Well, what do you suggest if every time Israel decides to give in to a demand, the Palestinians decide the need yet another concession? I don’t know any other figure of speech that sums that up as well as “moving the goal posts.”
Bait and switch? 
Yes, they did. The Ottoman Empire, which was the sovereign of the region for roughly 400 years, fell. In its place, the new sovereign powers decided that individual nation-states should be created from the wreckage. A list of the nations ‘carved up’ out of the Ottoman wreckage includes most of the recognizable major ME powers today.
Simply untrue.
The first Act of War was the Egyptian blockade against Israel. Israel, in turn, destroyed Egypt’s airforce while it was still on the ground. Jordan entered the fighting even after Israel asked them to refrain (and in the process, lost the West Bank and Jerusalem, which they’d rendered Judenrein). Syria had already been attacking Israelis from the vantage of the Golan before Israel responded militarily.
In the case of Syria and Jordan, yes so. In the case of Egypt, their attack was a military blockade rather than actual shooting.
If we invalidate the right of conquest, groups like Hamas lose their own claim to sovereignty over the land.
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If conquest is truly invalid, then the Arabs have no claim to the region since they invaded it to gain their control of it. But, of course, previous conquests are valid, as proved by the fact that virtually every nation in North, Central and South America still exist.
While we can say that no further possession via conquest will be allowed, we simply can’t discount it or the vast majority of modern nations would be abolished.
- As many nations were created around that time period, it’s disingenuous to claim that the reason they didn’t accept the also newly-created Palestinians was because they were part of “another state”.
- It especially doesn’t address how Jordanians became Palestinians overnight, and thus subject to the Apartheid laws that many Arab nations have.
- There also was never, in the history of humanity, a sovereign state of Palestine. At best, it was a region within the Roman or Ottoman empires. Even under the Ottoman Empire, it was ruled from the administrative capital of Damascus, not Jerusalem.
- Israel doesn’t take that position officially as they have agreed several times to a sovereign Palestinian state.
- Some current Palestinians were Egyptians, too. They weren’t all Jordanians .
You can define nationality as you will, but to claim that someone was a Jordanian on one day, and a Palestinian the next once the place they lived was conquered, is rather odd. No matter who agrees.
It is accurate to talk about creating a Palestinian people, or the created Palestinian people, much as we can talk about how Israel was created, but it is fictional to talk about a Palestinian state, or Palestinian citizens.
- In '48, a great many fled because their leaders told them to. While there were some strategically necessary expulsions, and some gratuitous ones, it certainly was neither the rule nor the
- Israel offered back the conquered '67 territories and was met with the Three Noes, no peace with Israel, no recognition of Israel’s right to exist, no negotiation with Israel.
- The Arab nations to which the Palestinians fled are primarily responsible for keeping them as refugees. As I’ve already said, many of the Arab nations have Apartheid laws making it illegal for Palestinians to live/work/immigrate there. Egypt, for example, before the Six Day War, Gaza’s population was kept under travel restrictions and curfews, by their Egyptian rulers. There are still refugee camps in Lebanon. I’ve already posted about how Lebanon recently shelled one of them.
Yes, there should be a negotiated peace with security, viable agricultural and water rights for both regions and freedom of movement. There should be an immediate and permanent settlement freeze on Israel’s side and real and substantive stop of genocidal incitement, terrorist activity and attempts to reform the so-called Lost Generation by the Palestinians. But no situation is helped by getting the facts wrong.
What Finn said.
And I am neither Jewish nor a Zionist. In fact, I’m an Atheist. Not a neo-con, either. This is just my view of what is right based on events in the region.
Like what? Should Jordan cede some territory? Cede it to whom?
:rolleyes:
I think, the Palestinians.
No, no, the Inuit.
Jordan would have the element of surprise, it’d be perfect, nobody would see it coming!
Yes, it certainly would startle the Inuit if Jordan ceded them territory, and no one would see it coming. 
ETA: A real power play, that.
ETAA: I wonder if it might work…
ETAAA: Be better if it were between the Palestinians and Israel.
No, seriously. What does Jordan have to “cough up” that could possibly help the situation? You know the Pals in the WB have about as much interest in relocating east of the river as King Abdullah has in extending his rule west of it.
So Inuit-land is out?
Nuh unh!
We’ve got a rally planned and everything.
There will be a drum circle.
Until they can breed the ever-elusive Desert Walrus.
I WANT one!
I’ll bring him home and pet him and stroke him and call him George.
That’s kinda making a false dichotomy and implying that Jordan is the whole of the Arab state, and pre-67 Israel was the whole of the Jewish one. In actual fact the “smaller one” you mention was itself subdivided between Jews and Arabs in the first place. Here’s a map of the original UN Partition Plan.
If everyone will stick to that with no fighting, AND I get an Elusive Desert Walrus, I’m willing to go with the UN Partition Plan.
Nooo! They be stealin’ my Lebanon!
Oh, shit, does that go into Lebanon and Syria and Egypt?
OK, somebody has to suck it up around here. I don’t care who it is, but somebody does. The Palestinians, or Lebanon, or Syria, or Egypt, or Jordan, or Israel, or some combination thereof.
Let’s start with some basics. Israel is there. Suck it up. They have at least the property they had in that 1947 map.
Jerusalem is an international city. It will be administered by the Swiss Guard, the same people who guard The Vatican.
Now, Arabs, work out the rest.
My walrus should wait at the London Zoo. Or maybe the Bronx Zoo. What’s the best habitat zoo in the world?
ETA: Maybe he should wait in the wild.
Somehow, some way, that’s got to be a fulfillment of End Times Prophecy.