I got distracted from the OP by the “jump in the air before a car hits you.” thing. Dealing with the aftermath is something that can be planned for.
Most self-defense experts will tell you that this is not only how you minimize the impact of an attack, it is how you nearly eliminate being attacked. People who are aware of their environment make poor targets.
I am not blaming the kids, though it may sound like I am. I am blaming the people who should’ve taught them the basics of reacting to an emergency of any sort. “Forewarned is forearmed,” and the gunfire they heard should’ve been the warning they needed to prevent anyone from entering that room, just as hearing the tornado siren should be the trigger that pushes people down to the basement. Just sitting there is rarely the best choice.
And it’s surprisingly common to be around when someone starts shooting. At a previous job a jealous husband came in and shot his wife and her boyfriend. We needed ID cards and a guard at the gate after that.
Well never mind then.
In Colorado after the Columbine shootings, all schools were asked to come up with contingency plans in case something like this were to happen again. Many schools came to the conclusion that the absolute best thing to do would be to barricade the doors with anything they could get, and load up on things to throw. A bag of baseballs isn’t such a bad idea. It is a low tech solution to the problem, but it may well be the best solution out there.
Unfortunately in the Va Tech case, college buildings are not the same as High School buildings there’s no “Main Office” where word can be sent out from over the loudspeakers warning the students to prepare. The police station (assuming the school is big enough to have one) could be miles away.
I want to remind everyone how hard it is to know what is really happening in a crisis when all you have is fragmentary and limited information. These kids and teachers were inhabiting a very familiar, very safe environment. Then they heard some brief strange noises – loud bangs (one student described the shots as sounding like a hammer), followed after a while by some alarmed voices and, even later, yelling. We, of course, know what these sounds represented. But could they have figured it out in time?
There’s a statistical principle built into our cognitive machinery that goes something like ‘I’m going to assume that what I’m perceiving is normal until I have compelling evidence otherwise’; it’s referred to as Bayes’ Theorem, and there’s a lot of evidence showing that this ‘assumption of normalcy’ basically dominates our decisions. I’m willing to bet that if any of us were sitting in one of those classrooms, we would spend a long time deciding whether these strange noises were something that merited action. We have a natural bias against believing in a crisis, basically because crises are rare and over-reacting is maladaptive.
As others have pointed out, one can improve their ability to discern and react to crises through training and exposure. But I say that there are a lot more important things for me to focus on in my brief stay on the planet. The consequence is that if I were trapped in a building with a crazed gunman, I’d probably be sitting there wondering what the hell was going when he stuffed the barrel in my face. The pleasure of thinking of my world as a pretty safe and pleasant place is worth it to me.
The kid I heard today said they realized they were gunshots fairly quickly and there were two minutes between when they first heard them and when Cho arrived at their room.
If there is anything to the “fight or flight response” the natural bias is to assume the worst. Our gentle environment has conditioned us to react otherwise.
I would say that there is no argument between enjoying the safe and pleasant norm and being aware of ones options if that were to change. I am not suggesting you become paranoid but there is a happy middle ground. After all, do you look both ways before crossing a street or is the thought that someone might run you down too big a downer to contemplate?
I’d bet lots of money that few of them realized what they were hearing at the time. It’s one thing to put the story together afterward, another to figure it out in real time.
You’ve made my point. These kids had learned the appropriate response to their envorimnent: assume the best until evidence otherwise is overwhelming.
We assume a level of vigilance that is appropriate for the environment. It’s appropriate to be concerned about being hit by a car when crossing a street. It’s simply inappropriate to prepare yourself mentally for the arrival of a crazed gunman when you’re in a college classroom (in the US, that is; I imagine the response would have been quite different in Baghdad…). I’d hate to see it any other way.
(p.s., I realize I’m a sensitive soul, but the casual cruelty of posters on this, and probably most, boards is a pretty big downer in its own right, though considering my posting stats maybe I just need more exposure to numb myself to it…)
One problem with this is that not everyone thought that what they heard was gunfire. As spazurek mentioned, one person interviewed thought they heard a hammer knocking. When I was at my university, that’s probably what I would have thought it was too.
It could be argued that people should react quickly, and blockade all entries to the room if they hear a sound like this. It will most likely turn out to be something innocent (like a hammer), but hey - “better safe than sorry”, right? :dubious:
If most people are sure that they heard gunfire (maybe they heard screaming, etc. that went along with it), then I completely agree with you. Unfortunately, that’s not always so clear in most cases.
LilShieste
I’m thinking not when they heard sounds, but at the point where it became evident that he has just shooting people one by one. I can’t imagine being in that situation. I wonder if I would sense the inevitability of it and charge or hope that I would be ignored in the carnage.
It seemed from reports early on that many people managed to survive by pretending to be dead- they didn’t save anyone else that way, but I think they’d have to be regarded as having made the right choice for themselves. If you charged, you probably died.
It’s all so mind-boggling. I can’t even really think about it constructively, in abstract, well after the fact and in no personal danger. I have to imagine that my thoughts in real time would be shall we say more muddled.
Agreed. I simply don’t assume the worst with every odd sound I hear. If I did, I’d never get anything done. The fact that something bad could happen doesn’t mean it’s likely.
That was what the person I heard said, too. However, she added that they realized otherwise quickly, what with all the screaming, that it wasn’t. Need I repeat that it was, by her estimate, two freaking minutes before Cho arrived? PLENTY of time to realize and react. One needn’t live a life on edge to be aware of ones surroundings and options.
It is even more rare for a school to be hit by a tornado than attacked by a crazed gunman but schools across the Midwest conduct disaster drills just for that possibility. Is this unnecessarily traumatic for the students or simple prudence?
It doesn’t need to be a question of assuming the worst. But at least being aware of one’s surroundings.
Situation: typical college classroom, 15 to 30 people present. “Pop pop pop” sounds are heard. We all just sit there assuming them to be innocuous? Or has no one present heard the word Columbine? Does no one say “Hey, anyone else hear that? What does it sound like to you?” No one thinks to go to the door and peek out, or listen more intently?
That isn’t “fight or flight”. That’s apathy toward one’s surroundings. Such is certainly fine if one’s surroundings are guaranteed to be completely safe. But it’s counter-evolutionary if, even just this once, rare as it may be, the situation is decidedly unsafe.
“Situational awareness” doesn’t require wasting one’s time and energy daydreaming about unlikely scenarios. It is simply the application of a graduated scale of evaluation to a particular situation. Crossing a busy road requires a different level of situational awareness than crossing a lonely country lane. Sitting in a college classroom requires a different situational awareness from a nighttime walk through that “bad part of town”.
But a level of awareness greater than zero, even a low level, might have moved some of those students to investigate, perhaps then to take some action to save themselves or others. This, IMHO, is what dropzone is suggesting.
Yep.
And “situational awareness” doesn’t detract from life’s enjoyment. If anything, it makes life MORE enjoyable because you see more of those interesting little things.
You assume no one did that. Why?
Also, remember that Columbine happened eight years ago. Most of the victims were still in elementary school when it happened.
I fully agree with the OP. But I have a problem with posts like yours, CannyDan. It is easy to be so glibly judgmental when you have the luxury of putting all the pieces together, from the comfort of a peaceful living room. I hear “pop pop pop” daily because there’s constant construction going on at my campus. The logical conclusion wouldn’t be “OMG GUNS!” but rather “Shit, they’re working on that wall again?” And I’m willing to bet that would be what most people would conclude, even those of us who remember Columbine.
I do not want to fixate too much on what the students did or did not do while the shooting was going on. Certainly there is a lot to debate there.
However, in the aftermath of a disaster or crime, people still maintain panic or inaction or simply do not know what to do even after immediate danger has passed.
Just think to yourself what you would do if your own femoral artery was hit. Would you make it out like Kevin Sterne? Or would you bleed to death before anyone could help you.
I’ve been thinking about this a bit lately. I’ve got a plan and this is it. First, I shit in my pants. Then I freeze in the most inopportune place, preventing more level headed people from making an escape.
Although this is what I expect to happen, I wouldn’t be surprised if I actually respond in a positive fashion that would mitigate disastrous results. We will see what will happen when the shit actually comes down. My experience to date indicates that I’m calmer than a lot of people when in comes to uncomfortable situations. I hope I have the balls to disarm a plane hijacker even though it means sacrificing my own life for the greater good of my fellow passengers. I won’t know until the time comes.
You don’t need to spend ‘lots of time’. It doesn’t take months to figure out ‘if someone was in a hall shooting, I’d tell people to help me pile desks against the door’. See how quick that was?
Exactly. I always check for exits - in hotels, bars, anyplace I’m not familiar with. Again, it takes very little time.
Pretty much everyone I heard interviewed said they thought it was more construction. Unless you’ve heard actual gunshots IRL, you won’t necessarily know how they’re supposed to sound. Many’s the time I’ve heard ‘pop pop’ and gone to the window, listened for sirens, watched news. It’s never been gunshots. And why go open the door? Chances are better the person might pass by if he doesn’t see someone peering at him.
That’s flight with nowhere to go.
I have heard literally thousands of gunshots in my IPSC days, hammering can be very similar depending on the materials and resistance offered/force used. In addition there are more than a few fastener guns that use a small .22 casing of gunpowder or ignited butane as a driving charge.