I don’t see how this is responsive to my question. Monavis’s God seems to be quite a different gal from your necessary being (as opposed to Being). She expresses, to my ear, a pure and simple pantheism. This is a view that has great emotional appeal to me, but one that intellectually I cannot quite grasp.
Now I’m begining to grasp your question. That is interesting. Does pantheism necessicarily mean intelligence and purpose or can it be as arbitrary as nature and the universe sometime seem?
It’s a general term. Pan=all. Read into it what you will.
I asked because of your question.What additional information about “all that is” is conveyed by naming it “God”?
If I’m getting the drift of what Monavis is saying then God is the totality of all that is with direction and purpose.
Pantheism doesn’t seem to imply direction or purpose.
Monavis, is that close?
Yes you are close. I believe we are a part of what is called “God” by many. I see God in every thing. Our purpose to me is to live as well as we can, our future generations will be helped by the way we live. each person can add to the betterment of the world. The wars, the stealing, killings etc. are counter to the worlds betterment; when we respect each person and see the “God” in him or her, respect their right to a good life, and not expect them to be clones of our beings or thoughts we can have a peaceful world. There is a poem I will add that I think expresses this thought:
Little Johnny one note did the best he could;
He only had that one note, but sing it out he would.
Soon, other one notes began to sing along;
They turned Johnny’s one note into a lovely song.
Monavis
I do not know how to clarify it for you, but I would say one believes “In” God. So we are a part of what is called God; Like the ocean is water, we (if we were a drop of water and part of the ocean) would be in God.
Monavis
You know more than you know.
We believe “In” God. A refreshing view of an often used phrase.
I like the drop in the ocean analogy. I’ve also used the cells of the same body several times. We see ourseleves as seperate beings when we are really like cells in the same body. When we injure each other we injure ourselves as well.
In some ways I see it as a case of mistaken identity. We see our physical bodies as our prime reality and identity and believeing that we seperate ourselves from God and each other {in our perception} what is true is that we are spirit. That is our primary identity. We are all connected beyond anything we can do to change it. We don’t act, choose and live as if this is true, and well, just see how the world is.
I do not believe we can seperate ourselves from what I call God. We can think we are seperate, and try to act like we are, but that doesn’t mean it is true. The Psalmist say," Even if I go into Hell you are there". We can never completely go out of existance,our Atoms,etc. become a part of the universe,or (cosmos) if you prefer. Nothing really dies just changes. If you burn a paper it becomes carbon and the gases of which it was eons ago.
Monavis
I disagree Love is a property of Truth. Truth doesn’t need love to exist. What isn’t true is negated.
Monavis
I would like to add a post script,
I do not think the world is any worse than it was thousands of years ago. First, there are many, many, more people ,so the percentages are about the same. We now get news from all around the world,and good news doesn’t sell like bad,so as long as bad is still news we are in no worse shape. Things went on years ago that were just as bad as to day,If you study ancient history you will see what I mean, I might add that a lot of things were not told in the press that went on. We have come to like gossip for some reason and as long as it sells it will be published. Some things of course, have to be told, for the protection of people.
Monavis
As I’ve said before, I think Love and truth are connected in a way we can’t fathom.
I’m not sure you can have one without the other. Based on Liberal’s quote here’s a random thought.
Perhaps goodness is what we have with the connection of Love and Truth. Love is the Verb {action} of Goodness and Truth is the Noun. {state of being}
I would add; Love can only be love if it is in Truth, Truth needs nothing to exist,One can hate something and it can be the truth,but Love is not Love without truth.
I guess we just will concede,we disagree. To me Truth doesn’t need Love to exist be cause it must be true only if it exists in truth.
Monavis
Well, Some consider hate just an illusion. A part of duality that ceases to exist when we truly love. In that case it can’t be the truth.
One can love a person but hate it’s action’s. Love wants the best for another; a parent that loves a child that has commited a crime can still hate what the child did. Love always uplifts a person. The truth does too, I agree that sometimes we lie to protect the life of another, but it is not the truth, even though told for love and protection of another.
Monavis
If hate is an illusion that only exists in the world of duality {which is also an illusion} then it doesn’t matter what we think we hate, the person, the actions, or turnips. If we believe “In” God and
those seem to support the hate is an illusion theory. if this
is true, then hate must be an illusion, since in God there can be no hate. Either way, I’m sure we’ll have an opportunity to go over this in a future thread.
You really need to slow down. I didn’t say that love is a property of truth.
I missed a comma,I wasn’t infering that you implied love was a property of truth. My intention was that every thing must be in truth if it exists.
I find your replies most interesting, and believe you are( from what I can tell by your response) a thoughtful, and good person.
Monavis