don’t know? Like just walking into someone’s house whom you don’t know all that well or are visiting for the first time with a gun strapped to your person, not telling them. I’d definitely feel really freaked out if I knew someone had a gun on them and they weren’t a policeman or something.
Please explain to me why you are making these assumptions. If I drive 6 hours to see my family for Thanksgiving, with multiple stops en route, then why must your hypothetical have any bearing on why I leave the gun in the car? I’m not bringing it because I might need it at your house, I’m bringing it because I might need it at another time.
I can’t. Within the constraints of the OP, the reason my “carry” is in my car is because the homeowner/my host doesn’t want it in their home.
As I indicated earlier, I don’t carry. But I also don’t disparage the motivations of those who do, as I don’t know their particular circumstances. Do they routinely travel to high-crime areas in the course of their employment/business? Do they, for whatever reason(s), routinely carry large sums of cash? Do they, like me, carry lots of readily portable tools and electronic diagnostics stuff in work vehicles?
Do they travel, on holidays, through and to different, unknown areas to visit friends or family?
All of these and more are, IMO, personal, legitimate reasons to carry.
And if I should happen to stop off at a friend’s or family member’s home along the way, and I know they do not want firearms in their home, I’m left with two options:
I can’t speak for others here (actually, I think I can to some degree; they’re a fairly sensible lot), but I seriously doubt most CC folks are envisioning an armed home invasion on T-Day, with Escape-and-Evade plans to make it to their vehicle, retrieve their carry, and engage hostiles.
If they are, God Help Them. I think they need a few more plates of food to slow them down a bit.
Most are just respecting the homeowner’s perogatives/rights.
The advice-seeker also mentions in her question that the man “displays antisocial behavior” and is know to carry at least one gun.
I think it’s OK to ask that he not bring it into the house. Leaving it in a locked car should be OK. If the host said she didn’t want it anywhere on the property, I’d park on the street.
Funny, to me ettiquette would say that a guest wouldn’t smoke inside unless they knew that the host was fine with it. The idea being that the host is a PERSON and their time spent cleaning the couch, walls etc. can’t be replaced, whereas smoking a cigarette is a momentary indulgence by the guest that could happen outside if the guest felt it was absolutely necessary.
I suppose an extremely polite host wouldn’t stop a guest so rude as to smoke inside without permission, but the host would be justified in considering the guest impolite, and would undoubtedly keep the rudeness in mind when considering whether to extend any further invitations.
But I suppose I have hopelessly old-fashioned notions of ettiquette, and nowadays it’s a ‘you’re not the boss of me!’ deal.
Well, why would you assume that anyone who carries a weapon ALWAYS carries it? Does everyone with a CCW carry their weapon absolutely every single waking moment of the day? Or do you think maybe some people just carry when they leave the house, or in certain circumstances, such as when travelling or doing business in places they feel the need to carry? Perhaps YOU even carry in the shower, I don’t know, but you’re going to have trouble convincing me every person out there with a CCW permit does too.
Stranger On A Train nailed it in one, with a perfect dismount, I think. I do not own a firearm but don’t mind them, BTW. If a guest felt the need to open carry inside my house I would find that to be mildly offensive in a number of ways, one of which is his bold statment that my house is not safe. If he felt the need after I had asked him not to, that would a potential threat to me and mine and he would never be inside my house again.
Concealed carry - Still rude if you’ve been asked not to, even if you use the weapon in your day job. But who would ask you not to carry if they never knew that you carrried in the first place?