to start with most people who get hip replacements are the elderly which who fall under medicare. The vast majority in the middle already have insurance which leaves the remainder who are covered under the recent healthcare legislation.
That is a horribly disingenuous reply: we are discussing the current US system.
What about under the current system, a 50 year-old working poor person with no insurance?
They would have to sell their house, right?
Why can’t you just admit it?
pdts
You know that’s not a citeable request but you can google any city in America and look for them. You will likely find more MRI’s than hospitals because we have dedicated diagnostics facilities that serve specialists outside of the hospital.
My own city of Dayton oh shows 9 MRI locations which is more than the number of hospitals in the area and it doesn’t include the Children’s hospital.
If you move North of my city where the small community hospitals are you see more MRI’s than hospitals.
The current system covers 90% of the people in the country which is 90% more than is covered in Canada and the UK for people waiting for life saving heart-bypass treatments. Government health care doesn’t mean anything if you don’t get it in time. It’s an illusion.
In the United States we have primary care physicians and specialists just as you do in the UK. There is nothing different beyond the fact that you have to show an insurance card. Oh, yes, the difference is that you don’t have to wait 18 months to get something useful taken care of.
Are you going to answer the question or not? What about the 50 year old woman? Come on, you claimed that medicaid would pay, now it’s time to man up and admit that in many cases they won’t.
You are doing your side no favours.
pdts
Thanks, but I live in the US. There is something different: here the GP practice and the specialist and the hospital always seem to have to play a game of phone tag after losing details and insurance information and all that.
This seems to happen a lot less in the UK.
That you say that there is nothing else different indicates that you have never tried the UK system. Have you?
pdts
I did answer the question. The vast majority of people actually get the care which is different than the people in the UK waiting for care. Sorry if the reality of that hasn’t sunk in yet.
Why won’t you admit the extensive delays in the UK? You think time is on your side with a heartby-pass? You keep trying to drive home a geriatric disease that is already covered by medicare when in reality it’s something that is gets seriously delayed in the UK. It’s a small fraction of people under 65 who need it but aren’t covered in the US. The vast majority of people getting screwed are in the UK.
Wow, you have to deal with phone tag. Must be a relief to know you don’t have to deal with this while waiting over a year for medical relief.
Uh, many people (including me) have admitted that there are delays in the UK.
The delays are caused by strict medical rationing: urgent and emergency cases are constantly boosted to the top of the queue. The sorts of elective procedures that take months in the UK are the sorts of things that uninsured people in the US often don’t even have access to.
And to some extent, you pays your money, you takes your choice. Since the US spends twice as much on healthcare, per capita, as the UK, you should expect the US to do better somewhere: and that seems to be shorter waiting times for rich and middle-income patients. This I accept.
There is no doubt that if the UK doubled health spending, they could have this too. (Other european countries that spend more on health don’t have the same waiting issues).
You haven’t really explained the better health statistics in the UK, though: despite spending less on care, the UK population lives longer and has lower infant mortality.
So do you admit that the working poor 50 year-old woman who needs a hip replacement would likely have to sell her house? Yes or no? Come on, give me a one-word answer.
Also, have you ever used UK healthcare? Yes or no? Again, one word please.
pdts
Phone tag is just the symptom. The problem is disorganised and uncoordinated care.
Whenever I go to walmart to get my drugs (they are the only reasonably priced place) I always have to wait behind someone who is struggling to afford the variable and high drug prices, or whose insurance company is inexplicably refusing to pay, or whose doctor hasn’t returned a fax etc etc.
In the UK, you just walk in and pick up your drugs. In Wales, they are free. In England, people who can afford it pay about £8 per prescription.
pdts
No, I’ve never used the UK health system. I wouldn’t be willing to wait on it. As far as the better health statistics, I already cited they were bullshit when it comes down to actual care for such things as cancer and heart attacks. And my first post talked about the changes we’re making to close the gap so our problems have already been addressed. You’re still fighting delays. Yes, you’ve made progress and I hope it continues. but you will always be fighting the allocation of your own money rather than controlling it directly. As I pointed out earlier, your ability to circumvent it can lead to getting banned or removed from treatment.
As for the amount spent on health care in the UK I would like to point out that you spend almost half what the US spends on the military. For better or worse we have been carrying the lion’s share of the NATO umbrella followed by the UK. Canada spends half again as much. In all fairness, we should get out of the world-police business and let Europe re-emerge as the collective seat of democratic power.
I’m bumping this to give my personal experience. About a month ago I came down with symptoms consistent with Plantar Fasciitis. A quick phone call to NHS Direct and I was told what to do. Fast forward until now and the heel pain has gone but about a week ago I noticed that my feet and ankles were swelling. Recalling the advice from NHS Direct, I took Ibuprofen which failed to have any effect. So earlier this week I made an appointment to see the doctor. Next Wednesday. I’m sure American Dopers with insurance are throwing their hands up in horror at such a delay, but really, swollen ankles aren’t that serious a problem. And there are people with far more serious problems than mine. I can wait.
And if you’re fed up with waiting, you could always go to one of the NHS walk-in centres that Magiver doesn’t seem to think we have.
And I’d like to give my experience with the Danish healthcare.
January 11th, I got a shitload of blood in the toilet, I called my doctor and the same afternoon I was admitted to a hospital. The next day I got a gastroskopi and a sigmoidoscopy, they didn’t show any cause so I went home to wait a week for a colonoscopi. At that time they found a tumour in the upper colon. Late next week I got a CT-scanning and since no other tumours was found, I was operated February 8th, under a month after my shock in the bathroom. I am currently undergoing chemotherapy. It’s no fun but I certainly can’t complain about extensive waiting. AND I don’t have any hassle with insurance, it is my right to be treated in under 14 days after the diagnosis, if I have a lifethreatening disease.
This guarantee admittedly make the wait a lot longer for people with non-lifethreatening diseases. As far as I know you have to wait 8 weeks for an operation for varicose veins.